Rafter Riff, #4

by section214 on Mar 26, 2008 8:06 AM PDT in Old School Comment 45 comments

This is the first of an eight part series designed to determine if certain individuals should be honored with a retirement ceremony at ARCO Arena. Over the next several days we will cover the following individuals:

Chris Webber
Mike Bibby
Peja Stojakovic
Vlade Divac
Rick Adelman
Geoff Petrie
Gary Gerould
Peaches Napear

I honestly have little opinion on this matter (until we get to Peaches), so I'm counting on the impending threads to help me make up my mind.

Going in numerical order, we'll start with #4, Chris Webber. Poll below -

Poll

Retire Chris Webber's Number

Yes

126 votes

No

9 votes

135 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs | Comment 45 comments

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Comments

Abso-freaking-lutely

#4 must be retired. Hell, they should do it next month when the Warriors visit. Sell out one more game this season.

by Ziller on Mar 26, 2008 8:23 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Good idea

Even though I think that Vlade deserves first dibs on the jersey retirement, I wouldn't say "no" to Webber getting his uni raised to the rafters when the Warriors visit. As long as Vlade is up there soon.

by jacquetbg on Mar 26, 2008 8:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Divac, Webber and Gerould fo sho.

The others on this list were good but these three have been the face of the franchise either locally or nationally.

Divac is the European bridge to the NBA. I personally believe that his status as a Euro, humanitarian and player will lead to the HOF and we certainly don't want him going in a Laker.

Webber is one of the few legit stars the Kings have had. He has an outside shot at the Hall and the Kings would love to keep him and his big smile around the franchise for PR.

Gerould is a class act, he and Reynolds will both have their names retired to the ceiling much like the late great Kings in house P.A. announcer Fred Anderson. Fred was the voice of Arco for the first 15 to 16 years until he passed away from an extended illness.

Screw Napier. Peja will play more than half of his career elsewhere and Bibby was never the star of this team.

I'm not sure about Adelman.

StR- Where Pookey is long, Otis is short and Section brings down the house.

by jjham15 on Mar 26, 2008 9:01 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Reynolds

is in the rafters as the retired GM of the Monarchs. If they add all of his duties with the Kings they'll have to roll the banner up before each game - I think he's done everything except sell cotton candy.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Mar 26, 2008 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I voted No because

Are any of these guys hall of famers? Retiring a jersey is something special. Now I am not saying that it is a must for a player to be a HOFer for their jersey to be retired, but it is that special of a thing to have a number retired just like being in the hall of fame. Its like putting a face to a franchise. if you look at the rest of the professional sports franchises, most of their retired numbers are hall of famers. we already retired mitch richmond, who probably won't get in, as nice of a player as he was. if we retire any or all of the players listed above, we will have rafters full of retired numbers of players who weren't good enough to be in the hall.

www.myspace.com/cynemamusic.com

by Cynema the Band on Mar 26, 2008 9:38 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

If that's your criteria

then I doubt we'd ever retire one of our former player's jersey. How many HOF players did we have?

by kingme on Mar 26, 2008 12:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Also

We were a joke before Webber became a King. He put us on the map. He's special and I'm sure if you ask me or any basketball fan to name a player that played for us, Webber's name would surely come up

by kingme on Mar 26, 2008 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

by that theory

people would also say jason williams, but i think you would agree his jersey shouldn't be up there. just because a player "puts us on the map" doesn't mean he should have his jersey retired. a jersey being retired is for a once in a generation type of player. webber couldn't have done it alone, he wasn't that good. he had a good supporting cast that made his already "good" skills seem "great".

www.myspace.com/cynemamusic.com

by Cynema the Band on Mar 26, 2008 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

but he also dominated the college game

and I mean dominated. Yes that timeout was unfortunate but that shouldn't lessen what he did in college. If it was the NBA alone, Webber may be a borderline HOF but since it's basketball HOF (there is no NBA HOF), Webber's College ball + NBA experience = HOF

by kingme on Mar 26, 2008 10:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Webber is a HOF

I didn't know that was in question.

by Michael Beasley on Mar 26, 2008 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I made up my mind

Webber should be in the HOF. Yes, he ended his season poorly but that does not me we should forget how he tore it up during his prime. He was up there with KG and Duncan and if it wasn't for that Horry shot, maybe he would have won us a championship. Webber was better than some of the players that are in the HOF

by kingme on Mar 26, 2008 10:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Vlade

There is no way that Vlade's jersey should be retired before Webb's...if at all. Webber was the 1st big time FA to come to Sac and is most definitely a HOFer. On the other hand, Vlade is a Laker for life, took less money than Sac was offering so that he could return to LA, and has the biggest assist in King history (unfortunately not to another King)

by sactownal on Mar 26, 2008 10:09 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Webber came via trade for Mitch

Vlade was the 1st big time FA.

by Kfan in Korea on Mar 26, 2008 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Correct on the trade part, my mistake

I wouldn't use the words Vlade and big time together, but didn't Webber have a no trade clause that he had to waive to make the deal work?

by sactownal on Mar 26, 2008 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If Vlade hadn't come

It would have been harder to persuade Webber to ever suit up as a King.

Peja would probably have stayed in the Greek League, where he was MVP one year.

Hedo wouldn't have developed as quickly as he did because of the language barrier. He's Turkish, but was born in Serbia and speaks Serbian.

It could be argued that the Vlade Divac free agent signing was the beginning of the beginning. He was the first piece of the puzzle.

Bridge between Euro basketball and the NBA, absolutely. But let's not overlook his many and varied contributions to the Kings and the Sacramento community.

His jersey should definitely be in the rafters. It'll never get there at Staples Center.

TickTickTickTickTickTick

by LeaguePassAddict on Mar 26, 2008 3:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

No Webber didn't have a no trade clause

This isn't MLB dude.

I am the stone that the builder refused I am the visual, the inspiration That made Lady Sing the Blues..I'm the spark that makes your idea bright...

by pookeyguru on Mar 27, 2008 8:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Less money? No.

Vlade did not take less money to return to the Lakers. The Kings low-balled him because they didn't want him back. As I recall, rumors at the time put Vlade's offer from the Kings at half the money the Lakers were offering.

by Carl on Mar 26, 2008 7:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

No doubter

C-Webb was the best King in Sacramento history.

Visit sunny and beautiful Movie City USA.

by DB on Mar 26, 2008 10:12 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm gonna go against the grain

I say no. I loved Webb and you can't deny his numbers but he was within inches of leaving Sac, as I'm sure everyone remembers. The ONLY reason he stayed was because of the $$$ and who can blame him. Retiring jersey numbers should be for special franchise players. I don't think #4 qualifies as witnessed by his knee injury and the team's subsequent success. How much was Webb a product of a beautiful system and excellent complimentary players, how can you truly judge? You cannot, one can only speculate. I say Webb was a proficient 20/10 player who got boosted by Vlade and Adelman and was the star because he scored and is handsome and articulate. Maybe if he did it for 10 years I'd change my mind. Don't trash #2's retirment by putting #4 in the rafters cause you disrespect Mitch by putting Webb up there. Just my three cents.

by Mityt on Mar 26, 2008 10:24 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Trash #2?

Hey, I loved Mitch just like everyone else but he took the Kings to the playoffs one time his entire Kings career. Mitch was the classic good player on a horrible team. Webber and Divac were catalysts on championship caliber teams. Now, saying all this, I hated Webber in college and in Washington and it wasn't until he came to the Kings that I learned to respect him as a player. Lets be honest, the best thing Mitch ever did for the Kings was yield Webber in a trade.

StR- Where Pookey is long, Otis is short and Section brings down the house.

by jjham15 on Mar 26, 2008 10:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fair enough

But you have to analyze the supporting cast Mitch had. If you put Mitch on the teams of the 2000s, you don't think they make the playoffs just the same? In fact, maybe Mitch wouldn't have choked like Peja and DC with the game on the line. But it is all conjecture at this point, I am aware.

Mitch played 7 seasons with Sac and was rewarded for his loyalty and ironman performance... we all know the Rock didn't miss too many games. How many did Webb miss? The Maloofs should sent Webb a watch, a dozen roses, and a nice Hallmark card. Maybe a C-Webb night at Arco, that's about it.

I respect your opinion and will cheer loudly for Webb when his jersey gets hoisted, I just in my gut say no to Webb (and Vlade and the whole crew, perhaps Petrie, only time will tell, and of course to Reynolds and Gerould).

by Mityt on Mar 26, 2008 10:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Absolutely

C-Webb - Yes
Vlade - Hell Yes
Reynolds - Yes
Petrie - If he can turn this crap into a contender again, then yes.

by vfettke on Mar 26, 2008 10:25 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Also...

i don't understand what our infatuation with jerry reynolds is. he is horrible color analyst on tv., he twice took over for kings coaches who were fired during the season, but was never good enough to keep the job past the end of the year. just because a guy has been with an organization for over 20 years does not qualify him to have a "jersey" in the rafters. what's next, the secretary who has anserwed the phones for 30 years? the hot god vendor who has sold the most kings dogs? geeez, where does it end.

www.myspace.com/cynemamusic.com

by Cynema the Band on Mar 26, 2008 11:24 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

As for Peaches

Instead of hanging a jersey, we'll hang his stuffed corpse from the rafters. Then it can be a halftime contest like the half court shot for a truck: if you can hit his dead body with a dart you get a prize. Free tickets for a hit to the chest. $10,000 for a headshot. And a new car or boat for hitting him in his little peaches.

by vfettke on Mar 26, 2008 12:23 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Or better yet...

why wait till he dies?

by vfettke on Mar 26, 2008 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Who the hell voted no

Seriously? We need to put his jersey up on the rafters

by kingme on Mar 26, 2008 12:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I voted no

I am the stone that the builder refused I am the visual, the inspiration That made Lady Sing the Blues..I'm the spark that makes your idea bright...

by pookeyguru on Mar 26, 2008 12:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

at last...

a voice of reason i was waiting to hear chime in. pookey, if you don't elaborate in this diary, i hope you dedicate your own diary to this discussion and give our faithful fans (to a fault) an explanation as to why these players shouldn't have their jersey up there.

www.myspace.com/cynemamusic.com

by Cynema the Band on Mar 26, 2008 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm actually surprised

you didn't expound on your answer. Who kidnapped the real pookey?

by kingme on Mar 26, 2008 9:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm tired of argument for argument's sake

I was really being a smartass. I actually voted yes. (I don't give a shit who believes me.) I felt, and this is sort of my reasoning, that the Kings had never had a MVP candidate before Chris. Because of that alone he deserves inclusion to the rafters. Maybe the hall, maybe not. That's another discussion for another time. (He is not James Worthy people.)

I still feel that Mitch had a greater impact on the team overall than Chris did, but I felt Chris did everything in his power, most of the time, to help the Kings win where and how he could. I'll explain the other players where appropriately so.

I am the stone that the builder refused I am the visual, the inspiration That made Lady Sing the Blues..I'm the spark that makes your idea bright...

by pookeyguru on Mar 27, 2008 1:01 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Richmond

Was out and about last night and Peaches and Eric Haseltstein who is the radio voice of the Griz and used to live here and they both agreed that Mitch was the best King in the Sacramento area. For his ability play both ways and that was a clutch shooter in pressure situations.

by Murf on Mar 26, 2008 2:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Richmond and Webber

I think Richmond was the greater King, but Webber was the more important King.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Mar 26, 2008 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Webber had better overall skills

but Richmond had greater ability to maximize what he had. If that makes sense.

I am the stone that the builder refused I am the visual, the inspiration That made Lady Sing the Blues..I'm the spark that makes your idea bright...

by pookeyguru on Mar 27, 2008 1:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Webber

Was an all-star and our franchise player in the only years in Sacramento Kings history when teams feared being on the court more than they hated being in the visitors' locker room.

Yes. Retire his jersey. The sooner the better.

TickTickTickTickTickTick

by LeaguePassAddict on Mar 26, 2008 3:16 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Great post

Concise and spot f*cking on!

by Kusian on Mar 26, 2008 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I voted yes

Just because Webber is a sexy, sexy man. And I feel fully comfortable with my sexuality saying that. Though, I'll throw in a "No Homo" for good measure.

Mikki Moore in the skills challenge! - LPA

by iashwash on Mar 26, 2008 5:37 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I mean, really:

Mikki Moore in the skills challenge! - LPA

by iashwash on Mar 26, 2008 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

LOL

I'll throw in a "No Homo" for good measure.

Not that there's anything wrong with that
--Jerry Seinfeld

TickTickTickTickTickTick

by LeaguePassAddict on Mar 26, 2008 5:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes to Webber and Vlade

Yes to both Webber and Vlade, no to the others. They ought to do it on opening night next season.

by Carl on Mar 26, 2008 7:51 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Hey!

No jumping ahead!

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Mar 26, 2008 8:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Webber and Divac

Should be retired together. I have always sort of thought the Maloofs were waiting for Webber to retire so they could do this.
Retiring Mitch's jersey was a joke. Will the Buck's retire Micheal Redd's jersey? Plus, Mitch complained the last few years he was here AND won a ring as a scrub with the Lakers. Can we unretire jerseys? Give #2 to Anthony Johnson and see if anyone cares.

by Travis Mays Hayes on Mar 26, 2008 10:33 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

The Rock

Sacramento era leader in points and minutes, 2nd in games played (1 behind Peja), 2nd in assists (behind Bibby) and 2nd in steals (behind Christie). Statistically, Mitch Richmond is the greatest King of the Sacramento era. I can't blame him for the won-loss record, as he was not in charge of drafting, trades or free agent signings. And he still played his arse off those last few years while he complained about being severely underpaid by NBA standards (though he should have blamed his agent for the crappy contract, not the Kings). Even in exiting he helped us, by being valuable enough to fetch us Chris Webber.

Michael Jordan once said that Mitch Richmond was his toughest assignment on both ends of the floor. Not Clyde Drexler. Not Joe Dumars. Mitch Richmond. That (and what he gave us every night for seven years) is good enough for me.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Mar 26, 2008 11:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well argued

and Reggie Miller cock riders forget that Mitch had a greater overall impact on the game than any other SG sans Jordan at the time. Mitch was really that talented. Who else was on the Kings? A Young Brian Grant who quite hadn't hit his stride when he wasn't hurt?

I am the stone that the builder refused I am the visual, the inspiration That made Lady Sing the Blues..I'm the spark that makes your idea bright...

by pookeyguru on Mar 27, 2008 1:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

How old are you?

Or how old were you during the Mitch Richmond era?

Just curious, as I don't think retiring Mitch's jersey deserves much debate.

Kenny Thomas - uniting Kings fans since 2006

by otis29 on Mar 27, 2008 6:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Webber has to get retired.

While being mentally stronger, Richmond has nothing on Webber in the skills department. Plainly, Webb's the best player the Kings have seen in any era sans Oscar Robertson(my vote for best player ever...eff Jordan). If ya don't believe me, check your head back to '02 and ask if not for Mafiosi and the Stern Gang, "Would he be wearing a ring right now?".

The wise man tells you Where you have fallen And where you yet may fall - Invaluable secrets! The world may hate him. But good men love him.

by Psychrates on Mar 27, 2008 8:33 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs