The Prospect of Emeka Okafor
Sam Amick of The Bee reports the Kings are discussing an Emeka Okafor-Kenny Thomas trade with the Hornets. Thomas's contract, as we all know, expires this summer. Okafor's deal runs through 2014. Here's a full salary breakdown, thanks to ShamSports.com.
| Player | '09-10 | '10-11 | '11-12 | '12-13 | '13-14 |
| Thomas | $8.7M | -- | -- | -- | -- |
| Okafor | $10.8M | $11.8M | $12.8M | $13.8M | $14.8M* |
That 2013-14 season has an early termination option for Okafor. Clearly, in losing Thomas the Kings would only be losing a spot bench forward and the opportunity cost of using his expiring contract in another trade. There are very few big names expected to be available for expiring contracts this trade deadline -- Carlos Boozer, Stephen Jackson, Elton Brand and perhaps Monta Ellis lead that class. (Despite what you may have heard, Toronto ain't trading Chris Bosh for anything less than a couple of Sacramento's top assets -- think Kevin Martin and Jason Thompson, or something like that. Pipe. Dream.)
The real question here is whether Okafor is worth the cost of his own salary for the Kings. That's also an opportunity cost issue: if the Kings take on Okafor without losing one of its longer contracts, the free agency periods of 2010, 2011 and possibly 2012 are essentially wiped out. And that really depends on what you think the Kings could get in free agency right now.
I think free agency is a big risk. The best player the Sacramento Kings have ever acquired as a free agent (not including any extensions/re-signings) is Vlade Divac. At the time, the team overpaid for Vlade -- he was making All-Star level money despite a reputation as an average starting center with a few special skills. No one (but Geoff Petrie, perhaps) knew how well Divac would mesh with Chris Webber and friends.
Who is No. 2 behind Divac? Bobby Jackson, who at the time of his signing was a three-year vet with a career 8 ppg average? Shareef Abdur-Rahim? John Salmons? The Kings, even when great, have never signed high-level free agents. This is not particularly Sacramento-specific, either: few great players move in unrestricted free agency. This coming summer is a bit of an anomaly that players are even getting to free agency ... and it's still unlikely many of the big names will move.
So I'm not sure the Kings lose much by way of renouncing a big free agency splash for 2-3 years. As I said, you limit your trade deadline opportunities by sending away Thomas's contract ... but there was unlikely to be much out there better than Okafor (depending on your feelings about how Boozer would mesh here, or whether the Suns will careen and make Amar'e Stoudemire available again). Despite being traded recently, Okafor wouldn't be an easily movable contract for a while -- any trade including him is a necessarily big trade, and those are harder to pull off. So he becomes your "hardest to trade" asset, eclipsing Beno Udrih and Andres Nocioni. Further augmentation to the roster would fall to trades involving the team's bevy of non-stars/non-youths, trades involving the prospects, trades involving draft picks, mid-level or sub mid-level free agent signings and the draft. You'd have to be fairly comfortable that the current team (with Okafor and the 2010 draft pick and some internal growth) would be able to be a playoff team within a year or two to justify the trade.
And I think that's fair. When Kevin Martin is healthy, the Kings have clearly above average players at point guard (Tyreke Evans), shooting guard (Martin) and power forward (Jason Thompson). The team has one serviceable starter (as of today) at small forward (Nocioni) and center (Spencer Hawes). You'd hope Hawes will be more than that any day now, but let's not be deluded. He's not there yet. He's better than some starting centers out there, but not too many. He's not clearly above average today ... many would argue he's not average today.
Adding Okafor would give you an above average player at a fourth position. It'd also give the starting line-up its first elite defensive player (Evans isn't there) and it would likely cinch the Kings as an elite rebounding team. Okafor, while less versatile than Hawes, also happens to be a serviceable offensive weapon: he's smart with the ball, and has a career field goal percentage better than 50 percent. If he hurts the offense, it's in his lack of ability to stretch the defense. Given that Hawes has shot poorly this year but the Kings offense has been on fire (thanks to Martin, then Evans, Thompson and Udrih), I'm not sure how much of a concern that is.
The only real question which remains is what this means for Hawes. He can negotiate a contract extension this summer. As of today, it is quite easy to see that he and the Kings will be far apart on his value. He's the first prominent Kings kid in the post-Webber era that I think could get to restricted free agency. (Extending Kevin Martin early was a no-brainer, and Francisco Garcia got a fairly generous deal, which wasn't difficult to anticipate.) Either way, in the interim, Hawes is a good third big. A pissed-off Hawes could be a great third big. It's not terribly easy to explain, but pinning Hawes behind a middling, old center during an awful season felt a whole lot worse than pinning him behind an above average center in his prime during a surprisingly competitve season seems.
All this ignores a few other points that make the rumor itself a positive. I mean, are we actually talking about the Kings considering an expensive move?! A move that implies the franchise thinks they are fairly close to contending for a playoff spot? That's a huge step from where we were even three weeks ago. If the deal doesn't happen, this is still a blast of excitement in mid-November, and there's no discounting that after the last couple seasons.
831 comments
|
4 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
That's
my thinking on that too … if they were to just let the K-9 go away, who would they spend that money on? Would they be better than Okafor?
I think the whole “Free Agent Year of 2010” has every fan hoping their team can pull something off, but let’s be real. Like TZ said, the highest profile FA we’ve ever had is Vlade Divac …. if the deal goes through, maybe Petrie doesn’t wanna gamble on trying to convince someone to come here. instead, he’d force Okafor to come here.
I still don’t know where I’d fall on this trade, if it even happens.
+1
Were nit getting LeBron, were not getting Wade. Let’s get Okafor now!
Is my banana fluffy enough?
by 27freethrows on Nov 14, 2009 2:18 PM PST up reply actions
Rumors like this make me want to cry.
Like rumors of us willing to sell our soul for Kurt Rambis. Let’s see I’ve got a guy with a career avg. of 13/10 that I.m spending Labron money on. I wonder what my motivation for getting some sucker team like the kings to take his rediculously bloated long term contract could be. Oh I don’t know, getting rid of the most overpaid player in the nba maybe. Would you pay Chris Kaman 14 million dollars a year? No? But you’ll give that kind of money to a guy who isn’t as good as Kaman. With all do respect, if you can’t see the folly in bailing New Orleans out of their stupidity than you are an idiot. This trade will make the kenny tomas trade and sharrif signing look like sound decisions. Don’t believe me? Look at Omeka’s career stats. He’s already over the hill avg. 10ppg and 9rpg this season and frankly his numbers have gotten worse every year since his rookie year when he avg. 15/10. I can’t even write anymore. The only thing I can hope is that sam amick has this as wrong as he usually has everything. STUPID STUPID STUPID!!!!!!!
wow
if you think that’s Lebron money, I have some oceanside property in Iowa to sell you.
Sharlon Schoop - de favoriete Nederlandse honkbalspeler van McCovey Chronicles.
You always have to be one step ahead of your drunk friends
--Daisy Owl
He would be a bench player.
And Bench players are not worth that kind of money.
He would be the starter
You’re right about the second half of what you said, but you don’t follow your own logic. if Okafor was traded to the Kings it would be to become the starter.
And obviously if everything was hunky dory with how things are shaping up at center this post wouldn’t even exist and Ziller’s poll would be running 70-30 against.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
If everything was hunky dory MM...
…there wouldn’t have been any discussion of Okafor by the Kings.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
correctamente
and my sentiments exactly.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
I HATE missed free throws
and he’s a terrible (60%) FT shooter. I don’t really know the guys game. Decent numbers but thats a Lot of bacon.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:13 PM PST up reply actions
Coachie can fix that
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
The free agency isssue is the most important point
We don’t get top-shelf signings, never have.
As for remaining options for the trade deadline, if the team continues to play hard (win or lose), Nocioni and Beno will be very attractive to playoff contenders. I think we can get a very solid center without breaking the bank. And Okafor has proven durable most of his career.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
UUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHG!!!!!!!!
Let’s see I’ve got a guy with a career avg. of 13/10 that I.m spending Labron money on. I wonder what my motivation for getting some sucker team like the kings to take his rediculously bloated long term contract could be. Oh I don’t know, getting rid of the most overpaid player in the nba maybe. Would you pay Chris Kaman 14 million dollars a year? No? But you’ll give that kind of money to a guy who isn’t as good as Kaman. With all do respect, if you can’t see the folly in bailing New Orleans out of their stupidity than you are an idiot. This trade will make the kenny tomas trade and sharrif signing look like sound decisions. Don’t believe me? Look at Omeka’s career stats. He’s already over the hill avg. 10ppg and 9rpg this season and frankly his numbers have gotten worse every year since his rookie year when he avg. 15/10. I can’t even write anymore. The only thing I can hope is that sam amick has this as wrong as he usually has everything. STUPID STUPID STUPID!!!!!!!
How should I respond, stupid?
I hope that’s not offensive, I know sometimes you have to talk down to the level of your audience.
For starters, Okafor’s career stats are closer to 14/11, but that’s just nitpicking.
Do you actually believe that LBJ’s salary this year of $15,779,912 is equivalent to Okafor’s $10.8 million? Do you think that after next summer, James’ salary will be anywhere in the neighborhood of Okafor’s $11.8 million? Assuming Lebron’s salary jumps to the max, he’d have to be knocking down better than 28 points a night and 22 rebounds to justify his salary compared to Okafor.. But that comparison is stupid. Hope you like it.
Kaman may look like a goofball, but there are only a handful of Kings I wouldn’t give up to get him. My only reservation there is he’s had some injuries the past couple years, unlike Okafor, who played every single game the past two seasons.
The trade that brought Kenny Thomas here was a good trade. It broke up Webber’s contract into manageable pieces, two-thirds of which has been off the books for a few years. But I know that involves math, and I’m guessing you are no better at that than you are with language.
Since you only just joined today, I’m going to suggest that you head on back to the SacBee site and work on your trolling. Right now, you’re boring and obvious, and when you criticize your betters, it really only makes you look…
Gotta be a good word for it. You work on that.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
by andy sims on Nov 15, 2009 12:18 AM PST up reply actions 4 recs
There is an action button with CoyoteBlue's name on it
use it
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 6:55 AM PST up reply actions
not meant to be personal to you Otis
more of a shout out to anyone looking at the other 4 posts on this same thread. I happened over to At the Hive and the same post was there. It is spam.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 7:10 AM PST up reply actions
I posted this in the other thread
You do it.
There is nobody in FA that would be better than Emeka Okafor that we can realistically get. This would ensure our defense would be more than solid for the next decade.
If we do this, I’d be willing to compare these Kings to the 04 Pistons:
Billups – Evans
Hamilton – Martin
Prince – Casspi
R. Wallace – JT
B. Wallace – Okafor
Corliss – Brockman?? May??
Okur – Hawes
James – Beno
Dare to dream? If all of the guys develop….
by Scirocco on Nov 14, 2009 2:14 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Can't see it.
The Detroit group was so special defensively I don’t think the current group of Kings could ever match that.
In addition you had players that were mentally tough as nails like Billups, Hamilton and intimidating inside with Rasheed and Ben.
BOOK IT!
Not to mention I think Billups has better court vision
but not the penetrating ability of Evans.
I see some similarities, but not enough, really.
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
by PhutureKings on Nov 14, 2009 2:27 PM PST up reply actions
Billups is built like a bull too
Billups can shoot with the best of anybody and can post up smaller guards.
BOOK IT!
It took Billups 5 years to really develop
doesn’t look like it will take Tyreke that long
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 6:04 PM PST up reply actions
Rasheed is the biggest reason why I can't compare the two teams.
When he’s on, ‘Sheed can score inside and out. He has a toughness and attitude that JT and Okafor don’t have. Until JT can consistently use his left, have two go to moves and shoot the 3, he has a long way to go before he could be compared to ’Sheed.
On the other hand, JT and Okafor both show the ability to rebound like Big Ben. Okafor is just as good a shotblocker that Big Ben was in his prime. I really JT will get there soon.
Scirocco, I get what you’re saying though. I think our bench is superior to that bench. All we need is more experience for them to play with each other.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Brainless Fool!
Let’s see I’ve got a guy with a career avg. of 13/10 that I.m spending Labron money on. I wonder what my motivation for getting some sucker team like the kings to take his rediculously bloated long term contract could be. Oh I don’t know, getting rid of the most overpaid player in the nba maybe. Would you pay Chris Kaman 14 million dollars a year? No? But you’ll give that kind of money to a guy who isn’t as good as Kaman. With all do respect, if you can’t see the folly in bailing New Orleans out of their stupidity than you are an idiot. This trade will make the kenny tomas trade and sharrif signing look like sound decisions. Don’t believe me? Look at Omeka’s career stats. He’s already over the hill avg. 10ppg and 9rpg this season and frankly his numbers have gotten worse every year since his rookie year when he avg. 15/10. I can’t even write anymore. The only thing I can hope is that sam amick has this as wrong as he usually has everything. STUPID STUPID STUPID!!!!!!!
PLEASE don't post the same comment 4 times.
Saying it over and over again doesn’t make your argument any better.
by Slaaam on Nov 14, 2009 11:54 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
This isn't even a legit conversation.
It assumes Petrie has a head injury and that is bad for morale.
or CB has a head injury
Short term memory loss maybe?
I'm gonna shoot myself!
Let’s see I’ve got a guy with a career avg. of 13/10 that I.m spending Labron money on. I wonder what my motivation for getting some sucker team like the kings to take his rediculously bloated long term contract could be. Oh I don’t know, getting rid of the most overpaid player in the nba maybe. Would you pay Chris Kaman 14 million dollars a year? No? But you’ll give that kind of money to a guy who isn’t as good as Kaman. With all do respect, if you can’t see the folly in bailing New Orleans out of their stupidity than you are an idiot. This trade will make the kenny tomas trade and sharrif signing look like sound decisions. Don’t believe me? Look at Omeka’s career stats. He’s already over the hill avg. 10ppg and 9rpg this season and frankly his numbers have gotten worse every year since his rookie year when he avg. 15/10. I can’t even write anymore. The only thing I can hope is that sam amick has this as wrong as he usually has everything. STUPID STUPID STUPID!!!!!!!
Jump off the Dubai Berg
It’s probably cheaper.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Crap, you saw the video from the top, right?
That’s way too much time to reconsider before you hit the ground.
I agree with everything you say Z
and the main thing for anyone to consider is that if the Kings do this move, that’s pretty much it. Aside from a couple draft picks here and there and maybe a couple simple trades, this would be the core we are moving forward with. We would depend on the further development of JT, Hawes, Casspi, Greene, and Reke to see how far we get in thr playoffs.
I guess the way I want to look at it this is comparing a starting lineup of Reke, Kevin, Cisco or Noc (one is gonna have to go), JT, and Okafor with the other top teams in the West.
Could that lineup hang in a couple years with the Blazers, Thunder, (by then declining) Lakers, Magic, Hawks? I’m looking at 2-3 years down the road when hopefully we should be making a big push deep in the playoffs. I want to say yes
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
Slightly disagree
Agree with a lot, but not sure we would be limited to only simple trades. With Martin, JT, Hawes, Casspi, Noc, Udrih, Garcia, Reke and draft picks we actually have some ammo to still pull off another monster trade if we wanted too. I mean even keeping Reke and Okafor – I would imagine that Martin and JT or Hawes, Omri and a 1st could help us pull in another big name player.
Agree with that
Saw your post in the other thread and thought about it. I just think that the main pieces should be the building blocks and any future trade could be reduced to a one-for-one trade. I don’t think, after adding Okafor, that we should package something like KEvin and JT for Bosh for example.
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
I agree, I would want to see how this core performs. However, we will still have our MLEs that Petrie loves too. So we can still add and trade pieces. I just think adding this kind of talent to our roster without subtracting talent (only the value of an expiring) is too tantalizing to pass up on. Okafor seems to fit the core of what we are trying to build here and we would still have enough pieces to make more future deals if this team peaked at a non-contender level.
by SPTSJUNKIE on Nov 14, 2009 3:01 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
let's do this
and then get Bosh for Kev and JT!
Then we roll out Tyreke, Beno, Noce, Bosh, Okafor, and come off the bench with Udoka, Casspi, Hawes. That’s a pretty good 8, and there is growth potential for Ty, Casspi, Hawes, Donte.
Life is every mammal's journey from very very wet to very very dry.
Not enough shooting in the starting line
toughness but . . .you need to spread the floor in todays NBA
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:56 PM PST up reply actions
Bosh can shoot well enough
You don’t turn down an opportunity to pick Bosh up if all you sacrifice is some shooting.
BOOK IT!
I don't agree
you need a cold blooded shooter in your starting 5 to contend
But funny how the Beno talk has changed.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 6:09 PM PST up reply actions
I like Okafor
With Emeka, JT and Hawes, I think we have a solid 3-man rotation at the bigs.
I would prefer JT and Martin over Bosh. In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised at all to see JT matching Bosh’s production as early as next season. He has a better looking jumpshot than Bosh, he is a better passer, he can handle the ball better, and he is nearly his equal in rebounding. If his low post skills keep developing, he is going to be a beast in this league.
We will love this trade this year, but after that it depends on what Hawes does. If we sign him at a large number, we are going to have a lot of money tied up in him and Okafor when we need to sign JT the following year. I just hope this isn’t a knee-jerk reaction to Hawes’ slow start.
Unless Hawes produces much bigger
he will not be signed to “a large number” (relatively speaking, they are all large numbers, even the league minimums).
If Okafor produces according to his past five seasons and we have all witnessed JT’s emegence – Spencer Hawes becomes (even more) expendable. No one else will sign him to big money – unless he shows evidence he can produce as his upside is limited. He won’t command Okafor money, JT on the other hand, if he continues to progress, is looking at over the MLE type money.
The other big issue is that the salary cap is diminishing and so will salaries overall. Okafor has a “pre-diminished” contract so his current deal is necessarily inflated in comparison to what he would command if signing a deal today (or tomorrow).
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 7:05 AM PST up reply actions
if he was $8 to $9 mil/year
I wouldn’t even bat an eye. I don’t think this contract bothers me as much as knowing that the combination of this contract, the Garcia contract and the Beno contract may prevent us from signing Greene if he keeps improving or Casspi at some point.
I’m ok if this goes either way though. I’m not sure this makes us a playoff team this year. It probably depends on how well the team can keep the wheels on with KMart out for a couple months.
When did guys who average 10ppg and 10rpg start getting SUPERSTAR money????
Let’s see I’ve got a guy with a career avg. of 13/10 that I.m spending Labron money on. I wonder what my motivation for getting some sucker team like the kings to take his rediculously bloated long term contract could be. Oh I don’t know, getting rid of the most overpaid player in the nba maybe. Would you pay Chris Kaman 14 million dollars a year? No? But you’ll give that kind of money to a guy who isn’t as good as Kaman. With all do respect, if you can’t see the folly in bailing New Orleans out of their stupidity than you are an idiot. This trade will make the kenny tomas trade and sharrif signing look like sound decisions. Don’t believe me? Look at Omeka’s career stats. He’s already over the hill avg. 10ppg and 9rpg this season and frankly his numbers have gotten worse every year since his rookie year when he avg. 15/10. I can’t even write anymore. The only thing I can hope is that sam amick has this as wrong as he usually has everything. STUPID STUPID STUPID!!!!!!!
I like it
We need a great defensive big man. Okafor is a great defensive big man. It’s especialyl great tf Hawes accepts a role off the bench, which he presumably should because he’ll still get plenty of minutes. Okafor would be a great addition.
www.mancancook.net
by vfettke on Nov 14, 2009 2:24 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
I agree,
Hawe’s coming off the bench could really help the offense. He is more of an offensive Center, while Okafur is more defensive.
Given the starting lineup, we need more “D” than “O”, while the opposite is true with the bench.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 2:37 PM PST up reply actions
Hawes doesn't necessarily have to come off the bench
The one thing I like about having a good coach in place is that I trust PW to ignore the contract and make Emeka earn his minutes. If Emeka out-plays him, Hawes has to accept his move to the bench and not feel disrespected. Either way, there is 30 minutes available for both of them.
…assuming Hawes/Okafor could spend some time backing up JT at the 4 too.
DO IT.
Okay, 2 reasons:
One, just like Ziller beautifully put it, we’re not gonna bring in a big name FA this year or the next. We gotta be honest here: Sacramento isn’t exactly the biggest draw for a guy to come play for. Okafor is much better than any other big that we could realistically bring to Sactown. He’d be great down low with JT. And maybe Spencer could finally figure it out coming off the bench as a 6th man.
And the 2nd reason is this: It’ll bring back some of the long-lost fans to Arco. Okafor is a pretty big name and people will be dying to see him play. A starting lineup in 2 months of
‘Reke, Martin, Noc, JT and Okafor is very good. Playoffs good. And fans will take notice of this. I don’t know about you guys, but I miss the old days when teams would make the flight to Sacramento, know they’re gonna get their asses kicked, and then fly right back home.
"Are you tryin to say Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?"
I think this is a stretch
Okafor is a pretty big name and people will be dying to see him play.
My guess is there are a lot of fans that couldn’t even tell you what team he’s on.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 2:52 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I get that
He’s certainly been out of the limelight since he played for Charlotte for so long. People won’t be dying to see him play, but if he plays well, people will be at least excited to see the Kings play. I do agree that with him in the lineup, this team is strong enough to at least make a push for the playoffs, and that is certainly going to help put fans in seats.
I'm just not sure he makes us better
If I’m not mistaken, his next playoff appearance will be his first.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 3:00 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Fair enough
He’s not a superstar who can put a team on his back and force them to be successful, but as a piece to the puzzle, I think he can make a solid contribution. A very solid contribution. He didn’t necessarily have the pieces around him in Charlotte, so I certainly don’t fault him for not making the playoffs with that team. I didn’t really follow what went on in New Orleans so I don’t know if he just didn’t have time to fit in or what. I think he’s a solid upgrade, but the question is whether that’s worth the salary increase, and at this point I don’t really know the answer to that.
Okafor is only 10 games in to his New Orleans career
Chris Paul has an ankle injury and that’s probably why this is happening.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
yes
emeka okafor will not bring fans to arco. that said, do this trade yesterday. look at the chart of what centers make that someone posted (sorry I am too lazy to go look up) and he is well worth it. its not often that you trade for the direct rotation replacement, but that’s what this is… jt/hawes/k9 for jt/okafor/hawes… yep, k9 was our first big off the bench, imagine that, and playing well… but this is an obvious upgrade and the minutes will work themselves out… DO IT (if NO really will…)
by lchristmas on Nov 14, 2009 9:40 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Does NO do this deal for only expiring or are they going to want picks & youth too?
I know the financial situation in NO is bleek, but they don’t draw a lot of fans now. Can a small family ownership afford to alienate their already small fan base? And, CP3 didn’t like losing his coach, so how’s he going to feel about losing his starting center?
I’m guessing NO is going to want our draft pick and young talent like Omri, to get them to make the deal. They can’t afford to sell the franchise down the river, just for the Benjamin’s.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The CP3 issue might be less than you think
He was really close with Tyson Chandler, who they got rid of for Okefor. He may not be as upset about them moving Okefor, even if its for nothing, as you would think.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
na, i don't think so
I think this is just a move to drop salary, kinda like the Kings did with Artest and Bibby a few years ago.
They’re being smart. NO has looked bad this year and it would be in their best interest to start rebuilding as soon as possible.
"Are you tryin to say Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?"
by Scott Coleman on Nov 14, 2009 2:36 PM PST up reply actions
I was thinking the opposite
that NO might need to give up something extra. Simply because we’d be taking on a massive contract to give them some desperately needed financial flexibility.
Also, CP3’s already probably pissed about losing Tyson Chandler, who was not only his starting center but a good friend. Chances are Paul’s not happy in general. His team sucks. Chandler’s gone. Scott’s gone. The front office has basically given up on this year.
The fact that either side could really have a case in demanding youngsters/picks for the trade to be done means it’s probably pretty fair as is.
www.mancancook.net
Interestingly
the moderator at At The Hive was pretty non-commital about a straight swap. I could completely see this happening as a straight 1-for-1 deal.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
So Kenny Thomas = Emeka Okafor
I love NBA math . . . I really do. Trades in this league are so fascinating because of the financial aspect.
The Salary Cap and Financial Commitment
This is the biggest news here as Ziller points out. The Maloofs, whom earlier this year cut expenses drastically (Head Coach salary for one), and have no commitment for a larger, newer, more profitable Arena are talking about a salary cap addition of many millions of dollars. WOW!
And the last projections are the cap is to be lowered to $50M. Sham-WOW! That is saying a whole lot.
It also means that the Kings are figuring that they are not going to be cellar dwellars and that a later lottery pick is more expected than a top 5 in this big man heavy 2010 draft.
I'm really excited if the Maloofs are willing to spend
I think they see some financial relief in the form of increased ticket sales if we’re winning. Arco hasn’t been filled but its looking a little better
www.mancancook.net
It's never been in their nature to be penny pinchers
I’ve known a few people who have worked for them before they were even a blip on the radar, they like to make a big move if they believe it’s the right move.
I get that same impression.
They’re not Paul Allen, but they’re not Donald Sterling of the 90’s either.
A couple more thoughts:
1. I think Nocioni might be more tradeable than we think. Especially to a contending team with some expirings. He’s tough, plays D, strokes the three ball, and will play whatever role he’s asked to. I wouldn’t be surprised if a contender looks to pick him up later in the year. I still think Boston would gladly take him for Tony Allen, Scalabrine and a pick.
www.mancancook.net
if
Omri or Donte keep playing as well as they have, I think we should look to deal Noc.
"Are you tryin to say Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?"
by Scott Coleman on Nov 14, 2009 2:49 PM PST up reply actions
it is gonna be hard to do anything this year
teams that could use Noc like Miami, who could use a 3 point shooter and some toughness at the 3 are trying to keep their expirings
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
Emeka is overpaid, but with the depth we would have up front I think he would benefit
He has almost always been the best big man on his team, and he isn’t one of the bigger centers. But with Shock and Hawes around to help him out and score around him, and a great backcourt to defend the perimeter and create easy shots for him, he could have a couple career years in Sacramento. Maybe earn his money.
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
here is a question: On defense, rebounding should be even better, someone to block shots and clog, On offense - will he be in JT's way and vice versa?
will the two of them clog the middle and take away Tyreke’s drives? Or will they enhance it with another guy to dish to and another guy for Evans to use as a screen?
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 2:53 PM PST up reply actions
I think JT is more versatile than we give him credit for
both he and Spencer can hit the outside J, and JT has good passing ability.
Okafor can hit that baseline 15 footer pretty darn good too.
Just depends on how Westie wants to use his guys.
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
Thinking out loud....Okafor is overpaid for a career 14/11 player but he does play well above average D
Barring injury he has probably reached his ceiling but on the other hand he can probably play at this level for another for a good while. I agree that TZ is probably right in arguing that we couldn’t get anybody better in FA. He is a character guy and if we added him to the mix we would be a dominant rebounding team with strong D. Sham says he’s interested in hermaphrodites but that’s just Sham.This could knock a year off the rebuilding if the kids keep developing. Hmmmm
Ok I thought about it. I would vote yes as long as we don’t have to give up anything of value to get him. make the deal
"I make love to pressure" - Stephen Jackson
I never liked Okafor for some reason
seems like JT without the work ethic and with more money to me.
I’d rather see the KT money used to lock up Shock, Green and Hawes for the long run.
+1
He’s known for working out like crazy.
Is my banana fluffy enough?
by 27freethrows on Nov 14, 2009 3:12 PM PST up reply actions
Disagree on the Okafor-work ethic statement but I do agree with...
I’d rather see the KT money used to lock up Shock, Green and Hawes for the long run.
Not sure how we’re going to get the money to keep them in the future.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
After thinking about it
I think Okafur is way overpaid. The Kings are going in a different direction, and it’s focused on signing solid contributors on the cheap. No more big paydays.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 2:58 PM PST reply actions
Rookies are not staying on their rookie deals for ever
They are going to have to get paid some day and we can’t just keep adding kids. Not arguing about not signing Okafor, I can understand that. But you keep saying that we are not going to pay anyone anymore and I have no idea how we are going to compete in the future then.
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
With the next batch of kids and
solid but cheap vets.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 3:02 PM PST up reply actions
I don't agree
I think we are gonna have to add a more than solid piece some time because we can’t solely depend on yougn players development. And again, thos kids are gonna have t o get paid after their rookie contratcs are up.
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
Been playing with trade machine
Trying to find a third team to possibly take Noc, after going through most contenders cant really find a logical third. I’m really on the fence about this one if we could offload Noc somehow i would feel much better about it but that dose not seem likely.
Keep Noc
Casspi and Greene are not just ready for extended prime time minutes yet. The present formula is working.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 3:01 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah keeping him right this minute looks good
But when Cisco and Kmart are back in the line up plus the improving play of Omri and Greene if we did this trade only seem logical to dump Noc considering his salary.
If we get Okafor, Noc is a good fit
No reason to trade him if we are back to winning. He fits well in our lineup and his salary no longer hurts us if we are abandoning the FA hunt. Unless we get offered a good deal for him, no reason to bleed talent.
Utah would take Noc for Harpring maybe?
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
I think they would and proposed that the other day
Harpring + the Knicks pick please :)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:33 PM PST up reply actions
either the Knicks pick or one of their good youngin's
Fesenko, Maynor, etc.
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
getting Maynor just to continue the > jokes with him on our own team would be funny and maybe ironic, but not sure on that one.
I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken
by joeytothelimit on Nov 14, 2009 5:29 PM PST up reply actions
I can see Harping + Utah pick, but not the Knicks one
War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.-1984 George Orwell.
Its true
wrist ligament damage. Its possible he may never really recover (possible)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:57 PM PST up reply actions
COME ON!
who needs K-MArt…. that wimp caan’t play D and Okeafor is a perfect fit for the kings’ aside of his contract.
The only other negative
I can think of would be that he is essentially a black-hole on offense… regarding Ball-Movement. basketbawful.com Often refers to how he does not particularly acquire assists at an even average rate.
Basically Okafor puts up a shot if he touches the ball in the post.
However, he finishes at an above average rate so I suppose that you would rather have Okafor doing what he does well (scoring at an above average rate) than trying to force him to do something that he does not do well (passing).
I do think this makes us an above average defensive team and a for sure Top-Flight rebounding team.
I would do this trade… We may not make the playoffs this year… but we would compete every night and the versatility that this move presents is tremendous. Also, it gives us a very solid man-man defender and allows Thompson/Hawes to block shots off the help-side.
I like it.
Blessings.Love.Peace
by lifestyleforthesellout on Nov 14, 2009 3:07 PM PST reply actions
Curious about system
I would be curious how much of that is the system he played in. The Bobcats had almost no weapons for most of his career and needed him to shoot. I wonder if he has the skills to play more of a team game and if his below average assist rate is partially the effect of being in an extremely inefficient offense.
I don't think Charlotte ran plays for him at all
…maybe the occasional kick out for his 16 foot jumper. Other than that, he gets those stats working his a$$ off for table scraps.
I don’t recall noticing him in the NO game.
he definitely is below average in his passing
but i think his D and scoring around the basket can make up for it. Besides, he would be the 5th option. Should’t have the ball that much. And he will be able to finish better with better teammates drawing opponents away.
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
Food for thought with Okafor
His career high for assists is 80. Jason Thompson last season had 93.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I have no idea how I feel about this possible trade
I’m all over the place on it. Thats a ton of money . . . .
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:52 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
My thoughts exactly
"Sometimes the capriciousness of youth anesthetizes common sense." -Let Geoff's words guide our patience this season.
by AnotherStupidSN on Nov 14, 2009 4:53 PM PST up reply actions
Interesting
He’s at least a top ten center, right? So, 11-14 millions seems like a pretty good deal for a top 10 center. He might be top 5.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 4:58 PM PST up reply actions
He'll be in his 'big man' prime the whole time too
(sigh) I don’t know.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:00 PM PST up reply actions
Noy only that
But you could argue this Kings team has more talent than his Bobcats team and really, more than the Hornets (except for CP3 of course)
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
I don't think you have to argue that at all
This team does have more talent than any bobcats team. I guess Richardson/Felton/Wallace was a decent lineup as is Diaw/Wallace/Bell/Felton, but I would still take our guys over either one.
doh!!…did I just lose an argument with myself??
NBA.com has him listed under Forwards, go figure
But, under the PTS/REB/Assts catagory he’s listed as 41st among Forwards and JT is listed as 13th.
Hawes is listed as 19th in the same catagory with a score of 19.4. Okafor’s score is listed as 20.5. Although the listing numbers of 19th and 41st can’t becompared because there for different positions. The score is calculated the same way for both positions, so they are pretty close in total score. Okafor’s score of 20.5 puts him around 17th among centers and only 2 spaces ahead of Hawes.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
If we want rebounding
The maybe we can look to the Blazers for Pyscbilla(sp?). I remember he had one of the best rebounding rates in the league.
I don’t know if Okefor’s back loaded 8 figure contract is worth it all. Especially when we will have to lock up JT and Hawes soon.
Hawes won't be on a new contract until 2011
He might not even get an extension. Any new contract with JT won’t happen until 2012. And any new contract with Tyreke Evans won’t happen until 2013.
So, relax.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
That is how it starts but
I just don’t want any repeats of all the long bad contracts. I like Okeafor but that big back ended contract is not enticing.
What do you think the hold up is?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Blazers probably want to keep Joel
Because Oden might be fragile
right
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:35 PM PST up reply actions
A word of warning my friends
Okafor is at best an average defender,he gave it 0 effort against the Blazers last night and stunk pretty bad. He also has a rep of being not popular whith his team mates due to dogging at practice and his black hole style of offense,I would rather see the KIngs pass on this one
by southern oregon on Nov 14, 2009 3:13 PM PST reply actions
Rep?
I’ve never heard this before. Any articles or anything you can link to?
Never forget: I am a complete idiot
It was in one of the "mess in NO " articles,I will see if I can find it but for sure
Oden and Aldridge abused him last night and he looked like he just didn’t care
by southern oregon on Nov 14, 2009 3:17 PM PST up reply actions
NO as a team doesn't look like they care
Great guy low moment. I mean Okafor always seemed to give great effort on some subpar Bobcat teams. NO is a mess right now and just fired their coach and replaced him with the GM. I wouldn’t read too much into Okafor giving mediocre effort last night. That team has quit on its ownership.
That's because George Shinn (hornets owner) is a piece of shit
I wouldn’t give that asshole gonorrhea.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Yes
Please keep the gonorrhea to yourself, don’t be spreading that crap
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
You aren't George Shinn
Don’t worry.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
But you said you wouldn't give Shinn gonorrhea
Ed isn’t Shinn, therefore he should be worried, right? He’d be safer from you if he was Shinn.
Never forget: I am a complete idiot
by Exhibit G on Nov 14, 2009 3:58 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
LOL
Got me.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
You should be worried as well G
I think you’re closer to Seattle than I am, right?
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
Don't forget
Pookey has a 1000 mile long schlong… You may have to worry after all…
by MustangMBS on Nov 15, 2009 7:15 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
No ed
Please forget it. TWSS
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
but Pookey
is a big fan of the ass – man
"I make love to pressure" - Stephen Jackson
I guess the rookie of the year honor was a sham.
The Hornets are in complete turmoil. Sound familiar. Last year our players didn’t put out 1/2 the effort they have this year by a long shot.
Its tough to play hard with no direction.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 3:37 PM PST up reply actions
I thought about our team last year too
Good observation nbn
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
Question
Can Okafor and Hawes play on the floor together?.
If yes, I say do it because we would have a perfect 3 man big rotation.
If not I vote no.
Yes
Part of why I like the trade. JT and Okafor would be sweet, as will Hawes & Okafor. Okafor’s ability to play both PF & C makes him a good fit
Is my banana fluffy enough?
by 27freethrows on Nov 14, 2009 3:36 PM PST up reply actions
+1
I think we better keep our young guys and let them play, a trade won’t put us in the Finals or in the Playoffs, let the kids play, we have some great chemistry in these young guys, they’re playing wonderful. If Okafor can play together with Hawes and adjust to the style of play then it’s fine with me, otherwise, no Okafor please.
The bigger question
Can Okafor and Brockman play on the floor together?
OK, just kidding :)
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 3:37 PM PST up reply actions
dont think that would be a problem either
not much offense though
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
That was funny. But I think they could, and we'd outrebound teams by 20 if they were out there at the same time.
Not that we’d win or anything.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Another Amick Fishing Trip?
Sam Amick of The Bee reports the Kings are discussing an Emeka Okafor-Kenny Thomas trade with the Hornets.
Hasn’t Amick predicted 20 of the last two Kings deals? A lot of these “proposed deals” end up being empty talk. If a deal does get done, though, I am sure Amick can give us a pretty good writeup.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 3:41 PM PST reply actions
He also stressed in his blog post that it's all discussion
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I trust anything Amicks says
100 times more than what any of the guys at ESPN do
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
Empty Talk
Um, that’s how trade proposals work. One side proposes a deal, the other side might counteroffer, both sides discuss and consider, and either a deal happens or it doesn’t. More often than not, deals don’t happen. Don’t blame same for reporting on the process of how NBA trades work.
Never forget: I am a complete idiot
Depends
whether they are actually “talks” or just rumors of same.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 4:01 PM PST up reply actions
Sam's report
Say the Kings are considering the offer that the Hornets made. If there’s an offer out there, I don’t understand where the controversy is.
Never forget: I am a complete idiot
I don't either CC
I don’t really get what Sam did here that is so unusual. Reporters report this stuff. So do blogs. What’s the problem?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
My point
These prospective deals rarely get done, and often aren’t even discussed.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 4:40 PM PST up reply actions
Sure sounds like the Hornets came to us with a proposal
but hard to know
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:41 PM PST up reply actions
I mean, why in Gods name
would we think a guy they just traded for was available? I think they came to us.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:43 PM PST up reply actions
I think CC is saying that he thinks
Sam made up the rumor. Maybe he’s been watching the last season of “The Wire”.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 4:48 PM PST up reply actions
Ohhhh -
Huh? What?
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:50 PM PST up reply actions
He said
Another Amick Fishing Trip?
and
These prospective deals rarely get done, and often aren’t even discussed.
(emphais mine)
Which looks to me like he thinks Sam is making this up. “Fishing” and the trade has not even been “discussed”(by the Kings and Hornets).
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 4:53 PM PST up reply actions
Is this the same source?
That told Amick Artest would be traded for Bass and Stackhouse?
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 5:01 PM PST up reply actions
I don't trust the beat writer for the team
that is usually the first to break any kind of news either
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
BS antenna has to go up
when the word “source” is mentioned.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 5:08 PM PST up reply actions
Not necessarily.
His source might be, or might just be passing along something secondhand.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 5:26 PM PST up reply actions
Wow
If you don’t want to believe news based on an unnamed source being quoted, then you might want to steer clear of NBA coverage, or any sports or news coverage for that matter.
Never forget: I am a complete idiot
Seriously
Most trade rumors come from unnamed sources, including the ones that eventually go through. Sources remain unnamed because they can get in trouble for saying anything. Reporters that use them get a lot of shit and for no good reason. There are way more proposed trades that get turned down than there are trades that go through. So when anonymous sources share their info most of the time they will be wrong.
www.mancancook.net
They usually leak sources because
the team is interested to see about fan reaction. Especially if it’s coming from the Kings.
I would not be surprised if someone from Kings management is staking out sites such as this one, and others, just to see what the fans complaints are.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
pookeyliscious!
oh, I mean I don’t think that’s true.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 6:30 PM PST up reply actions
What did Whisenant say?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I was giving a possible example of management leaking out information to gauge a possible fan reaction.
IMO, I thought that is what the Kings did a few summers ago when the Maloofs were interested in hiring Whisenant.
Yeah a good point Nerd
I didn’t think about it that way, but that’s probably what they did do. Although, it seemed to me in the aftermath of that that it was more the Maloof’s trying to convince Geoff Petrie and he said why not Eric Musselman instead?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I have no problem having my idiocy stack up against yours VB
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
the source
i’ve noticed when it is a “team source” it does not usually go through, but if it is a “league” source there is a much higher probability.
Bird in the hand...
…is worth more than two in the bush.
TAKE THIS OPPORTUNITY and we’re a playoff caliber roster when healthy.
I'm part of the bandwagon...
…of Petrie using available cap flexibility to make a trade rather than to overpay for a free agent next summer (or the summer after).
This deal would make sense in a lot of ways…the team gets a solid defensive presence in the frontcourt to compliment their new tougher attitude. This, and the Kings recent play, would probably get some more butts in the seat – as you could make the case that this team could make a playoff run in the next season or two. Get the excitement back at Arco, make some money…and the amount you’re paying Okafor won’t be as painful down the road.
And if Tyreke ends up being a super-duper star rather than just the star we expect, you’d have to think that the pieces around him in two or three seasons (JT, Kevin, Omri, Okafor primarily) might be enough to get them into the upper echelon.
But man, that’s a lot of money for a guy that doesn’t seem to have improved from a quick start to his career.
Ultimately, it’s a risk, but might be a risk worth taking. At worst, you’ve still improved your team (IMO) without getting older. But you may have hurt yourself long-term on the cap front.
I guess that’s my long-winded way of saying I’M IN.
there are a lot of teams looking to challenge the size of title-contenders
so, if okafor can be had for expiring contracts, then maybe the kings can turn KTEC into something more valuable, like a smaller expiring contract and more draft picks.
and i wonder why this was leaked. maybe the kings prefer to facilitate a 3-way deal.
for example, the bulls can’t trade jerome james to the hornets for okafor; however, they can trade jerome james for kenny thomas; and kenny thomas can be traded for okafor. (and i don’t think this will actually happen as the Bulls are hoping to free up enough cap space for a run at D-Wade)
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
Im not a hornet's fan
but i get the impression that they’re in a similar situation to where we were before.
bad financial situation – some bad contracts in peja (sorry dude!), posey and mo pete. . and they have too many vets to think they’re going “to grow”. . plus .they’re over the luxury tax (judging by atthehive?). . .
okafor hasnt quite paid off for them. . .posey definitely didnt pay off.
with CP3 out and their record already sucking, there just in dire straits.
whether or not to pull the trigger on this trade i dunno.. but to me it looks like they’re in desperation mode
Get CP3!
;) :) :)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:38 PM PST up reply actions
yeah, I could live with it :p)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:03 PM PST up reply actions
Don't know
I think it all hinges on whether you think this team plus Emeka Okafor is playoff bound. I think it probably turns the team into a fringe playoff team. But if the trade goes through you’re basically out of ways to drastically improve the team. You’re probably looking at a middling draft pick and possibly (but not likely) the MLE for the next few years. I think going through with this would basically consign the team to mediocrity.
I like it in theory, but he’s just overpaid, and this team is already past its limit on overpaid, unmovable veterans.
by nbrans on Nov 14, 2009 4:16 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
That's how I feel as well
I think Okafor makes the Kings a playoff team, but not a championship contender. Making the playoffs is cool, but the ultimate goal is to win a championship.
"I'm too weird ta live but much too rare ta die"
by aKingisBored on Nov 15, 2009 6:15 PM PST up reply actions
step by step
That’s how rebuilding projects like this occur. Of course Emeka Okafor doesn’t by himself automatically make the Kings (or any team) a championship contender. There’s only about 4 players in the NBA who could do that.
But we have a major problem with interior defense. We also have a problem with rebounding. That can’t continue if we’re going to get on the road to the promised land, and Okafor addresses both of these areas nicely.
From there, Tyreke Evans, Jason Thompson and Omri Casspi will have to grow as players, and there’s some real indication that can happen.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
Would someone with some patience
look and see how he has done against the better big men in the league? I’d ignore this year’s number as the Hornets are in disarray.
How has he matched up against Jefferson, Bynum, gasol, Oden, Kaman etc..? The guys from teams we need to beat?
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
Last Year
vs Portland 20pts / 8reb / 2 blks / 64% FG% per game
vs. LAL 15.5 / 10 / 2 / 56.3%
vs. MN 16.5 / 7.5 / 2.5 / 59.1%
he sucked against Denver and Houston
reference: http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/okafoem01/splits/2009/
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
I wonder what was going on in Denver and Houston. Was Yao playing then?
His best game was against Washington, 29 points 18 boards. By the way his full name is Chukwuemeka Noubuisi Okafor. Also, are we collecting Nigerians? Isn’t Ime Udoka from there too?
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
Ime Udoka is from Portland
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
sorry. He is of Nigerian descent though, no?
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
Mind if I use this in my write up 4-3?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I just used their filter online
the basketball-reference people did all the hard work, go nuts :)
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
Heh
I went another way anyway.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Sort of.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Even though he only scored 2 points in Denver on Nov 11 last year he still had 8 defensive boards and 4 blocks
not sure what his problem shooting was, but everyone has off nights. he played 30 mins and shot it only 5 times though.
Another flaw in the human character is that everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance. Vonnegut
We would need to understand if we get Okafor we are not getting him for his O anyway. He is a slightly better offensive and slightly worse defensive version of Ben Wallace back in his Piston days. He would bring toughness, rebounding, D and the ability to finish; however, he’s not a player who can create his own shot unless he is in an extreme mismatch.
2nd question
With a three man frontcourt rotation of JT, Okafur and Hawes (with some Brockness) and a guard lineup of Martin, Tyreke, Cisco and Beno + Noce + Casspi/Donte’ at the SF
Who exactly waaay outclasses us talent and depth-wise?
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
...plus Petrie's deft drafting moving forward...
"Sometimes the capriciousness of youth anesthetizes common sense." -Let Geoff's words guide our patience this season.
by AnotherStupidSN on Nov 14, 2009 4:52 PM PST up reply actions
Tell me how good Tyreke and JT are going to be
and that question is answerable.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
JT is going to be a solid double double guy
and a marginal All-Star a few times.
Tyreke??
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:58 PM PST up reply actions
If we get Okefor
presumably our chances of landing a superstar via the lottery go down. So. you’re always going to be outclassed on superstars if Tyreke isn’t one, if we get Okefor.
Of course, there are no guarantees we’d get one if we don’t do the trade, but undoubtedly the chances are worse.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
Its starting to look like we'll (only?) be picking 6-10 to me
for whatever thats worth
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:15 PM PST up reply actions
And looking at next year's draft
That’s not a bad place to pick. WE also have some dude named Geoff Petrie making the picks. That helps a bit I think
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
More likely 10-20
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 5:27 PM PST up reply actions
after adding Okafor I'd think that in the teens will be a sure thing
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:58 PM PST up reply actions
did the last lottery teach you nothing?
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 8:08 AM PST up reply actions
It taught me that having the best odds means nothing
therefore having the worst odds must mean everything. :)
There's nothing to fear but everything.
LTTG, marginal All-Stars don't grow on trees
anymore than 20/10 players do.
"I make love to pressure" - Stephen Jackson
Let's make a quick comparison with the Blazers
In the future it would be
Reke vs. Miller
Kevin vs. Roy
Noc vs. Webster
JT vs. Alridge
Okafor vs, Oden
Bench: Hawes, Cisco, Omri, Beno, Donte, Brockman vs. Priz, Blake, Outlaw, Fernandez, Bayless
That comparison looks pretty even to me.
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
Crap, I don't know, I keep going back-and-forth on this
My initial reaction was “Sweet, there’s our third big, we’re good to go”, plus I’ve always sort of been an Okafor fan since I had him on my fantasy team when he was a rookie.
As I was reading this thread, other considerations came to mind; mainly, I’m wondering if Okafor is enough of an upgrade in our starting lineup over Hawes to warrant the huge contract. If Hawes then becomes a beast of a sixth man and our frontline is the envy of the entire league, will we be able to pay him enough to keep him or will we have to let him go? In a way, I feel like our best-case-scenario in adding Okafor would give us a window of being a contender only until Hawes gets his payday.
I guess I’m still holding-out hope that Hawes will someday fairly soon be better than Okafor and our Shock and Hawes frontline is the envy of the league, in which case we would give Spence and JT their paydays and move forward with our current core and look for other (much less expensive and restrictive ways) to get a third big that might not be quite as productive as Emeka, but will be enough to get us into that elusive top tier.
I really don’t know. I suppose the only thing we can all agree on is that it would be a bit of a gamble. I’m not sure if the Maloofs care much for gambling.
"Sometimes the capriciousness of youth anesthetizes common sense." -Let Geoff's words guide our patience this season.
by AnotherStupidSN on Nov 14, 2009 4:51 PM PST reply actions
I just said the same earlier
I’m all over the place on this idea. I really need to know if he can have those double double games against good competition or its padding from bad teams.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 4:55 PM PST up reply actions
He's a 17.5-18 PER guy
that’s not going to be entirely against bad teams.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
Even if he can
I think an equally pertinent question is “By some point next season, will Spence be having double double games against the good teams?”
If so, is adding Okafor worth his contract? Or could we just be excited about our Shock and Hawes and then get a more-than-decent third big for less money?
"Sometimes the capriciousness of youth anesthetizes common sense." -Let Geoff's words guide our patience this season.
by AnotherStupidSN on Nov 14, 2009 4:58 PM PST up reply actions
I think Spence will always struggle to keep his RB
better than 1 every 3.6 minutes. I see him as a 15-18 point guy and 9 RBs if he gets to 36 mpg. Very solid, but still not the Defender or RBer Okafor is, but they could pair together nicely
Jamba Juicy Rumor...
I am on the fence on this trade. On one hand, Hawes development has been disappointing. He can still be good, but he is not showing the growth to his game that the organization had to have hoped to see. if we are molding our team around toughness and defense, which I think we are, then Emeka fits.
On the other hand, I would like to see Emeka score more out of the low post, but he was averaging 18 points a game, and not 14 over his career, he probably wouldn’t be available. Emeka seems rather mechanical and limited in the way he plays. I think he has reached the ceiling of his ability. He’s 27 years old, at the peak of his skills, and he is not exactly tearing up the league. And for 60 million, I would like my low post player be worthy of a double team.
Other points to consider IMO are:
The Fakers are still the team to beat in the West. Bynum and Gasol and Odom are ridiculously long in the paint. We add a player like Emeka we really shore up our competitiveness down low. Blazers and Nuggets aren’t exactly slouches at the ‘4’ and ‘5’ spots either.
Lets say hypothetically the Raptors are going to lose Bosh for nothing, a strong possibility, this offseason. Emeka could be a trade chip to make a run at Bosh in a sign and trade.
If we do this trade, we are instantly a playoff contender IMO. Who would have fathomed that possibility even one week ago?
The more I think about this I think this deal is a PASS. Unless it is a no-brainer, I think we will be rewarded for being patient and pragmatic, instead of rolling the dice on a cap-killing slight to moderate upgrade.
by bench_blob on Nov 14, 2009 5:03 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Here's the thing
Okafor brings EXACTLY what this team has been lacking for SOOOO Long. Shotblocking, even MORE rebounding, and a guy that can CLOG the middle and defend the bigger centers in the league. He’s signed on for 4 more years after this one(I don’t count this one, cuz we’re paying Kenny this year regardless). If we SIGNED a player in FA with that money(the 10-15 million we could potentially have)consider this, it’s AT LEAST a 5 year deal for the TYPE of player we’re targeting – so dealing for Okafor cuts a year off of that financial committment. Second, look around at the free agents, after Bosh, Bron and Wade is there a single player that would fit WITH this Kings roster AND have the same amount of impact as Okafor? Amare? Boozer? JJ? Maybe, but I don’t think they bring what we NEED. Okafor does. I think this is a deal you HAVE to make to make that stride forward. I see Okafor as LOCKED up for the next 4 years, not a noose around our necks(and if that did happen, he’ll probably be in the last year or two of his contract anyways.
no doubt
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:20 PM PST up reply actions
So, that's perfect
In 5 years when Okafor’s deal is done, Hawes will be in his prime. ;p
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 5:21 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
you laugh but...
that’s actually a pretty solid plan
the only downside being 2 years of overlap where both Okefor and Spencer would be getting paid well would be tough.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
very
Of course that last year he’d be an ‘expiring’ as well with something left in the tank you’d think.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:26 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, I don't disagree
Just thought it was funny. My hunch is, however, that if Okefor ends up a King, Spencer doesn’t come back for another contract.
probably right
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:29 PM PST up reply actions
He'd be an RFA...
…so it’s the Kings DECISION whether they want him back or not. Which he’d be an EXCELLENT complement to Okafor.
Sham Sports has it as an ETO which is a player option
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 5:32 PM PST up reply actions
Its His option
you know what that means
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:33 PM PST up reply actions
Well, maybe
he’ll play so well over the next 4 years, that 14 mil will seem like chicken scratch and he’ll opt out :)
pretty standard $$ for a good Center
David Lee will get that same money more or less as has been mentioned elsewhere and he plays no defense.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:56 PM PST up reply actions
Agree
I mean we are talking about a big who will be in his prime for the entire contract and who does exactly what you want a big to do – rebound and play D, without taking anything off the table offensively.
Is the trade with George ZImmer? Y'all want a guarantee?
Look up the cremasteric reflex.
Give an opinion, make a decision. It is okay, Geoff and Jason are going to do what they think is best anyway (pending Maloof approval).
No one knows if this would work. We are talking about last season’s worst team, which may be this year’s least talented squad, and is young. Predictions range from 15-21 wins from the ESPN-experts, up to 30+ by the most optimistic here.
This is an upgrade in talent, a defensive presence but a large cost that will hamper (maybe influence is better) any near future FA deals. It is a huge commitment on cap space and to some extent team solvency.
My take is: if the money is there, I think this is one of the best deals around, a starting 5 with solid numbers, good durability, good attitude history, and a guy in his career prime. He is no superstar but is getting what will be the future of superstar contracts. You give up Kenny Thomas. Do it, please.
This puts us at what $52-3 mil in salary next year
Just where we are now? Hmmmm That pretty much just leaves mid-level money left assuming no Noce for expirings deal.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:25 PM PST up reply actions
I wonder if from a business perspective
you’d want to wait and see what happens to revenue in the short term.
The team is on a high with (what we hope) to be a bright future – but are the Kings making more money?
If you’re not generating revenue even when the teams on the rise you’d have to wonder whether bringing in another huge contract of a good-decent-but-not-awesome player is going to help.
As in, would Okafor change it dramatically such that you’re going to draw crowds in? I’d be interested to ask any of you guys who are Sacto natives what’s keeping the fans who used to go from coming now? Is it the winning or a draw card gem of a player that people want to watch? (most likely an overlap between the two?).
Most of us (if not all) are absolutely stoked at the fact that we’re 1 game over .500. . .thats because we’ve had low expectations. . .u bring in Okafor and i wonder if all of a sudden expectations change from .500 being awesome to .500 being crap and we should be able to hang with Portland/Lakers/.
If the Kings are managing to make money from becoming the rags-to-riches-feel-good-cinderella team who people never thought would make it to .500. . .i actually think i’d hold off on Okafor, and keep going thru the draft to build.
But like other people have said already. . i cant really make up my mind on this one.
by Spoz of Oz on Nov 14, 2009 5:25 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Wins will bring more fans
Okafer would maybe (maaaybe) get us into marginal playoff contention. Its starting to look like we’ll be picking 6-10, Okafur would get us to the 8-10th spot in the West. Thats picking 14-17 (or something)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:29 PM PST up reply actions
lttg, quick question
not bashing or anything but I want to know if you do it on purpose or not. You know you’re always mispelling players names right? Okafer, Okafur? You call Lamar Odom, Lamar Odem too? Jsut out of curiosity
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
Just rattling it off
not sending any messages
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:39 PM PST up reply actions
All good
I always wondered, that’s it
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
you can't have it both ways
to wait for the team to generate money before doing a deal – means a deal will not happen for a very long time.
If the deal is on the table – it has a time limit. My only preference on waiting is wait until the current win streak is over (next game?) before pulling the trigger so the first loss isn’t hung on the deal.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:03 PM PST up reply actions
Not sure there is a time limit
Who else besides the Kings can make this deal?
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:11 AM PST up reply actions
every deal has a time limit
and every deal has it’s detractors – those who wish it never happened v. those who wish it had.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 8:14 AM PST up reply actions
You didn't answer my question
Who else besides the Kings can make this deal? Do we have the Hornets over the barrel? If so, maybe they can sweeten the deal.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 9:19 AM PST up reply actions
I can't answer your question because it is unanswerable
not only don’t we know whom else can make this deal based on salary reduction (as this is a salary dump a lâ Shinn and nothing else for the Hornets) we can’t know what some other teams’ version of Kenny Thomas is. Is it Carlos Boozer? David Lee?
Sweeten the deal? One of our core players for your expiring contract – but it is going to cost you long term – any sweeter, talent speaking, and we are going to have to factor in some insulin.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 10:06 AM PST up reply actions
More like
NO: We’re drowning here: can you please take some pity on us and help us out and take this overpaid guy who we’ve lost confidence in after just 10 games off our hands?
US: Sorry, but you’re going to have to sweeten the deal to make taking on that bloated contract a little more practical.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 10:22 AM PST up reply actions
Could it possibly be that California has one of the worst economies in the country?
And the first thing some people cut back on our things like overpriced NBA tickets, etc.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 14, 2009 6:29 PM PST up reply actions
That's certainly a big factor
and the price of tickets is no help. Not sure how many $10 (really $12.50) tickets they sell ever game, but they should probably increase that by another 1,000 and scale their other prices down as well.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:13 AM PST up reply actions
I hate that they call them $10 tickets
and charge that stupid facility fee. If you cannot pay less than $12.50 for a ticket it is not a $10 ticket.
I don't like it...
OK, so I’ve been reading here now for years but this one has me commenting for the first time.
I’m not a fan of this deal.
First, Okafor has taken how many games to write his ticket out of town? That’s right, 10. And that’s even considering his new coach is apparently the guy who traded for him. Reports already surfaced that he wasn’t winning over teammates because he didn’t practice when he could have in the preseason (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=mc-okaforhornets102209&prov=yhoo&type=lgns). Combine that with the fact that he seems to be a little bit of a black hole on offense, can’t consistently hit a mid-range jumper which is important if J.T. gets touches down low and Tyreke and Martin get into the lane, plus has the obvious contract issues and that alone makes me vote no.
Further, while I agree we aren’t getting Wade, James, or Bosh, I’m not sure we can count ourselves out when it comes to guys like, say, David Lee. Would you rather have Lee for a similar and possibly smaller contract? It seems like we might be in play for 2nd tier guys, especially if we play somewhat competitively.
Also, while we may not get a team to make a Pau Gasol type deal, there could be something out there later in the year that we don’t know about yet. And even if it doesn’t happen this year, cap space can be used in a trade in the offseason when teams seem more willing to deal. So we don’t need Kenny Thomas’ expiring contract to essentially use his expiring contract.
I find it hard to believe that Okafor is our absolute option.
Good argument
DLee, whatever you think of his rebounding, doesn’t play defense at all. So there’s that.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:31 PM PST up reply actions
let's just say - instead of DLee - it is Milwaukee on the phone and the are waving Andrew Bogut
or the Warriors and it is Andres Beidrins. Who of the 3 do you want (I am too lazy to search every team for a high dollar average or better 5, you get the idea).
If you don’t grab Okafor – and he is not a superstar but a known solid starter – who do you all expect to get? You can wait it out, draft a big in the lottery, or…
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:07 PM PST up reply actions
Just so you know, the Warriors will not give up Biedrins for nothing unless he's in a wheelchair
It’s fun to deal in hypotheticals of what players might be available, but limiting the players involved to those that could reasonably be moved in a deal like this makes a whole lot more sense.
The amount of times that a team has been willing to give up a starting quality big man who hasn’t peaked for financial relief in today’s NBA could be counted on one hand.
I agree, its a good argument
we are giving up options. For what its worth though, on this team, I’d rather have Okefor than David Lee, and I’m not convinced Lee will be that much cheaper.
Its not a slam dunk we should do it, a case can definitely be made for flexibility and something better will present itself.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
David Lee v. Emeka Okafor.
Hey, I’ll be the first to admit that I am a bonafied David Lee lover but…. his offensive numbers are horribly inflated by the fact that he plays in a Mike D’ Antoni system. His rebound numbers are great but so were Olden Polynese’s- a big man on a team with no other big man can get 5-6 rebounds a game just off of missed free-throws. Lee is a very good rebounder but he plays little to no defense. Okafor is an equal or better rebounder with amazing position defense and shot blocking skills. Add to this a starting salary of 10 million that Lee is going to get as an unrestricted FA and I think these two players are a lot more even than you think. Now add to this that 10 teams are probably lining up to pay Lee this off-season when the stars re-sign with their current clubs.
What does all of this mean? Emeka Okafor might be a King because he has no choice, David Lee has a choice and hense will never be a King.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
David Lee
I’m not sure I made my point really clear when I mentioned David Lee. I’m not necessarily saying David Lee is a great fit on this team and would be our best option, my point with him is that while we won’t be in play for the top free agents, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to think that we will be in play for some second tier guys who might be better values than Okafor. So we will have SOME options. Earlier comments seemed to say that since we probably won’t get James, Wade, or Bosh, we might as well scrap free agency. I don’t think that we should eliminate the idea of free agency because King James isn’t coming. Just one of my thoughts that for me added up to not being thrilled with the idea of Okafor.
No one is coming from NY to Sac
no one in demand anyway. The point is, do we have a chance at a good big man other than by trade? I doubt it. I’d suggest Tyrus thomas might be available from the Bulls but I can’t think of anyone else.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:52 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think
David Lee is going to get $10 million a year when the economy sucks, attendance is dropping, salaries are down and he is competing with a big class of prospective free agents.
I think the megastars like LeBron will continue to get big money, but the non All-Stars are going to be looking at deals in the $7 mil-$10 mil range.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:19 AM PST up reply actions
Teams always find a way to overpay
and that’s the situation we find ourselves with Okafor. Will we be paying for someone else’s spending?
There's nothing to fear but everything.
How about Okafor and Collison for Thomas and Hawes?
Not that I’m giving up on Hawes but I think we save some money here and get at the least a solid backup point guard at least in Collision (maybe even a starter). I think we save some money too swapping Hawes for Collison. IMO Hawes is a backup on a playoff team.
We have a back-up PG
though I’m a fan of Collison
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:34 PM PST up reply actions
Hawes is now
but he is 21; you can’t forget that when thinking long term.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
Bad deal
Now all of a sudden your front court is less versatile than pre-deal and you’ve also wasted the Kenny Thomas chip while gaining a third-string point guard. Nope.
If the Okafor deal makes sense, it only does so in the context of having three capable big men that you can rotate.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 5:44 PM PST up reply actions
yep
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 5:45 PM PST up reply actions
agreed
You give them nothing else and maybe ask for a 2nd rounder.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 5:54 PM PST up reply actions
Agreed
unless we can get Collison without giving up Hawes. Which might be kinda feasible since they save $40 million
www.mancancook.net
Yup...Hawes is young but has a history of knee problems
I might be the minority but I like Evans at the 2 spot like Dwade but getting his share of time running the show.
Agree with original Ziller post
For this year: I can’t even imagine the defensive potential of Evans, Noce, JT and Okafor together as starters. The tissue label would definitely be history.
Evans may not be there yet defensively, but he’s well on his way.
I think they become contenders for the 8th spot this year with this move. Utah and New Orleans look like they have big probs.
There I said it. Hopeful thinking.
How is Oke a difference maker
What in his NBA track record makes anyone think this guy is a difference maker?
by BeAll on Nov 14, 2009 6:15 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
He'd be a missing piece
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 6:16 PM PST up reply actions
NBA Rule #2,495
“You’re NBA track record cannot be taken too seriously if you’ve ever played for the Charlotte Bobcats”
www.mancancook.net
by vfettke on Nov 14, 2009 6:17 PM PST up reply actions 7 recs
I admit I don't know his game super well
But from what Ive seen, he plays solid D, he’s a strong rebounder and shot blocker, and overall intimidating presence in the paint. One of biggest problems on D is interior; even though I think JT is coming along nicely if he could avoid fouls and stay on his feet a little more. He jumps a lot on defense.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 14, 2009 6:19 PM PST up reply actions
Can you imagine
a guy like Tony Parker getting into the paint on us and having to deal with Jason Thompson AND Emeka Okafor
www.mancancook.net
I think we need to consider,
that by becoming a possible playoff contender, we are much more apt to keep the Kings in Sactown.
Can the team really wait 2 more years?
Free agency will be a bust for this team. Marque players want to play in big markets due to endorsement deals.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 6:17 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Now THAT
I couldn’t agree with more
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 6:18 PM PST up reply actions
Not to mention...
…the DRAFT is ALWAYS a crap shoot. You HOPE you get a player as good as Okafor in the draft. Here we have just that.
LOL
and Cache Creek Casino.
I heard Eddie Money is playing there!
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 6:20 PM PST up reply actions
You'd think that the Maloofs could draw bigger name free agents
simply by saying “We’re going to put a giant picture of you on the side of the Palms Casino and name a suite after you.” I’d sign with the Kings for that alone… and a VIP booth at the Playboy Club
www.mancancook.net
I think they already get the VIP booth
but funny
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 6:25 PM PST up reply actions
I'm not sure how well they play that card,
but I often wondered that myself.
They need to do a better job on cross marketing.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 6:25 PM PST up reply actions
Going forward how does Okafor rate as a big man?
KG, Duncan, Shaq, Sheed . . . possibly Yao and Brand could be out of the league or vaguely ineffective in 2/3 years. Where does Okafor rank amongst the next crop of NBA big men?
Boozer is unrestricted free agent
His game is superior to Emeka, and the low post presence we need. 27 years old, active, talented, Kings would have a shot at him as a next level FA. I would rather commit $50 million to a player like Boozer, plus another Petrie lottery pick, than Emeka and a middle first rounder.
Last 5 games for Boozer
20 points
12 rebs
64% FG
He's a terrible defender
sign me up for Okefor who doesn’t require the ball a ton (Tyreke and Kevin need the ball plenty) over Boozer for this team.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
a related question: do you think it is easier/better to field a defensive team and acquire offensive firepower
or the other way around?
The weakest link for these Kings to be defense oriented is the middle. JT is not a shot blocker, Hawes is growing into whatever role he is growing into. Oh, and then you have Sean May and Kenny Thomas.
Why the trepidation?
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:13 PM PST up reply actions
I think there's trepidation
because the easiest way to mess up your salary structure is pay a lot of money for mediocrity.
You only get a couple $12+mil guys on your team, there should be a lot of careful consideration whether or not Okefor will fit the team well before we make this deal.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
yes, but the time to decide is now
flip a coin, wring your hands – second guessing is par for the course – but the decision is – take the chance of being much better right away, or just take the slower, less expensive risk of getting better through the draft.
Who else will be available? Will there a better deal next week? month? summer? probably. but maybe not.
Here is my guarantee: (non)Buyer’s remorse will be evident either way – whether they do the deal or they don’t.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:26 PM PST up reply actions
And,
unless we trade up in the draft we will not fix this problem.
Centers usually take more time to develop than the other positions.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 7:39 PM PST up reply actions
that say about point guards too...
look at this year’s crop – Jennings, Tyreke, Flynn, Ty Lawson all are performing admirably on winning (oops, not TWolves) teams.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 6:46 AM PST up reply actions
I watched Emeka tonight against the Hawks
…he did not impress me. The Hawks were scoring at will in the paint. Emeka doesn’t have a low post game or passing skills. He’s not even as big as JT, at least as far as I could tell. He runs the court well, but just going through the motions. Obviously his stats are respectable, but he stopped improving as a player. Hornets don’t want him after 10 games. To me, thats two red flags.
Boozer is not a terrible defender. He’s slightly below average, granted. But he demands a double team, he rebounds, he finishes, and he’s an intense team guy. I am not saying he is an ideal addition, but he would vastly improve our offensive spacing. He would take a lot of Hawes minutes, so its not like our defense would suffer dramatically.
What?
he’s an intense team guy
This couldn’t be any further from the truth. Boozer is a money grubbing whore who talked his way out of a final year in Cleavland so they could sign him to a long term deal only to jump ship and sign with Utah for more cash. Once in Utah, it took a mere 51 games before he checked out with a questionable injury (a hamstring pull) and got into media wars with the teams owner over the injury. The same injury continued into the next season forcing him to miss the first 49 games of the season- again, under questionable circumstances.
Boozer has shown that he is not a team guy. He doesn’t play defense at all and although I wouldn’t mind trading Kenny Thomas and Noccioni for him, it would strictly be to dump more salary. The Kings have offense, what they need is a big time defender. Okafor is expensive but what he brings is a consistent presence in the middle.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
also
Boozer won’t be signing with Sacramento. Or I guess I should say, the odds are very long.
Also, Okafor is bigger than JT. Emeka is about 10 lbs. heftier and he’s much longer. In fact I looked it up and Okafor has a freakin 7’4" wingspan!
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
Everybody on the Hornets is going through the motions.
I have no doubt that if Okafor was on the Kings, he’d play his heart out for Coach W and easily become one of the fan favorites.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Boozer an intense team guy?
He’s made it loud and clear that he’s in the NBA for the money, dude.
Interesting
But I don’t see the Kings winning a free agency bid for Boozer unless he’s stinks the rest of the season and no one else wants him.
by bignerd on Nov 14, 2009 6:49 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Because this simply must be posted here
I’ll link to it since it’s big: Best.Thing.Ever.
by dprodigy19 on Nov 15, 2009 10:28 PM PST up reply actions 3 recs
Yeah, lets do that
I’m sure he’ll jump at the $6 mil of cap we have to offer him in free agency!
A More Likely Scenario
Maybe I am wrong, but I think the economy is shifting the discussion and deepening the divide between haves and have nots. You see the empty seats all around the league, and I just think the flood of guys hitting the next market are not going to get paid like they think they are. Yes, that includes guys like David Lee.
In this scenario, Okafor is grossly overpaid, particularly for a second-tier market. What might be more likely if these rumors are remotely true is the Kings being part of multiple-team trade that also involved the Hornets where the Kings trade Kenny for Okafor, then add Nocioni and trade Nocioni and Okafor and get back an $18-20 million expiring contract from a third team.
So it would have to be a team that thinks it’s a couple of players away from a title or title contention that also has an expiring contract or contracts that equals the number above. I’m not sure anyone fits that bill, but I thought I would throw it into the mix.
If that were possible, we’d end up with an even bigger pile of cash to sit on or help the Maloofs weather the storm with without weakening our team much. Udoka, Omri and Greene would handle the SF duties, and though the last two would make a lot of mistakes, they would also add a lot of excitement that would be contagious. And they would certainly grow up more quickly.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 6:53 PM PST reply actions
I agree the "NBA economy"
is something we don’t know enough about. If its true team economics are as bad as it seems like they could be across the league, than this is a mistake, because we’re paying full price for merchandise that will be half off this summer or at this time next year.
In an environment where prices (player contracts) are getting cheaper, the most valuable thing you can have is cash. If we don’t do this trade, it could mean:
a) the Maloofs finances are not getting better or looking like they will
or
b) the NBA economy is worse off than the league wants to let on
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
the future money isnt the concern here - the Maloofs are either ready to commit the money or not
the question is: is ths going to make the team significantly better for the money spent? If the only way you make a deal is searching the bargain bins, then yes, keep looking and good luck to you.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:16 PM PST up reply actions
you don't make a good deal
if it costs you the chance to do a great deal you think its very likely you will have the opportunity to do.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
that is a real big maybe
what is your other deal?
You decide to trade the #31 pick for Sergio and #38 – ooops! #37 has DeJuan Blair available… bad deal? it is the chance you took.
In the case, you take Okafor – the known quantity, solid starter or you pass, keep the cash, and cross your fingers that you will pick a superstar in the lottery.
I can take the Ouija board out again if you like….
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:34 PM PST up reply actions
You're making the assumption you know all the possiblities
you don’t, you don’t have enough information.
What I am saying is, if the Kings believe the economics have changed in the NBA, and the cash to pay players won’t be there this summer, it is foolish to take on an additional current market value contract.
The question is their opinion of the meta-environment of the league. None of us know that. This isn’t saving your money for the bargain bin, it is making a judgement whether or not the NBA world has changed.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
I am playing devil's advocate - partially arguing for arguement's sake. As for information, it is all that is available at the moment.
I think we agree on the premise; this is a gamble. The unaswerable question is – is it worth it?
and you know the answer- you rolls the dice and you takes your chances. Or you put your hands in your pockets and walk away and wait for the next deal which may or may not arrive.
I know you must play the market – do you buy KNG stock or wait to buy it later in the year? It may go up, it may come down, you might want to buy a different option. Buying or not buying are both decisions. I am for the option of buying what the Hornets are selling.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 8:20 PM PST up reply actions
I am not saying we shouldn't make the trade
extending the market analogy…stocks in November of last year looked pretty cheap. If you were reasonably sure the market was going to go down further, would you have bought then, or waited until March when they were cheaper, knowing you couldn’t get out of your investment for 5 years?
It could turn out buying in November was smart, it probably will work, but you could be missing out on a historically good opportunity that isn’t too far away. That’s all I’m saying we don’t know.
As for my personal opinion, if coolcat’s scenario isn’t on the table, and this is NBA business as usual, I would make the trade. I think its good value, and Okefor is worth the money. If the NBA owners are all hurting bad enough though, (the Maloofs should have a feel for this), then I’m passing and waiting for the Armegeddon scenario to play out with cash ready to spend.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
by ForThree on Nov 15, 2009 7:07 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
well said and we agree
If discussions have started then the Maloofs have considered spending the money – a big hurdle passed.
As for the NBA economy – not looking birght, but you bring up the relevant wording: has it hit bottom? Projected cap for next is forecast as $50M which means that the Kings are committed to be over the cap after dumping as much salary as possible earlier this year.
Other teams will be looking to firesale their assets at some point, because no one will want to be taxed. The Maloofs got NBA loan money last year – I am sure it came with some directives, like don’t be over the cap, but who knows? Maybe the NBA becomes a bit like MLB – you have the $50M (or $45M or $40M) teams and the LA Lakers and the NY Knicks with $100M salaries.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 7:20 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Also agree with this
Maybe the NBA becomes a bit like MLB – you have the $50M (or $45M or $40M) teams and the LA Lakers and the NY Knicks with $100M salaries.
And it’s pretty easy to see where the Kings fit in that scenario.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:29 AM PST up reply actions
Cash is king
If the NBA owners are all hurting bad enough though, (the Maloofs should have a feel for this), then I’m passing and waiting for the Armegeddon scenario to play out with cash ready to spend.
This explains my position well. Don’t overpay for Okafor, hoard the cash, buy players when they are on sale, be choosy on who you pay well and retain when current contracts expire.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:26 AM PST up reply actions
if you don't spend the cash now then you spend the chance and you spend time
Not saying it is a bad investment – but it there is a cost to either doing or not doing this deal today v. tomorrow v. never
How long do you spend on the sidelines drumming your fingers waiting for the collapse of the NBA economy (aka “Armeggedon”) – for the better deal, the better player, and on and on…
which is why, btw, I am not an NBA GM (though my record as an NBA GM is unblemished, and I have never lost a game as a Coach either)
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 10:14 AM PST up reply actions
Remember the old adage
Sometimes the best trades are the ones you don’t make.
We win four games and suddenly we have to make a deal? I don’t think so. Let’s play the hand we’re holding.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 10:31 AM PST up reply actions
Blair's fast start is fading fast
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 12:51 AM PST up reply actions
That's what happens
when you go from being a second-unit energy guy to facing off against the big boys on fresh legs. He’ll adjust, but no one said he should have been a starter.
GREENE! You’ve been superfluously apostrophe’d! - andy sims
perhaps - it was an example and off subject here but to continue on anyway:
Today only – would you trade Sergio and Brockman for Blair?
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 6:51 AM PST up reply actions
yes, interesting that it was an important part of the deal
and here we are – 600 posts into discussing a $60M commitment four months later.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 7:22 AM PST up reply actions
Just as a followup
Would it be possible to trade Okafor and Nocioni to Cleveland for Shaq?
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 6:58 PM PST up reply actions
Two other teams might qualify
Miami with Jermaine O’Neal and Washington with Mike Miller, Mike James and Brendan Haywood.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 7:08 PM PST up reply actions
where are you going with this coolcat?
you seem to be trying hard to clear the deck including Nocioni for free agency?
You don’t actually want Shaq or Jermaine O’Neal right?
(not being sarcastic, I am not sure what you are trying to accomplish)
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
Just trying to pile up more cash.
I don’t really want those guys to play much for us, maybe just replace Kenny’s minutes while giving us more $$$ in expiring contracts. Cash is going to be king.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 7:30 PM PST up reply actions
Okafor & Nocioni would never satisfy Cleveland for Shaq
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
it should
but it wouldn’t.
Shaq is done, time to drive off into the sunset.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
ok, I get your point. You have cash
do you keep it ?
do you spend it?
-if you spend it – what are you waiting for? another deal to arrive? (you may be waiting a while)
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 8:25 PM PST up reply actions
You spend it
When a deal that makes financial sense is presented, particularly one in which your cash pile puts you at an advantage against a more leveraged and desperate team. Patience is a virtue in this game.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:32 AM PST up reply actions
If Okafor is the real deal
it would strengthen their team and possibly get that title that LeBron is pining for.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 7:41 PM PST up reply actions
Than why would the Kings trade Okafor?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Because we don't want to pay him
but Cleveland will.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 7:47 PM PST up reply actions
Than why make a deal for Okafor in the first place?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
why on earth would you trade for shaq's contract? the kings owuldnt be able to do ANYTHING with the cap space because no one that will be better than what we have will sign here. NO ONE
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
name one star player, in his prime, not at the end of his career trying to get a ring, that signed in a big market for less money than a small market was offering.
Players in their prime go where the money is.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
but we arent going to offer anyone good more than they will get from the bigger market
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
That's crap too
It’s the same for everyone. The only way a player will get more than what he can get on the market elsewhere is from his own team.
LeBron can get much more money from Cleveland, Wade in Miami, Bosh in Toronto, and like that.
This is about money CBB. Players aren’t leaving anywhere for less money regardless of market.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
And that money this summer will be in every major market
And a few smaller markets too.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Hint
New Orleans isn’t the only team losing big money. The big paydays are going to dry up. Cash is king.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 8:12 PM PST up reply actions
For what?
What is “Cash is King” mean in this context? What?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
It's not my idea.....
I’m not sure about Okafor or not, but I definitely don’t think this summer is anything to write home about either.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Explained above.
Reread slooooowly. More cash. $20 million coming of fthe books instead of nine million. I’m not sure why this is so hard to comprehend.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 8:10 PM PST up reply actions
It's not hard to comprehend
It’s hard to see what the advantage is for the Kings by doing so. You keep saying cash is king. For what?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
whats the point in cap space with no one willing to accept it?
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
None
But I’m not arguing that point CBB.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Well on the 2010 FA is just a big brouhaha anyway
As far as Okafor, I’m not sure if I want to say yes or no to that right now. I have absolutely no clue as to whether that deal is something the Kings should do.
I know it won’t kill the Kings next summer though.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Now an argument that many more teams won't exceed the cap
than they used to, that I’ll buy.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:13 PM PST up reply actions
The Cap or the Luxury tax?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Both
I think few will go much over the cap
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:16 PM PST up reply actions
Do you know the difference?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
no, I'm an idiot who has
been wasting is time here
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:19 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
arent the cap and luxury tax the same in the nba?
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
OK
you can tell Trojan the diff
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:20 PM PST up reply actions
seriously. dont they not call it a salary cap, but a luxury tax threshold? because its not a cap like in the nfl
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Your response didn't indicate that you did
You said both. Both aren’t the same thing. I figured you knew the difference, but after reading that I wasn’t sure. Apparently you are.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Not exactly 'high math'
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:19 PM PST up reply actions
Maybe someone here can post am article stating difference.. I am kinda new to all of this stuff (been a BBall fan for years, just never got that far into this info.)
Judgment day is coming!
Its easy
Cap is 57 mil. you can’t go over it accept to re-sign your own guys (there are tricks, sign and trades ect but) If you go over 67 mil you pay a ‘tax’ dollar for dollar which goes to teams under the cap evenly
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:22 PM PST up reply actions
The tax line is 69.92 mil
But lttg has everything else correct.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
This is what I was talking about with your FAQ post Pookey.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Yes JJ I know
I’ll have to re-tweak it obviously.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
so they have both? ok. i thought they just had the luxury tax line. thanks.
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Yes there is both
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
So New Orl
who is at $73 mil is really paying $80 mil (more or less) because they pay the Tax dollar for dollar over the $67 mil
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:24 PM PST up reply actions
They're about 4 million over the tax line lttg
Not 7 million.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Pookey is right
69 mil (thought it was $67) so New Orl is paying $77 mil more or less in a market the same size as ours with the same lack of Big corporate support
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:26 PM PST up reply actions
Tourists don't buy tix
or lux suites or provide any other corp support
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:28 PM PST up reply actions
i was just pointing out that it injects money into the economy
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Sure, no doubt
service jobs don’t pay that much and New orl has the cheapest Tix in the NBA.
Anyway, they’re in bad shape financially, losing big money. They were OK with that if a Championship was looming but it clearly isn’t now.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:30 PM PST up reply actions
yeah they are fucked. owners wanted to keep team in okc, but stern wouldnt let them
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Survival for one.
Again, I think the Kings are headed for a Moneyball scenario where they get players like Udoka, continue to focus on the draft and get real choosy about who they pay what to. But, hey, if you think money is still growing on trees in the NBA, this vision probably doesn’t make much sense to you.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 8:14 PM PST up reply actions
I'm not following your logic CC
You need to explain it in precise 10 step detail before I really go forth with what you’re saying. Don’t allude to a point and expect me to understand what your’e saying.
Don’t allude to moneyball and tell me that is how team’s are going to operate. Don’t mix baseball & basketball metaphor’s here and expect me to follow the line of logic.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Sorry
Apparently I am wasting my time.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 8:25 PM PST up reply actions
If you don't wish to explain your position
How can I understand it?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Your Moneyball logic makes no sense CC.
If Petrie was a Moneyball guy, he would have chosen Blair in the draft. The Moneyball idea is to choose players based on passed performances, regardless of league level instead of raw ability. Petrie would restrict his draft picks to players who were either Juniors or seniors because of personal and physical development so he could get players that enter their prime during their first contract. Players like Udoka fill a need but Beane would have instead surfed the NBDL for players who had a track record of success.
Jack Cust is a perfect example. Cust has 199 career minor league home runs- a proven hitter at a secondary level of play. Udoka is more of a major league utility infielder who never really put it all together- someone that Beane would avoid. Instead, he would have pulled up a Keith Ginter type who had previously hit 20 Hrs at the major league level in less than 400 ABs which showed not only potential but success.
I’m not saying that I signing Udoka was incorrect, I’m saying that your Moenyball comparison was off base. Signing SAR was a Beane esque move (not the length of the contract but the value for the talent)- past All-Star level talent on the down swing. Signing Moore, Salmons and Udrih were not- money spent on players who had never shown a propensity for success.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
I kinda see Udoka as a guy Beane would pursue. kinda the equivalent of an adam kennedy type. Beane likes middling reclamation projects who get paid the minimum hoping to catch lightning in a bottle and flip them for younger talent as well.
I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken
by joeytothelimit on Nov 14, 2009 11:33 PM PST up reply actions
Kennedy is a career .277 hitter with over 5,000 plate appearances.
Kennedy has always been a good hitter, just not great. Bringing in Kennedy is closer to bringing in Giambi or Nomar. Sure those guys have had better careers but Kennedy was the starting 2nd baseman for the Angels for 7 seasons and another two for the Cards before signing a minor league deal with Tampa Bay.
Again, I like Udoka but he is a 9,10,11 guy at best. Kennedy is closer to bringing in a Derek Fischer or Shane Battier type roll player in the NBA.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Damn your spelling is horrid
I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken
by joeytothelimit on Nov 14, 2009 11:52 PM PST up reply actions
that was a total misreply
I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken
by joeytothelimit on Nov 14, 2009 11:53 PM PST up reply actions
Petrie may not use the same selection criteria
But the intent is the same: field competitive teams while spending less money. Don’t overpay.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:36 AM PST up reply actions
I think you're working too hard at it then
Its very likely Nocioni will be tradable in a month or two for expirings or something close to it. Someone will do the “his contract declines in value” rationalization to themselves and take him from us if we want.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
Fine then, just let Kenny expire
But don’t add a big multi-year contract to replace him.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 7:46 PM PST up reply actions
a perfectly defensible position, one I am close to agreeing with, its a tough call.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
I think it comes down to whether you think Okafor gets us a playoff spot this season
If he does, I think the Maloofs want to do if for financial reasons.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:51 PM PST up reply actions
I agree
Thats a least a big factor in the calculation
Tickets sales, they’re bound to go up if the Kings keep winning
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:15 PM PST up reply actions
the arean was at least 20% more filled between the last two home games
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
They're selling 'walk-up' tix
which they didn’t do at all except for the Lakers last year.
Still pretty thin though
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 8:32 PM PST up reply actions
yeah i bought a bumch of those walk up tix. paid 10 bucks and sat in the very front of the second deck. less than half full on tuesday and a little more than half on friday
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
You don't get it
No giant Free agent has ever come here. Not likely to happen either
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 12:53 AM PST up reply actions
Wade for a last second 3 and the Nets are now 0-10
Wow.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
Brandom Jennings
is going nuts, he’s got 39; the Warriors defense is a complete joke.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
Brandon Jennings is torching the nets
39 points in the 3rd quarter!!!!
29 points in one quarter!!!!
T-Rek has competition for ROY
Goddamn, 42 pts now.
Hate to admit it, but he’s the front runner. Reke is playing serious catch up.
There's nothing to fear but everything.
27 shots and 3 assists
It’s a good thing he’s a pure point guard, or else people might complain.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:24 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
would you rather have Brandon Jennings or Tyreke Evans on your team?
Tyreke plays defense. Jennings is quick and can get some steals. Depends on what you want. I think the Kings made the better choice. I am never wrong….
(well once I thought I was wrong but I wasn’t)
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:38 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I prefer Reke
If we had picked Jennings, I would likely answer him.
But trying to be objective. Jennings is really skinny. I like Tyreke’s size next to Kevin.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:42 PM PST up reply actions
think about what a different season this would be with Jennings
Kevin Martin and Brandon Jennings in your frontcourt. Very different. Not better or worse, just saying different.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:57 PM PST up reply actions
Well...you were wrong for thinking you were wrong. ;p
But I had the same thought. Tyreke plays both ends, and 3 positions. Jennings plays one end, and one position. Give me T-Rek any day.
I wonder how much of this is for Don Nelson passing on Jennings and taking Curry. That has to give him a little extra motivation for tonight.
Looks like the Warriors screwed up, and the Knicks screwed up worse.
Obviously it is early but only 5 rookies have averaged 20 PPG and 5 ASST:
Michael Jordan
LeBron James
Brandon Jennings
Someone else good (?)
Oscar Robertson
evans does not play 3 positions. youre kidding right?
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
he can guard 3 positions - most of the time (Ariza last night)
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 7:59 PM PST up reply actions
check the scoreboard
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 8:03 PM PST up reply actions
im just saying that the kings made ariza look like an all star. it is like when a mediocre pitcher plays the giants...
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Good point
challenging popular perception with the concrete.
Hopefully that changes though as he gets more experience – I think it cannot be denied he has the physical tools. It’s just a matter of knowledge, effort and execution.
Good point
challenging popular perception with the concrete.
Hopefully that changes though as he gets more experience – I think it cannot be denied he has the physical tools. It’s just a matter of knowledge, effort and execution.
The Rockets first two baskets last night
were Ariza threes over Tyreke. I think he had 18 in the first half and really didn’t cool off until Udoka covered him.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 8:07 PM PST up reply actions
tyreke has those long arms that sneak up on other guards. but the big small forwards arent going to be affected by him
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
wow, so if a guy has a great game the other guy sucks?
guess the whole League sucked against MJ, Bird, Magic, LeBron….
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 8:13 PM PST up reply actions
dude tyreke is awesome. i love him. but he cant be counted on to guard small forwards. thats all i was saying.
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
however you made my point... those guys you mentioned are HOF players... Ariza not so much
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Rookie has to learn the league - the players
Thats all
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 9:09 PM PST up reply actions
Rec'd for the last line
I appreciate the subtlety.
"Sometimes the capriciousness of youth anesthetizes common sense." -Let Geoff's words guide our patience this season.
by AnotherStupidSN on Nov 14, 2009 8:28 PM PST up reply actions
Only if they don't take defense into consideration.
Jenning’s can’t defend.
Once Reke gets comfortable with a pull-up jumper its not even a contest.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 7:42 PM PST up reply actions
A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush...
Frankly I’d rather have a bush in my hand, but that’s another issue for another day. I get where TZ is coming from. Let’s assume for a moment this rumor has legs. You’re taking a more or less sure thing in Okafor (career 14 & 10) as opposed to gambling on f.a. I’d do this deal in a heart beat. It gives us a killer starting 5 and may also put butts in the seats at the same time.
I’ve never been a huge Hawes fan and while he is young and serviceable at the 5, I think he takes way too many 3’s (how many has he hit this year?). He’s got a ways to go before he’s a top 10 five. With him coming off the bench he may be able to flourish a little. The best Kings team had a 3-big man rotation of Webber – Divac- Pollard. I close my eyes and see Thompson-Okafor-Hawes.
Purveyor of Bull Plop
yep, 12 shots in 9 games is 1.3 per game.
I have no problem with him taking 1 or 2 open 3s a game. He’s not hitting them now, but he shot .348 from 3 last season which is the same as shooting .522 from 2.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:39 PM PST up reply actions
Quit talking out of your ass...
Jennings averaged like 4 PTS in the Euroleague. No one saw this coming. His play is predicated on amazing shooting. The league will adjust to him. It is unlikely he can keep up this incredible shooting pace.
if you saw him play in high school you saw this coming. the european game is completely different from the nba.
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Word. I saw this coming. His high school games showed much 'swagger'.
He looked like a man playing with boys. His floor vision was very advanced in high school. I will say I didn’t expect him to shoot this well but I did know the man can play.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Trade Scenario- Good for all parties
OK so here is a trade situation for you Just seeing other posts here make some wonder- (Done through ESPN trader- 3 team trade between Warriors, Hornets and Kings
And yes i will take constructive criticism. i am new to all this and still getting my bearings
Kings get Biedrens and Jackson,
Hornets get Sergio and KT
Golden State gets noc and okafur..
this trade does work out money wise, Golden state gets rid of Jackson and gets Noc, hornets get their pay dump, we get a better center in Biedrens (on the PER) with less money for the next 4 years (actually it saves us 2.5 million this year) then with emeka
Judgment day is coming!
Jackson is a cancer
We’ve got good chemistry guys now, and this bitch would ruin it.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 7:39 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Interesting, and you did your homework
but I think I’d rather puke on myself than have Stephen Jackson.
This current Kings team is all team oriented guys, why mess that up bringing in Stephen Jackson, who is also vastly overpaid.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
we dont want those guys. nellie never plays randolph. he like sbig guys that jack 3's... Hawes for randolph straight up
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Were winning right now due in a large part to team chemistry,
Jackson’s bloated perception of himslef would seriously turn the team in the wrong direction.
NO WAY.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 7:44 PM PST up reply actions
Plus,
I like Noc and would feel terrible sending him to Hell.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 14, 2009 7:45 PM PST up reply actions
Revised trade situation with no Jackson, now that I look at it:
Kings get Randolph(W), Biedrens(W) and Claxton(W)
Hornets get salary dump- K9(Woof) and Rodriguez(K)
Golden state gets Francisco and Okafor
We keep Noc, get a center and an extra PG(to replace Sergio) and no Jackson, Hornets still get Salary Dump, Nellie gets his big guy and a decent bench SG
Judgment day is coming!
don nelson doesnt want a player like okafor, he wants a player like hawes that jacks up threes... hawes for randolph!!!
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
How much is Biedrins owed?
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 8:05 PM PST up reply actions
he and okafor are the same player and eventually will have the same contract. why do you want one more than the other?
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Well
Biedrins is 4 years younger.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 8:08 PM PST up reply actions
really? i guess okafor did have the college years
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Biedrins also came over from Latvia at 18 years old too
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Personally
I don’t mind Biedrins, but he doesn’t seem to be what coolcat wants.
I’d consider taking Biedrins for K9 too.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
Rather have Okafor
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I'm fat
Not tall or Long. (Well I’m kinda tall if 6’1 qualifies.)
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
If you are going to take on salary and Biedrins
then work Morrow and/or Azubukie into the deal as well.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 8:19 PM PST up reply actions
Biedrins seems injury prone
which is another reason I doubt the Maloofs pay someone big $$$. Been there, done that.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 8:21 PM PST up reply actions
Ok re revised again-- Heres one that works according to calculator
Kings take on Claxton, Marrow, Azubuike and Okafor
Hornets- K9(Woof) and sergio
Warriors get Hawes and Francisco
Judgment day is coming!
so we trade for more wings to take pt away from greene and evans?
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
who said we had to play em, and only 1 year contracts for all but Okafur- Claxton takes Sergios place, Marrow takes Garcia’s place, Azubuike takes K9’s place (Not really but we got enough guys at forward) and Okafur well its Okafur
Judgment day is coming!
sweet. if they are on 1 year contracts im down. but i still think hawes for randolph is more likely
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
there is no rumor. people were talking about biedrins and i said id rather have randolph and that don nelson likes seven footers who jack up threes.
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
It would be a nice rumor..See now Trojan is a named source..Make it happen Petrie..See New post below as this one was just getting long!@
Judgment day is coming!
From a PR standpoint
Let’s say we make this deal and keep Okafor. Now the team has to spin it for the casual fan they want to start showing up at Arco.
We’re not adding a household name here exactly and 14 and 10 aren’t exactly All-Star numbers, so it’s got to be about the guys we have and how great and exciting they are and now we are just strengthening the team for a serious playoff run yada yada yada.
Bottom line: that fan doesn’t care how much you are paying the guy, although that becomes part of the story about how committed the Maloofs are, but you better continuing winning with this lineup now because you’ve just mortgaged the future to try to get some butts in the seats. And winning with the kind of effort we are already showing is the only way you are going to accomplish that. And the economy is going to blunt even that effort.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 14, 2009 7:38 PM PST reply actions
i dont think so
Jason Thompson is just beginning to blossom as Sacramento’s main go-to guy at the post. Inserting Emeka Okafor can disrupt JT’s rythm now, and that is the last thing the kings want to do considering Thompson’s current perfomance, IMO, Bring someone who will support and complement him, not someone who would compete with him for being the kings’s premiere post player.
he wont disrupt anything. he doesnt command the ball, he plays solid d and cleans up. that is what the kings need to compliment jt
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
also he can play next to hawes and his away form the basket gam. i think they would make a great three man rotation
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
okafor is better than anyone that the kings could sign. so make the trade.
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
48 for Jennings now
whew
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
and 50 now.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:51 PM PST up reply actions
53 and probably just sealed the win
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:53 PM PST up reply actions
Bucks rookie record
51 by Lew Alcindor was the old record
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:54 PM PST up reply actions
we were in the upper deck at arco during a dallas game chanting "brandon jennings" at the top of our lungs. maybe we can trade martin for him
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
maybe not
Ws 3 and Bucks TO. Crazy game.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:55 PM PST up reply actions
i think he and tyreke were by far the best players in the draft. would have been happy if the kings had either
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
yeah, I was on record, being okay with
Rubio, Evans, Jennings, Flynn and even Curry with the 4th pick.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 7:52 PM PST up reply actions
just like jennings said, rubio is all hype and im glad he isnt in sacramento
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
55 points
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 8:00 PM PST up reply actions
amazing game
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 8:01 PM PST up reply actions
that is great for the Bucks
they are 5-2 hard not to praise Jennings because they are as talent poor as anyone (the Kings).
by betweentheeyes on Nov 14, 2009 8:11 PM PST up reply actions
I wonder how Jennings game will be once Redd gets back
not like Jennings will be jacking up 30 a night (though if he’s hot handed), and I agree that if we matched up Reke on him, Jennings will have to back off so not to foul out.
I just hope the refs don’t start treating Jennings like a superstar (marginal contact calls his way, his fouls don’t get called).
There's nothing to fear but everything.
and it resulted in a Warriors loss
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 8:12 PM PST up reply actions
Jennings is brash and arrogent but . . .
if you are only 7 games into the season and you score 55 points during your rookie year you have earned the right to talk as much sh*t as you want.
Major props to Brandon. He backs up his talk.
Ba-da
Jennings was on my top 3 list for last draft
Rubio, Griffin, Jennings..ah, well. I’m still happy we have Evans, though.
Tyreke could have
gotten 50 against the Warriors if we had let him play the second half.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:42 AM PST up reply actions
Saw the WHOLE game and that incredible 3rd quarter.
The Warriors had Acie f*cking Law guarding Jennings. More than two-thirds of Jennings 3 pointers and mid-range jumpshots were NOT contested. Whomever was guarding him was at least 4 or 5 feet away.
Not to mention, Jennings couldn’t do much when Stephen Jackson finally decided to guard him (I believe Jackson took on Tyreke for most of the Kings-Dubs game).
Yes, I’m being a homer and I’m not really trying to take too away from Brandon’s awesome performance. But I estimate he wasn’t guarded for at least 70% of his jump shots. However, he was very intelligent in going into their non-existent interior and putting up delicious floaters that swished through the net. Jennings used his screens the right way and killed a Warriors team that didn’t seem too interested in defense.
I applaud his performance but I’d like to see that happen with Udoka, Evans, Stephen Jackson, Kobe or Afflalo guarding him with their hands in his face. Tyreke Evans commands that respect and sees this level of defense every game and still manages to score.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
lets do this thing
1. Killer three-big rotation. We will own the backboards. OWN THEM.
2. Our weakness is a defensive oriented five. Pryzbilla would be awesome to have, but even he makes 7 mill this season and has a 7.5 mill option next year, as a back-up center. Look at what Gortat cost the Magic for just showing a bit of potential, I don’t think the Emeka’s contract is a deal killer. Big men cost money.
3. He isn’t a “good” fit, he is a great fit. We will own the backboards. OWN THEM.
okafor for kenny thomas is the best the kings could hope for. and it could free up a hawes for randolph trade...
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
OKC
is beating SA by 5 at home with 45sec left, and Parker/Duncan played.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
That just means SA played like shit 4-3
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Ginobli 0-8
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 9:05 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah I'm not surprised
Manu Ginobili is so much more than points scored and what not.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I'm split on getting Okafor
In free agency this summer, Amare Stoudemire, Carlos Boozer and Yao Ming (depending on his play when he comes back) are the only 3 bigs better than Okafor in next year’s free agent class. He grabs 10 boards per game for his career and is a legit shot blocker. In the last 2 seasons he’s only missed 1 game. He might be the best the Kings can do.
Adding him will address the need for a big man. During the 4-game win-streak the Kings have seen a frontcourt players like Boozer, Okur, Anthony & Zach Randolph, Marc Gasol, Kristic, Green, Hayes, Scola and a hurt Biedrins. They played some good talent, but not the cream of the crop. It’s still very early in the season.
Of course, the negatives of Okafor. Dude hasn’t improved much over his career. His scoring has regressed since his rookie season. Like M_Shady said, he wasn’t winning over his teammates in training camp. Plus there’s the impact he could have on Hawes and JT’s progress.
Adding Okafor could really help, or really hurt, this team. I’d like to see what Okafor could do with the new look Kings. This really might be the only chance the Kings can go after someone like him. And for K-9?
Chris Bosh?
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Eh. The article really doesn't say much.
Seems like Okafor isn’t winning over the writer, Marc Spears. There’s not a direct quote from a Hornets’ player expressing dislike for Okafor.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Old Trade post gettign to long
So here we go after trying to make a lot of people happy: No Jackson, No biedrens (I still think i like Biedrens better on this team)
Sac gets : Okafor, Azubuike, Randolph
Hornets get K9 and Sergio and D George(all expiring
Warriors get: Hawes, Garcia
Judgment day is coming!
Also it says this gives us +10 wins and Warriors get a -18wins..always good in my book.
Judgment day is coming!
That and i like Noc better then Garcia..i know some will hate me for that but i like him better in play and contract
Judgment day is coming!
well both their contracts suck. but what can you do.
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
I don't think either contract sucks
IF its on a winning team.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 9:04 PM PST up reply actions
hard to have a winning team with two backup caliber players making that much money
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
its like they have two mediocre players with the combined salary of 1 superstar
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Your opinion
You can’t have an All-Star guy at every position. No one does. I agree that with Casspi one of them will eventually go.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 9:06 PM PST up reply actions
Azubuike went down screaming tonight
and off on a stretcher. So I’m guessing thats out.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 9:02 PM PST up reply actions
And Port is running out of SFs
Outlaw – broken foot
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 14, 2009 9:03 PM PST up reply actions
I don't want Randolph
If we don’t think Spencer is physical enough, why would we want Randolph?
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 8:44 AM PST up reply actions
I could give a sh*t about Randolph or Thomas. We have muthaf*ckin' JT.
JT is only getting better with every game. Double doubles in four games (is it more?) is nothing to sneeze at.
I’m only interested in them if they want to contribute off the bench.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Nelson is only playing Randolph 20 minutes a game. kid has crazy upside. lets be his parachute
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Pull the trigger.
I don’t want to sound pessimistic, but if we had cash to spend during the summer we’d probably just overpay for someone who wouldn’t be as useful. The odds of a better trade coming along are probably pretty slim, particularly when you consider how nice it would be to trade K9 so early in the season.
Okafor hasn’t missed a game since the 06-07 season. His defense is better than average—and a hell of lot better than Spencer’s. He doesn’t take a Bosh-like number of FTs, so his poor FT% isn’t as bad as it seems.
"El once, chico. Eleven."
and there isnt a single free agent that the kings have a realistic shot at signing who would be better than what they have. NONE.
At USC we're not snobs, we're just better than you.
Yes!
Okafor is a very talented big man; the kind of player I’ve been saying over and over again that we sorely lack.
Great post defender, athletic, strong rebounder, doesn’t make very many bad decisions or take ill-advised shots. And I remember when he came out he measured some crazy, pterodactyl-like wingspan.
Mucho Moss sez: I likey!
Just hearing this rumor gives me hope that Petrie is serious about going that direction, and if it happens we will be a better team for it.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
Just idle curiousity MM (don't want to pick a fight here cuz frankly we can fight about other things)
But would you rather have Okafor or Noah in a perfecct world?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
ahh...the perfect world!
That choice would be quite a luxury, pookey.
I think a couple of weeks ago when you asked me to name a few bigs I’d personally prefer over Spencer I listed Okafor among a group of the top three or four guys I’d love to see in purple and black, but who I considered to be unlikely to be available.
I listed Noah among a second batch of players who were more comparable to Hawes in terms of age and salary. Now, if it turns Sacramento could land Okafor, then I say, yes please! He would fit the Mucho Moss bill nicely.
On the other hand, Noah of course is a couple of years younger, his salary is a fraction of Okafor’s, and frankly the kid is playing out of his mind right now: Tied for #1 in rebounding in the NBA. Tied for third among big men is assists. 5th overall in blocked shots. Top 10 among all players in FG percentage. And averaging a very respectable 11.5 pts per game, to boot.
Some of the criticisms I’ve seen about Noah here in Sactown have been “…he’s already as good as he’s gonna get”, which I don’t really agree with but even if true, even if his top gear is exactly what we’re seeing right now, that kind of play would be a big boost to the Kings or just about any NBA team for that matter. Like I’ve been saying, Joakim is a seriously talented basketball player. And because he’s so energetic and intense on the court Noah is a lot of fun to watch play, so if he hypothetically were to play for the home team at Arco I think (most) fans would get pretty pumped about him.
But Okafor is stronger and overall a generally better low post defender. Adding him would really send a signal about what we’re looking for from the young players.
Bottom line, I really feel good about either one of them, and since Noah almost certainly ain’t going anywhere anytime soon, I guess I’ll keep my fantasies focused on Emeka.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
You like Okafor and what he does
That is very true. I still think it’s a tough decision to make that has more to do with money. As the fellow who runs atthehive put it, “The Maloof’s need to come up with an extra revenue stream to make this deal work.”
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Noah is Not available
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 12:44 AM PST up reply actions
Of course he isn't
Noah isn’t making 53 million after this season either. So that’s the rub here. If Okafor was making 40 million, don’t you think the Hornets would be after something more than dumping Okafor’s salary?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
besides...
what exactly were we fighting about anyway?
Three game winning streaks make us all so mellow around here!
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
4 game win streak, but who's counting
Oh, wait. I am.
I hope you noticed, that even as a Hawes supporter, I am in favor of this trade. As it turns out, I don’t think we were all that far apart.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 11:41 PM PST up reply actions
okafor and jennings
if okafor’s contract was shorter this would be practically a no-brainer….the long contract and the fact that he is not improving and how much the nba is becoming a younger game – faster more athletic – worries me….though, if the staff and front-office believe he will be a strong fit and he has the right attitude then I would likely do it….also, isn’t eerie how much milwaukee and the kings are similar this year. Both have exciting rookies (though Jennings 55 is mind boggling), both have their (super) start shooting guard out on injuries
(Redd and Martin) and both have won 4 in a row for the first time in year….congrats to Jennings by the way, he certainly looks like a top 3 pick this year.
Okafor's AVAILABLE on the cheap....
…BECAUSE of his deal. If it were less, we’d have to either A) Pay more to trade(i.e. pick and.or prospects) or B) He wouldn’t be available.
PULL THE TRIGGER ALREADY!
Any other trade offers?
I think they should see if they can get a quality sf or big guy for k9. See what else is on the market yaknow.
by Mike_is_awesome on Nov 14, 2009 9:39 PM PST reply actions
Reke to Okafor
I can see it now: Tyreke beats his man off the dribble, drives to the basket, pulls in the opposing center, and then dishes to Okafor for the two-handed jam.
Awesome thread everyone
Almost 500 posts and most of them on topic and most very smart and insightful. Just like the Kings, StR is stepping it up and delivering the goods.
Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...
We love you too papa
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
NO!!!!!!!!!!!
PLEASE NO!!!!!!!
I don’t want to get buried under another crazy contract. I get what Okafor could bring, but I also see that $64 Million.
I don’t agree with Ziller about Bosh… Do you really think the Raptors would turn down JT, Greene, K9’s 9-million, and maybe a pick for Bosh? I think not. Honestly, I would put Casspi in there if it would get the deal done.
With Garcia coming back mid-season I think it would be a steal to nail down a starting 5 of Evans, Martin, Noc, Bosh, Hawes. We would still have Beno, Garcia, and Udoka off the bench.
I'm a limousine-riding, jet-flying, kiss-stealing, wheeling-dealing son of a gun!!! Wooooo!!!
by Noble_Bloodlines on Nov 14, 2009 11:38 PM PST reply actions
Interesting
So you’d trade JT, Greene, a #1, maybe Casspi and Okafor for a half season rental of Bosh?
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 11:43 PM PST up reply actions
Actually
it’d be for the ability so sign Bosh to a max deal. However, I wouldn’t want to trade JT and a pick to do so
www.mancancook.net
The only advantage we'd gain is the ability to offer a 6th season.
Max dollars is max dollars.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 14, 2009 11:50 PM PST up reply actions
So none of you
think Bosh would stay in Sac to play with Evans, Martin, and Hawes? I think it would be hard to pass up…
It’s times like this when I wish Sac wasn’t so cheap and we had already built the F’ing arena!
I'm a limousine-riding, jet-flying, kiss-stealing, wheeling-dealing son of a gun!!! Wooooo!!!
by Noble_Bloodlines on Nov 15, 2009 12:01 AM PST up reply actions
And I said MAYBE Casspi
I'm a limousine-riding, jet-flying, kiss-stealing, wheeling-dealing son of a gun!!! Wooooo!!!
by Noble_Bloodlines on Nov 15, 2009 12:02 AM PST up reply actions
Bosch wants to play with Lebron
He might not even know who Evan’s Martin and Hawes even are.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 15, 2009 12:04 AM PST up reply actions
No I don't think Bosh will want to stay with the Kings either
Plus, I doubt the Raptors will put him up for sale.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Bosh is going to NY or Miami
I’d bet on it (and I don’t gamble)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 12:57 AM PST up reply actions
Or Toronto
But, yep I agree. Cleveland won’t have cap space next summer to do much after re-signing Anderson Varejao to his big deal.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Yeah. Sure. :)
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Or Chicago.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
I would take JT and Okafor over Bosch,
It gives us a stronger overall team.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 15, 2009 12:02 AM PST up reply actions
I guess you think Okafor is better than I do...
And you clearly value Bosh less.
Not in my wildest dreams could I imagine having those 3 together!!! I’d sell my red, white, and powder bluepurple&black soul to have Tyreke Evans, Kevin Martin, and Chris Bosh in the starting line for the Kings.
I'm a limousine-riding, jet-flying, kiss-stealing, wheeling-dealing son of a gun!!! Wooooo!!!
by Noble_Bloodlines on Nov 15, 2009 12:10 AM PST up reply actions
I think Bosch is probably one of the top 20 players in the league,
but I think JT will be an allstar as well as Okafor. That gives us 4 potential allstars in Reke, Martin, JT and Okafor.
I think the argument is basically mute as Bosch wants to play in a big market and make big endorsement dollars playing with Lebron and Wade.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 15, 2009 12:52 AM PST up reply actions
If Bosh would pinky swear that
he’d sign a 6-year contract with the Kings, then I’d send K9 for Okafor and ship him off to Toronto with JT in a heartbeat.
I like the sound of that...
I'm a limousine-riding, jet-flying, kiss-stealing, wheeling-dealing son of a gun!!! Wooooo!!!
by Noble_Bloodlines on Nov 15, 2009 12:17 AM PST up reply actions
Omeka is a BUM!
Let’s see I’ve got a guy with a career avg. of 13/10 that I.m spending Labron money on. I wonder what my motivation for getting some sucker team like the kings to take his rediculously bloated long term contract could be. Oh I don’t know, getting rid of the most overpaid player in the nba maybe. Would you pay Chris Kaman 14 million dollars a year? No? But you’ll give that kind of money to a guy who isn’t as good as Kaman. With all do respect, if you can’t see the folly in bailing New Orleans out of their stupidity than you are an idiot. This trade will make the kenny tomas trade and sharrif signing look like sound decisions. Don’t believe me? Look at Omeka’s career stats. He’s already over the hill avg. 10ppg and 9rpg this season and frankly his numbers have gotten worse every year since his rookie year when he avg. 15/10. I can’t even write anymore. The only thing I can hope is that sam amick has this as wrong as he usually has everything. STUPID STUPID STUPID!!!!!!!
LeBron makes more money that Okafor
Just so you know.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Lebron's current contract is set to expire
this year. His new contract will be the highest in the NBA as it should be.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 15, 2009 12:06 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah
It’s like 6 years and 120 mil if LeBron resigns with Cleveland. If he signs with any other team (any other team—again any other team) it would be like 5 years mid 90’s to possibly high 90’s money. Big big difference.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
The CBA has set salary caps for individual players as follows:
6 years or less experience 14 mil
7-9 years at 17 mil
10+ years at 20 mil
his salary will go up as he pushed into his contract years. He will probably start off at 17 and move to 20 in three years over like 5-7 years.
by nothingbutnet on Nov 15, 2009 12:19 AM PST up reply actions
dont you mean Labron :)
I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken
by joeytothelimit on Nov 14, 2009 11:54 PM PST reply actions
you are completely correct
Emeka Okafor is a bum. He has reached his ceiling and is way overpaid. I don’t want him hurting our cap flexibility for the next five years. I would rather take my chances drafting a defensive big man.
by saczag on Nov 15, 2009 12:23 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
He broke his jaw
when he heard that Omeka is getting paid as much as Labron
Which of them do you expect will average 14/11 over the next 6 seasons?
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
Where do you go for trade machine stuff?
If the Kings took Okafor, could they turn around and package him with Martin for Bosh plus picks and a PG?
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 12:41 AM PST up reply actions
Over 5 years?
While solving our problem at center over that period? Truth be told, given his defensive prowess, it’s likely a steal.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
My first reaction was that indeed it is a steal
But it makes me nervous for Kings in long haul—especially considering the economy out there.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 12:46 AM PST up reply actions
It's pretty much the same everywhere.
And not investing in the team would indicate to me that the Maloofs are not serious about staying here.
I’m not saying Okafor is anyone’s dream to come here and turn the team around, but we have minimal chance of landing anyone better in free agency. If you want to save the dough and go after Carlos Boozer, be my guest, but he doesn’t solve your center problem, and he just eats up JT’s minutes. This team has no center other than Hawes, and no disrespect, he’s never going to be an inside presence.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
I dont see anyone besides Bosh that I would want on horizon either.
Definitely not Cruiser.
And I do think Spence is gonna be a serviceable starting center within a couple years. 2-3 away prob. I like our young nucleus, I just wonder if Okafor and Martin could be big trading chips down the road if need be-especially together. Or Okafor and Noce (though I really like what Noce brings).
Oak and JT would be some mean mofos down there to contend with. Man would the complexion of this team be changed. It already is, but ….I can’t remember when we had a shot blocker last (Keon maybe?)
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 1:00 AM PST up reply actions
I guess I just don't see him being that much of a valuable asset
I would rather build through the draft than take a risk with a high priced long term contract. I know draft picks don’t always pan out, but the risk is significantly smaller. I just don’t think Emeka Okafor is that good. Not my type of player I guess.
Well, as a good Kings fan, a center who plays defense is difficult to fit into your worldview.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
Oh I fogot to say, if we do slip to 14-15 in draft
don’t sleep on my hometown boy here, Larry “The Landlord” Sanders;
7’7 wingspan and a mean blocker, bounder, developing his O.
He dominated at Lebron camp and is getting big national props this year, even playing in a small conference.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 1:02 AM PST up reply actions
might still get him at 14-16
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:04 AM PST up reply actions
We've had a history of great rebounders, D-fenders
from small towns here in VA. Moses, Ben Wallace, Charles Oakley, Alonzo.
Mean bitches all of ’em. Big Ben is building a gym right now near my house.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 1:06 AM PST up reply actions
Larry Sanders? Seriously?

God dammit, Hank.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
by andy sims on Nov 15, 2009 1:05 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Nobody is sleeping on Sanders
He’s an interesting prospect. After the Kings became a playoff team, 214 posted a fanshot saying the Kings might take Sanders at 15.
Given Sanders physical tools, it’s not hard to see why he’s intriguing.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
12pts & 6 boards vs Bethune-Cookman yesterday
Excuse me, “MEAC powerhouse, Bethune-Cookman.”
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
I love that nickname, The Landlord. For an owner in the paint.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 1:10 AM PST up reply actions
Ill probably go see VCU play Oklahoma soon
so I can give a firsthand scout report. Maybe B-Jax will be there.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 1:11 AM PST up reply actions
I'm all for the drafting thing
but if we don’t spend the cap on him, who will we spend it on?
Leaving the money just sitting there is just as stupid as using it on someone that may or may not turn our team into a competitor.
All I want to know is...who the F*CK are OMEKA and LABRON?
I’ve googled them and I can’t find anything on them. :D
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
I think they play in the MBA
with Caspri
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 15, 2009 12:36 AM PST up reply actions
LOL Kfan but,
I thought is was Cresspi
by nothingbutnet on Nov 15, 2009 12:43 AM PST up reply actions
Oh, hes in the laegue two
and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 15, 2009 12:55 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes
and Howerd
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 15, 2009 5:25 AM PST up reply actions
The only thing that makes me hesistant on this
Is that the 2010 draft is stacked in terms of bigs — Derrick Favors, Ed Davis, Cole Aldrich, John Henson, Donatas Motiejunas, Solomon Alabi, DeMarcus Cousins, and more. Okafor has been pretty solid, but most of these guys have the potential to equal his production or exceed it dramatically (especially for Favors, Davis, Motiejunas, and Cousins) and on a much cheaper rookie contract as well. Granted, Okafor is pretty solid, and he’s a fairly big upgrade over Hawes, but the long-term finances don’t make this very compelling. Yes, the Kings have a horrid record of free-agent signings, but it’s still nice regardless to have a measure of flexibility going forward.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
The problem is,
drafting is a bigger risk. In addition, these guys will need time to develop. Does the organization really have time considering the Arena situation?
I say take the gamble
by nothingbutnet on Nov 15, 2009 1:00 AM PST up reply actions
Thats a BIG deal
will we even have a team to worry about unless we win some games and get some asses in the seats and thereby a new arena?
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:02 AM PST up reply actions
*Shrug*
Honestly, this team isn’t going to be winning a whole lot this year or the next, with or without Okafor, for that to play a huge factor in arena negotiations, so it’s hard to cast that as an overbearing concern. The willingness of the city of Sacramento to pay will be the clinching point in the end.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
I think you underestimate
what a positive community building buzz can do in the worst of times
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:13 AM PST up reply actions
Not at all
My problem is that this team isn’t going to win enough in the near-future to generate that kind of community buzz. The West is stacked for the near future — the current contenders aren’t going to drop off that much and several young teams, namely OKC, Houston, and Portland, are only going to get better. The Kings aren’t going to challenge for a playoff spot anytime in the near future.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
You are a pessimist, fine
I think Phx, LA, Dallas and SA are all on the downside. Not this year (maybe) but …..
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:36 AM PST up reply actions
With Okafor
we have a shot at the playoffs this year. And he is just entering his prime for a big man. Only 31 when it expires.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:38 AM PST up reply actions
This year?
It’s nice to be an optimist. This team overachieves for a few games and people are smelling playoffs already? Good grief. Not all the games this season will be against Memphis, OKC, Golden State, or Houston. With another high draft pick next year, then maybe this team gets to some measure of respectability on par with what OKC will probably achieve this year (being barely out of the playoffs), but nothing past that.
Of the four teams you mentioned, only Phoenix takes a big drop-off if Stoudemire leaves and they don’t plug that hole well. SA is far too well-coached and managed, and has far too much veteran and young talent (especially the young talent that could get better) to fall out of the playoffs. L.A. obviously isn’t going to lose much beyond needing a replacement at PG, and might get better with Bynum growing into his potential. Dallas has the chance to take a huge jump with Dampier’s expiring (which can be traded in an S&T for a free agent is almost entirely not guaranteed for ‘11-’12), and even if they don’t use that, which seems high unlikely, they’ll still be relatively solid with a core of Dirk, Marion, and Kidd, which is still a playoff team.
Past that, Utah has the Knicks’ 2010 draft pick next year, which is almost certainly going to be a lottery pick. Add that to the cap flexibility they get with all their expirings, and they’ll be solid as well.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
and is almost entirely not guaranteed for '10-'11
Sleepy…
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
I really don't think it's such a stretch
If the team stays in contention until Martin and Garcia return. However, even at that – you add Okafor, and a lottery pick next season, and you’d have to consider the team as a potential playoff team next year.
Tyreke and JT are showing signs of having a break out year
You add Martin and Okafor to that and you have and interesting group. Of course only time will tell if those last few games were a fluke – but I watched every minute of those games and I am hard pressed to say that.
The upcoming 3 games this week will tell us where we’re at. I wouldn’t advise doing a trade until after then.
You underestimate. We have our most vocal leader (Garcia) and top scorer
out and we’re playing great. I know its early, but adding another crucial piece to the interior D I think at least makes us challenge for 8th spot.
Especially with Hornets and Jazz struggling (though Jazz will prob pull it together) I see us on par with OKC and (almost) Houston, now.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 1:46 AM PST up reply actions
You beat
Memphis, OKC, Golden State, Houston, and a struggling Utah team for your wins. Please stop overestimating this team’s ceiling.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
Maybe. But cut us a break. they've sucked ass for so long.
And i said, with the Okafor trade.
I could see this finish in the West:
1. LA
2. Denver
3. Portland
4. San Antonio
5. Dallas
6. Phoenix
7. Houston
8. Fight between OKC and Sac and Utah—-with Sac prevailing.
(If OKC has any injury to either Westbrook or Durant, they’re done) and Im not sure what Utah’s prob is, but Deron thinks they’re soft.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 1:55 AM PST up reply actions
If Utah flops for the rest of the season
I’ll give Sacramento a puncher’s chance for the eighth seed with an Okafor trade, simply because the OKC hype is a bit ridiculous given all the huge holes they have.
I simply don’t believe that Utah won’t turn it around though. They’re currently hampered by the complete lack of spacing with Miles and Korver out, but there’s way, way too much talent on that team to fall out of the playoffs.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
So what you're saying now
Is that you agree the Kings have a shot at the playoffs by adding Okafor? Interesting…
I mean we've got a ROY candidate, a marginal all-star SG,
a coming out double/double power forward, a solid role player in Noce, and with Okafor a fairly recent ROY. It’s at least intriguing.
And our bench has been a real surprise with Casspi, Udoka, Brockman and Green. It ain’t half bad.
Ill take a puncher’s chance any day after what we’ve been through since Adelman left.
But i agree that Utah will likely pull it together.
by VirginiaBlue on Nov 15, 2009 2:06 AM PST up reply actions
Not totally out of the question
but not necessarily the goal, as far as I’m concerned. I really don’t care all that much about making the 8th seed this year. I mean, OK that would be sort of fun, but three and out… we’ve been there, done that.
What’s more important is to be building the foundation, getting the building blocks in place to be GREAT.
We want a Kings team that can legitimately compete for the NBA title, and adding Okafor would be a step in that direction, IMO. We’d be set at center for the foreseeable future. The people calling him a “bum” are out to lunch. A player like Okafor, (who BTW was the 2nd overall pick in the ‘04 draft), who works hard in the paint, fights like hell for rebounds, sets the tone on defense and doesn’t need the ball much to contribute, will accelerate the development of Tyreke, JT and Casspi.
We get those young guys all pointed in the same direction and add another lottery pick in June, we could have not just a contender to make the playoffs but a team that nobody wants to deal with in the 2011 post-season.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
I think the idea would be to make the playoffs this season
So a lottery pick is not the goal when you acquire Okafor.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
sure
like I said, making the playoffs would be fun, but it’s not the end-all-be-all for a team this raw and young.
I think the goal is to have a legit contender for an NBA title. To get there we need a system in place that can succeed, and we need to acquire very talented players who can work together within that system.
It’s not a goal to be in the lottery of course, but I do think the Kings are more likely to end up in the lottery than in the playoffs this season, and if that does happen I for one won’t be heartbroken about it, assuming things are looking bright in the near term.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
Well if that's the case
I don’t think the Kings will acquire Okafor. There’s no reason to acquire a contract of that length & price if you aren’t making the playoffs. No reason whatsoever.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
OK I'll say this...
To make the playoffs this season we’d need Tyreke to really accelerate his growth and some other things would have to go wrong for at least two other teams in the West, but we’d have a damn sight better chance of making the playoffs with Okafor than without him, that’s for sure.
(And the fact that we can even have this conversation is pretty amazing considering our leading scorer and Cisco are in street clothes).
My point is that what we don’t want to see is what the Warriors did a couple of years ago: arrive on the scene, make some noise and then fade back into the lottery as it all unravels.
I want the Kings foundation to be solid, and Okafor would help in that regard.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
Right (though the point may be moot)
Unless you are amazingly lucky, you want to be solid in the middle. Its much like Baseball, If your catcher can hit – its just a bonus, not a requirement. You need an anchor of defense and presence you can hang your hat on.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 16, 2009 10:01 AM PST up reply actions
I don't see...
…Houston qualifying for the playoffs without a McGrady resurgence later in the year(which I don’t think will happen).
Right
and we should still get a ‘decent’ one, unless you think Okafor gets us a looooong way.
I think he moves us from 8 or 9 to 15 myself.
Next year? 4th or 5th seed
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:01 AM PST up reply actions
There's something to be said for your point
However, two issues here – one, it’s difficult to select the CORRECT big man in a draft (unless there is just a slamdunk no-brainer). Go through the top 5 big men taken in each draft the last ten or fifteen years, and tell me what you think of them. Just assuming that any of the guys you listed can equal or exceed Okafor’s production is stretching things a bit.
Two, if you haven’t given up on Spencer Hawes, then adding Okafor gives you a young three-big rotation that will have you set at the position for the next half decade or so. And you don’t have to wait for a young big to start the development cycle from scratch.
Counterpoint – you’ve got a guy in Geoff Petrie making the draft pick in a big-heavy draft. You’d have to like the odds of him making a solid choice.
A fair point, but the 2010 draft is really, really stacked at the top
It’s hard to make a bad choice among these guys. Take Favors for instance. He already has a post-game, is a great finisher, can shoot out to 18 feet, is an exceptionally good rebounder, and he has insane hops. There are times in which the talent level reaches such a peak that people know intuitively that certain players are going to be can’t miss prospects in the NBA. Practically every scout and writer I’ve seen has been positively gushing about the talent level at the top of the draft.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
Right now it doesn't look like we'll be top 3 no matter what
Favors is likely a top 3 lock.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 16, 2009 10:05 AM PST up reply actions
As Bynum continues to develop, maybe Fakers would move Gasol
isn’t he an unrestricted free agent in ‘11? Don’t know if Id totally want him but … just trying to think of other centers coming up.
Will he develop? Not convinced he's much better/durable than okafor
He’s playing on a very good team which opens things up for him
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:27 AM PST up reply actions
And except for last season has missed a lot of games in the past 5-6 seasons.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
right, injury prone
though there are never guarantees. Martin may never miss more than another game or two. Look at Grant Hill.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:32 AM PST up reply actions
Okafor has never played
on a good team. You’d think Neworl – but he came when they were falling apart.
I’d also say that with CP3 now likely to miss a month, it possibly puts NewOrl in a very poor position to make the playoffs, sell tix, making them more likely to want to make this deal.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:31 AM PST up reply actions
Okafor has been there for 10 games
It’s not exactly like he was brought about into a team that just came off a WCF appearance.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
So in the middle of their championship window
The Lakers trade their second-best player? lolwut? The notion that the Lakers aren’t going to pay to keep him is ludicrous.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
Not trade, but not be able to re-sign
They have some age in thier key players. Going to need a PG very soon if not next year. Artest, Kobe, gasol, Odem, all over 30
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:34 AM PST up reply actions
Most of their bad contracts get off the books by then
They’ll still have all their core players, hence the championship window will still be open, and signing quality free agents isn’t a horribly large worry given how enticing L.A. will be to free agents. What on earth makes you think Buss isn’t going to open his wallet to resign Gasol?
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
I don't give a crap about the L*kers
But by my math they’ll be Old in thier core. But I really have no interest in discussing thier future
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 11:53 AM PST up reply actions
Then don't bother
To start a discussion that you have little to no knowledge about.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
by Ben R on Nov 15, 2009 5:52 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I don't like this trade at all
I mean, i know we need another big to just grab boards and get garbage points but come on? Sell our future? Especially with teams will be looking for that once piece off the bench to push them over that hump, we can trade Noc, for a young back up center or for an expiring contract then go after a big time free agent. Not many teams will have money to pay the big time players, and with Reke and JT making a splash maybe next year a big time player will look at sactown and thing, all they really need is a big time player, they have a great number 2 guy Reke, and great number 3 guy JT, and all they need is a number 1 and that’s me….(i have no idea where K-Speed is in all of this)
maybe next year a big time player will look at sactown and thing, all they really need is a big time player, they have a great number 2 guy Reke, and great number 3 guy JT, and all they need is a number 1 and that’s me….
And what if that doesn’t happen? the chances of that happening are minute. Just look at the history. When have we had a big named signing, as TZ pointed out? The odds of Okafor panning out for us while helping our squad grow and contend are much greater than us signing a big name free agent. And there are plenty of other teams that are willing to pay the “superstars” (NY, NJ, Miami, etc.)
DONT MAKE THIS TRADE!!!!
1. Okafor is not that good. 10pts and under 10 boards a game is not worth the money he is getting paid. Also, the 10 points he is averaging is bloated due to a big night vs. the terrible knicks.
2. Obtaining Okafor will hurt JT’s progression. Making this trade would tell JT that you either want to trade him or that you do not feel he is going to be our PF for the future.
3. He is getting paid HUGE money. In 3 or 4 years, we are going to be in the exact same situation as we are now with kenny thomas.
4. Kenny THomas is finally contributing to the team now. I know that it is an opportune time to trade him, but at what cost. Also, who’s to say that K9 cant keep up this solid play. Possibly sign him to a new contract at the end of this season for considerably less $$$.
5. Why is New Orleans trying to trade him? They must see something that makes them believe that he is not worth the $$ going forward.
My bottom line is that it seems as though the kings finally have a good thing going with a lot of young talent. Okafor is an over-rated big man and I do not want the kings puting themselves in a tough position.
However, despite my dislike of this possiblity, I do have faith in Petrie. Faith that he will make the best decision for the future of this team and city.
GO KINGS !!!!!!
GO KINGS!!
by AdamInTheNoseBleeds on Nov 15, 2009 8:42 AM PST reply actions
in response...
1. He’s a defensive presence. Also, that’s based on a small sample size with a new team and a hurt point guard.
2. If anything, I agree with this statement except replace all instances of “JT” with “Hawes.” JT knows hes one of the cornerstones of this franchise. Hawes’ place is way more up for debate.
3. Agree, although I think Okafor will contribute more.
4. Don’t resign Kenny unless its for the minimum.
5. They see their team is not working and he has a huge contract. I think they are ready to head for rebuilding mode.
All that said, I am still on the fence about this. It will hurt our chances of getting Favors or another quality big, who I think we’d all much rather have than Okafor. I think this trade makes our team a lot better, but also puts us in no-man’s land: Where you are good enough to not get a high draft pick but not good enough to challenge for a championship. Although if Tyreke becomes Dwyane-Wade-esque, we may regret not making this trade in a few years.
The NBA: "Where 27 free throws happens"
in response to #5
A fan on another site had a great post basically showing that just this season along getting KT instead of having Okafor would put the Bobcats below the luxury tax threshold, meaning not only would they save 4 million dollars but will also get paid out about 5 million for being under the threshold. So even putting aside future financial considerations, the Hornets make this trade cause they are going nowhere and their cheap or financially strapped owner will save/make 9 million dollars this year along from making this trade.
Two things.
Is there anyone out here who as actually seen Okafor play a bunch? I’m talking at least 25 games. We need someone who can really tell us what he brings. I’m talking everything…..attitude, injuries etc.? Second, again, in Petrie We Trust. If Petrie thinks it’s a deal worth doing , then we can trust it is.
Very true. I like Okafor a lot. I've watched him play enough to say this:
I’ve stated this a few times already – He brings what we need defensively but he isn’t what we need offensively.
Offensively, we need a guy who can post up and create his own shots. Scola, Kaman, Bynum, and even frikken Mbenga can all do this. Even Oden is using a few new moves this year. JT is getting better, but in a 7 game series, the opponents’ bigs will read the scouting report and block JT’s right hand (see Orlando vs L*kers Finals when the L*kers bigs shut the very predictable Howard down, making a non-factor). Hawes is a little ahead of JT in post moves but his average agility and speed put him at risk of getting swatted.
I can see Okafor playing above his head for Coach W. That’s the only reason I think this trade might work. Coach W has an intellect that I think Okafor will take to (Emeka is a pretty smart cookie himself). Emeka already has defense down and if he improves his offense every game (with help from our awesome coaching staff), he should be a more than capable, well-rounded big man by next season.
That being said, I’m split on the issue and will support whatever GP decides.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Interesting thread from the Bobcats blog
I thought it would be better to look there than in NO, because they really don’t know shit about his game, lo and behold:
http://www.rufusonfire.com/2009/10/29/1106225/chandler-vs-okafor-game-by-game
It’s basically a glorified I-told-you-so thread, but an interesting read with some decent arguments on both sides of the trade and a lot of small minded bickering that makes me appreciate the general mood here on STR all the more.
Hmmm....I dunno about that.
The guy with the “Suck my dick” statement trumps anybody’s argument in Sactown Royalty. That’s some genius thinking right there. [yes, that be’z sarcasm]
I hate to say it but there’s a lot of small-minded bickering over here too. Not so much as “Suck my dick” kind of stuff, but a lot of “look how much basketball knowledge” I have sort of crap. Half the time, people are having basketball knowledge prick contests instead of just talking “ball”.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
that is the purpose of fan boards - to give us all the right to talk out of our butts to each other
if we had to qualify with knowlege – you must pass a test to post – there would be the editors of the site, PookeyG and a handful of others (not me, my eye are brown for a reason) and that is it. This site is about Kings passion with some modicum of decorum to control the craziness.
700 posts alone here on a deal that may not exist. Tell me that is not insanity.
So put on your boots and get ready to wade through the muck and feel free to point out what smells or add your own flavor to the mix.
by betweentheeyes on Nov 15, 2009 11:43 AM PST up reply actions
Well sure
Opinion is being what it is (everyone has one, but yours is right), there’s always going to be people who talk smack and go around and around rehashing stupid arguments, but at least here at STR I feel like the community gradually moves forward over time. I guess it helps that we have a good GM and a plan this season, but I wouldn’t be able to read the Bobcats’ board for more than a week without quitting for good.
Okafor is not worth his contract
Why else would NO want to unload him? I think we can do better.
and to add
This deal would put the Kings paying more for Okafor than Kmart. That would not be right and may mess up team chemistry.
NO is painfully cheap
they don’t want to pay anybody. And they already messed up with Peja, they’re trying to cut corners now. Okafor might not be worth his contract, but is there any FA that is a good as him that will come to Sac?
www.idonthaveawebsitetoshamelesslypromoteinmysig.com
by In Walks Rudy on Nov 15, 2009 12:41 PM PST up reply actions
Hmm... No deal.
After reading this and reflecting, I decided to look up some numbers. Just how well has Okafor done against BIG Centers in this season. Now given that THIS IS A SMALL SAMPLE SIZE and makes this somewhat questionable, it is is still worth it to look at the past games.
What I wanted to see is if Okafor does well against really big guys. That is what we need. Somebody who can go toe to toe with big Centers like Kaman, Bynum/Gasol, or Oden.
Clipper’s Kaman: Okafor only got 2 points and 6 rebounds
Portland’s Oden: Okafor only got 7 points and 4 rebounds
Toronto’s Bargnani (a 7’0" C): Okafor only got 6 points and 8 rebounds
Celtics’ Perkins: Okafor only got 5 points, but did get 10 rebounds
Versus:
The only real breakout game Okafor has had this season was against NY Knick’s Lee where he scored 24 points and 10 rebounds. He also did OK against the L@kers with 10 points and 14 rebounds, but neither Bynum or Gasol played.
Overall, it doesn’t seem that Okafor does really well against big Centers and that is what we need. I think he could be dominated by a bigger player and abused similar to what we already experience. He doesn’t seem, IMHO, to add what this team needs and is pretty pricey.
No trade
You think maybe
measuring him using this year’s stats when he just got traded to a new team might not be the best measurement?
He’s a career 17.5 PER guy.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
He would be coming here
Trading into yet another team. That sounds more like the situation he is in now, being a new player on a team, then his other play from previous.
I thought about going back to the other season, but was only really interested in how he measures up against really big Centers. Might be interesting to see if he did better against them before this season. Preliminarily, based on this season, the answer is not so good.
Look up in the thread
I asked this question early and the research was done for a bigger sample last year. Mixed results against the West (only play each team once) – but pretty good against Port, LA Utah
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 11:58 AM PST up reply actions
Ehh...on a sorry team that's out of sync, these stats don't mean much.
It’s apparent that Okafor needed at least a month to get into the system. He didn’t participate in their training camp due to his injured toe and that’s pretty crucial to fitting into any new system.
Anywho – here some numbers. Since I didn’t watch any of these games, these numbers don’t tell me jacksh*t. The only thing they do tell me is that they confirm what I already know; that Okafor rebounds like a monster and blocks shots EVERY game. These numbers also tell me, no one on StR should believe he’s the answer for us on the offensive end. Here they are, take from them what you want.
Stats are pts/rb/bs (+/-)
NO 114 – Dallas 107
Dampier 16/14/3 (-12)
Okafor 11/13/3 (+14)
NY 117 – NO 111
Lee 28/8/0 (11)
Okafor 24/10/3 (3)
BOSTON 97 – NO 87
Perkins 12/7/1 (+11)
Okafor 5/10/2 (-6)
LAL 104 – NO 88
Mbenga 10/12/4 (+17)
Okafor 10/14/1 (-16)
NO 112 – LAC 84
Kaman 14/6/1 (-27)
Okafor 2/6/2 (+18)
PORTLAND 86 – NO 78
Oden 8/12/3 (+7)
Okafor 7/4/1 (-5)
*note: Okafor had the least +/- out of the NO starters. Everybody else was around -15.
ATL 121 – NO 98
Horford 14/5/0 (+29)
Okafor 8/12/2 (-15)
*note: Again, he had the least +/- out of the NO starters.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Thanks
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 12:03 PM PST up reply actions
Yer welcome, it had to be done and the Chargers game isn't on till 1pm. :)
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Not on here - sucks
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions
Yikes that does suck. I'll assume you guys are stuck watching the 9ers or the Retards.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Bengals and steelers are curreently boring thier fans to death
Vikings and Detroit (really?)
Cowboys and packers soon which might be worth watching. 49rs played Thur and thankfully the raiders have a bye week.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
If the decision was made on recent production....
then ‘yeah this trade shouldn’t happen’. He’s not playing well. I saw him last night against the Hawks, he sucked. Went through the motions, paint was wide open. But Petrie has to envision how he will fit with the current mix, the effect PW can have on him, study the bulk of his career for production, development and regression, and talk to those in the know personally. For $60 million there’s a lot of homework and due diligence. I am sure the Kings already had an extensive file on him anyway going back to the draft, and periodic updates, like they do with all players (hopefully).
Anyway, at first I thought ‘nah, this guy is an underachiever, career loser with modest stats’. But when I think about the potential he has as a player, the skills he could bring, and the alternatives available in free agency, and trades, I think this may be a risk worth taking.
I think it is important to add if we get Emeka, we are not a finished product all of the sudden. On another fan board the commentary was how this move would mean our rebuild is complete. Once we see how this group meshes over 30 to 40 games, I could still envision another trade or two by Petrie to try to get us to elite status.
Is he the answer though?
We have a lack of ability to defend against the really dominant Centers. Big and beefy guys are just going to abuse us. I don’t think this guys solves that. He is expensive and doesn’t solve our main Center deficit so why spend this money. I think the JT and Spence can basically give you the points and rebounding this guy delivers…
Just not sold as his playing time in match ups does not seem to be that different from who we already have on the team. Who would he be a better match up against?
He can hold his own
If he was the ‘answer’ he wouldn’t be available (allegedly) for free. But if you look at his career production, it is super steady. He is a career double-double with two blocks. He has been durable lately, playing 82 games last 2 seasons.
I think the Kings are looking at Spencer and saying ‘Spencer is not ready. It is going to another 2 to 3 years at least before we see a finished product.’ Emeka can fill a role on this team, a quality big guy to be asked to do the dirty work, trigger our break, carve out room in the paint.
He doesn’t have the ceiling of Oden, or Bynum, or even Chris Kaman, because he can’t score as well, but he can defend the post better than Hawes, provide better weak side defense than Hawes, and run the floor better than Hawes, and make the best centers work their points. Dominant, no. Upgrade, yes.
Agreed. I just wish the Kings didn't have to pay so much.
Dominant, no. Upgrade, yes
For me it’s not about Okafor’s play, it’s about the money. He brings what we need defensively, but he doesn’t bring that big man with consistent back to the basket moves we so desperately need. That’s my main issue. That being said, I have no doubts that Coach W would motivate Omeka to play to his highest potential.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Yes,
I get the upgrade part and can see blob’s point as well. I am also having a problem tying this much money for just an upgrade…
Word.
Okafor gets his points like JT and David Lee do; with hustle and put backs. If he had the offensive arsenal of a Kaman or even Scola, I’d be more than STOKED to get him for that much money. But he doesn’t. That being said, I do think he can improve. JT has actually used his left hand recently and scored with it.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Once Kenny is gone at end of season
Is there some way to pursue Chris Bosh?
by getPGwithbounce on Nov 15, 2009 11:31 AM PST reply actions
Yes
Phone, email, or gift basket.
by bench_blob on Nov 15, 2009 11:45 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I've said it before - FORGET IT
He goes to NY or Miami (slight chance he stays in Tor) End of Story
I should have just let Blob’s humor answer but . . (no, i should have)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 11:50 AM PST up reply actions
Ok after thinking about it here what id like to see.
I’m fine with K9 for Okafor if we can Ship Noc and our first round pick to Utah for Harpring and the NYK first rounder. Though i’m not sure Utah would be interesting in this but if they were then we taking the salary hit with Okafor doesn’t seem as bad Since Noc and Harpring would be off the books next year for us and we still are picking in the Top 3 next year Securing more future talent for cheap. We all know we are not getting anything off the free agent market but this would keep us going in the right direction with more options.
The notion that Utah is giving up the NYK first rounder
For Nocioni is laughable.
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
Well they still get our pick so they would still be picking in the lottery
Only a little bit down, just a matter of if they think competing this year is worth dropping a few picks in the lottery. Probably not i agree but its the only team competing that i could see using Noc.
And moral of the story
is not matter how we do it if we get Okafor id like to see Noc come off the books some how with the young talent we have at the wing plus Martin / Cisco coming back at some point. Its just logical to have some flexibility with cap room. Even if we have no hope at singing a free agent.
No - I agree
They might give up Thier pick though. Which leaves possibilities.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 1:00 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah probably more likely too.
And that still leave us with most likely a late lottery pick and a late teens pick which would still indeed leave us with a lot of possibilities. I like this as well.
Yes - that would be good :)
I don’t know that we could ever pry the Knicks pick out of Utah – but Hmmmmmmm
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 15, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions
Any team would have to pay Utah to get them to tack on long term salary
And you want them to give up a lotto pick so they can add a guy who overlaps with either Kirilenko or Millsap?
How about this
a second team of Hawes,Brockman,garcia,beno,casspi. I can live with that.
no kidding.
thats a ridiculous bench. Beno is a fantastic third gaurd, and I think being the Engergizer Bunny is the best way to use Cisco.
I'd rather watch Hawes, Brockman and Kenny play
than Okafor. No hustle issues, warranted or not, and a whole lot less dough.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 1:15 PM PST reply actions
i agree.
i don’t want to play star level money for a mediocre player.
12 million a year is not star level money. It's not even in the top 20.
I’ll agree to disagree. Okafor isn’t a star but he isn’t mediocre either.
‘Mediocre’ doesn’t average 13 points, 10 rebounds and almost 2 block shots a game. I’d actually say that’s better than the average NBA center.
I agree in that I just don’t like the fact that it takes away our flexibility for future moves down the line.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Shelling out $12 million a year
or 25% of your payroll for the next five years for “better than average” isn’t going to cut it.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 1:57 PM PST up reply actions
Actually it is even worse
Goes all the way up to almost 15 million the last year. This kills future options which kills this deal for me.
If he wasn't making so much money I would do this in a heartbeat.
The contract is the deal breaker for me.
Not as bad as you make it out to be.
Okafor’s contract really isn’t that long, and you can shorten its length by a year because the Kings should be able to trade him in 2013 (an expiring 14.5 million dollar contract can be valuable in itself) if he doesn’t work out. The Kings should sign him, get some wins and playoff experience, and then trade him for a final piece to the puzzle — or not trade him if he ends up playing well. Either way, I don’t see this move as killing the King’s future and it ultimately helps them get more wins which is what I want to see as a fan.
by Pollard4LIfe on Nov 15, 2009 2:35 PM PST up reply actions
I see your points. Getting to the playoffs this year exceeds any expectations.
If it brings in revenue and a winning ethos to the team, things can only get better in every way, especially financially.
I’ve stated earlier that Okafor would probably play his heart out for Coach W. If there’s a coach that could get Emeka to play at his highest level, it’s probably Coach W.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Yep. Agreed. But if "Omeka" had offense to go with his defense - I'd totally go for it, cat.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
You agree with Coolcat
but your premise is wrong. Okafor is not “mediocre”. On the contrary he’s a better than average NBA big man, with serious skills that the Kings lack.
Hawes, Brockman and Kenny, on the other hand, are mediocre, at best. Maybe you guys will have fun watching them, but personally I’d rather get on the road to contending for an NBA title within a couple of seasons.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
Why is Okafor so much better than Hawes?
When I look at the stats on NBA.com, under PTS/REB/ASSTS, Okafor is at 17th place among centers and Spencer is 20th. And, as we all know Spencer is shooting poorly and well below last years shooting percentage. And, 0 for, on 3pt shooting when he was over 37% last year.
And JT’s numbers put him 20 places ahead of Okafor. Okafor is 41st among Forwards.
I’ve been saying the Kings need another center since training camp. But, paying $60M for a guy who is marginally better that what we have seems rediculous. Didn’t we get into a death spirol the last time we committed $60 to one player?
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
Please stop looking at 2009-2010 stats
You’re taking 11 games on a mess of a team for Okafor over real, tangible stats…namely his entire career. I have a hard time taking you seriously when you place Okafor and Hawes in the same echelon of centers in the league.
Plus, this doesn’t remove Hawes from the equation. Okafor would be replacing the Brockman/Thomas/May hydra that fills up the minutes behind JT and Hawes currently.
I just don’t get why we overvalue Hawes so much. I like the guy, I’m rooting for the guy to succeed, and I know he’s only 21…but I think you’re crazy to hold off on improving your roster just on the offchance he becomes a great player.
Okafor's numbers haven't change much over the last 3 years.
No ones overvaluing Spencer. For what he’s paid and what he does, he’s a good value. What seems to be the big question about Okafor is, Is he worth what he’s being paid?
2008,09 numbers rank Okafor 8th among Center, and Spencer 20th. But, again he wasn’t a starter like Okafor and didn’t play as many minute. Interesting note, Brad Miller was 13th last year among centers.
One last point, if the salary cap continues to drop, so will salaries. Because both are tied to Basketball Revenue. So, it’s possible that Okafors contract could be more out of line a couple of years down the line. Making him harder to move later than he is now.
Having said that, I’ll agree that having an overpriced big on your roster isn’t the worst type of personel problem. We were able to move Webber, Right?
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
I answered a bit of the stats question in another thread
And Okafor’s numbers last season were far superior to Hawes in almost every category, including stats over 48 minutes. Additionally, if you look at different statistics besides raw numbers (for last season), you can get the following:
WinShares – Okafor 8.2 (in 2,691 minutes played), Hawes 0.8 (in 2,259 minutes played)
Roland Rating (modified plus/minus) – Okafor +3.5, Hawes -6.0
PER – Okafor 18.01, Hawes 13.07
Again, Okafor is not a “marginal” upgrade from Hawes. He is a far better player.
And again, we really should be comparing these numbers to the Brockman/May/K9 three headed hydra that mans the paint after Hawes and JT.
Right - use the last few years, not a bad 11 game sample
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 16, 2009 9:55 AM PST up reply actions
it's not just the 2009-2010 stats
Hawes has improved every year in the league, and he is almost Okafor’s equal as a center already. He gives us about 2 less rebounds, but he is already a better offensive player.
Getting Okafor will dramatically improve our bench. The question is, is that worth $60mil?
I’m ok with either way this turns out, but if this trade goes through, it is a definite departure from our current rebuilding plan. It may make us a playoff contender for the next 3-4 years, but i’m not sure where it leaves us after that. I’m not sure about the opportunity cost for being able to re-sign our own developing players, or adding new ones.
Sure
Spencer has improved every year in the league. But he is still not a good player in this league.
If Okafor comes here, he’s got to be the starter, and you have to ask the question of resigning Hawes at the end of his contract to be your third big coming off the bench and how much he is worth, IMO.
It's not that he's better than Hawes...
….it’s that his skillset complements our starting unit better.
Besides
there are Biblical issues involved. The Kenny Thomas story is a tale of redemption, while Okafor is an example of coveting your neighbor’s (damaged) goods.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 1:55 PM PST reply actions
The best thing about this deal
is it creates some buzz for the Kings and gets the discussion off the guy who’s hurt.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 15, 2009 2:45 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
+1
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
have always been an okafor fan...
love what he would bring to the kings. would love this move if it happens.
"When talent is roughly equal," said Westphal, "the competitive guys win. You have to have that in this league. Here's a perfect example: We (the Phoenix Suns) drafted Tim Perry and Dan Majerle the same year (1988). Now, if you get a stopwatch for down and back (baseline to baseline sprint), Tim Perry was faster than Dan Majerle. That's a fact. But if you had them race, Dan Majerle won. I can't explain it. Somehow, he had that drive, that fire, something inside him. If you have enough guys like that, your team starts winning again."
UPDATE!
From Sam’s Twitter:
Not expecting the Okafor-Thomas discussions to go anywhere. Sounds like more Kings-Hornets ideas thrown around beyond that one.
www.mancancook.net
The Maloof's decided they couldn't afford the back end in the worst case scenario
That’s what happened. Or, they don’t wnat Okafor because of recent performance. Or something else entirely that would be difficult to anticipate.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Probably a combo of all three
But, it’s definitely a breath of fresh air that they were willing to consider a contract like that. The fact that it was feasible for them to take on that much money could be a positive.
www.mancancook.net
You can only say it's feasible if they did so V
Until then, you can’t really credit them with something they haven’t done. And, who knows, they might change their mind.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
From what I understand
it seems like this was taken into consideration seeing as how it was even mentioned to Amick. All I’m saying is that its a positive sign if they even considered it rather than looking at that contract and saying “no effing way!”
www.mancancook.net
Okay that's different
Good point.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Agreed.
I’m happy that the Maloofs didn’t just see the 12 million dollar tag and say “absolutely not”. It’s important to me that they even considered adding such a hefty contract. Especially at times like these. Would have been better if they pulled the trigger though (assuming NO was down for the trade)
NO was down
The Kings probably haven’t convinced themselves they need to pull the trigger yet. They probably won’t unless something changes.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
At what point do you think the Kings can change their mind?
If our hot streak continues and we continue to play well, maybe even linger around the .500 (i know this is highly unlikely). I don’t see why we wouldn’t do this. The goal of reaching the playoffs this year are highly unlikely, and i wouldn’t predict that we get there with or with out Okafor this year but next year we would definately contend.
Also, if we decide to pull the trigger, i see no reason to trade away Noc. If we make the statement that we are aiming for the playoffs next year, Nocioni would be an essential piece of the puzzle imo.
I have no idea
My personal feeling is that if you’re going to take the plunge or change your mind down the road, you’re going to wish that it was done sooner. I think it’s a mistake to make Okafor a centerpiece of any trade deadline deal when he can help you for more games earlier.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
The maloofs probabally said. " Lets think about this for a bit (pause for 8 seconds) . . .
" . . . absolutely not, no efffing way"
Ba-da
Okay, I've been drinking
and I’m adverse to signing up for anything ESPN so I don’t have links but the following works.
[pipedream]
Under the premise NO wants to save money and in RE: this if you’re the Kings don’t you float (and pray for):
Sac outgoing
Sergio Rodriguez
Kenny Thomas
John Brockman
1st round pick 2010
1st round pick 2012
NO outgoing
Chris Paul
Marcus Thornton
Antonio Daniels trade exemption
And then, in hopes the Jazz want to get something of value for Boozer and are willing to remember some goodwill from the Keon Clark trade do:
Sac outgoing:
Kevin Martin
Andres Nocioni
Utah outgoing:
Carlos Boozer
Matt Harpring
1st rounder in either 2010 or 2012
[/pipedream]
If you’re the Kings, you do this right? Am I drunk, crazy or both?
Nothing says lets unload our whole squad like winning 4 games in a row
no worries you’re prob. just a little drunk.
Ba-da
Um...what?
I am probably a little, or more, drunk, but your issue with these trades are on the Kings’ side? If anything, I think I’m overvaluing the Kings’ assets here… Trading one above average shooting guard, a borderline starter and some cap space for and all-world point guard, filler and um, cap space, makes for a pretty sweet situation for the Kings especially considering the glut at small forward. I see this as hardly “unloading ‘our’ whole squad.” Jeez, I thought I would be questioned from the other side of this…
You probably mean 'moot'
But good job refuting what I’ve said.
Suggestion: change your avatar, genius.
Albert Einstein was a scientist not a grammar teacher.
But I think you have a good point in changing my avatar . . .
Ba-da
Stop being a hater
Mute points are cool.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
I was just trying to emphasize it was a silent point
Plus if we all start using mute instead of moot Websters will be forced to change it in the dictionary. The dictionary changes all the time there just needs to be a massive movement that they notice. Maybe Ziller can notify all other NBA blogs.
Pretty soon we’ll be criticizing people for using moot instead of mute.
Ba-da
did you mean a salient point?
"I make love to pressure" - Stephen Jackson
Petrie wont do this
A notoriously patient GM, I can’t see this as anything more than weighing the options. Okafor has too many years for too much money. I like the activity because we all know Chris Bosh aint coming this offseason and the frontcourt lacks depth. If improvements to the roster are going to be made its going to come via trade, but I believe Petrie can find a more reasonable contract come the deadline
I agree.
And we can’t discount the fact that Hawes is only 21. Big men usually take longer to hit their stride than guards/wings. If Hawes can step up a notch, which at this point I think is very likely, and Brockman isnt awful, our front court needs will be much more specific than spending 12 mill a year on a center (though I really like the trade too), and Petrie can chase a lower-priced specialist.
by MichaelMack on Nov 16, 2009 12:07 AM PST up reply actions
Funny
It appears that the mere sight of a rumor has awoken “the trade machine guy” in all of us.
I can understand a lot of you guys...
For all you who said you love this deal one minute and hate it the next, I am right there with you. And let’s be honest, it’s all about the two elements of how good Okafor is (or may not be) and how big the contract coming in is.
I am not worried about missing the opportunity to bring LeBron James in—let’s cut that off right now. Neither am I considering Bosh or Wade possibilities. It’s not the free agent market now that concerns me, but it is the possibility of being strapped by a player who may not be good enough to warrant the financial restrictions he places on the team. All this while the team is certainly not in a position to be looking to load in the last piece for a title run.
In the end, I think I could be very happy with this trade as it would create a very good 3-man frontcourt rotation that I have looked forward to (and maybe some looks for Hawes at PF?). I would also hope a trade of Nocioni would follow to give the Kings some future cap flexibility although I could still find myself happy without such a trade.
Yet I would also be happy without this trade happening considering the possible negative ramifications of bringing in Okafor. And let’s be honest, we have a 4-game winning streak against (5 of 6) against borderline and bad teams and only one win was an away game.
And hey, Hawes is only 21. ;-)
Visit my sports blog: Triple Slash Sports
by nobodyinparticular on Nov 15, 2009 8:40 PM PST reply actions 2 recs
I refuse to agree with anything coherent & thoughtful
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
As if you could even recognize a coherent thought :)
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
Crazy is as a grandfather clock
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Well that's another mute point.
Come on everybody it will catch on!!!!
See above if you don’t know what the hell I’m talking about.
Ba-da
Yeah we know Ba-Da
The up button can tell you who’re replying to. FYI.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Thanks, I wasn't sure how that worked. I feel like I need to take blogging 101 at the
local community college. That would be CRC. Seriously I don’t know 1/2 the things you can do. I’ve been afraid of the "up"and “action” buttons (or links or whatever the damn things are called . . .see, I need to take a class) since I’ve been on this blog (about 4-5 months ago).
I think I tried inserting a picture by cutting and pasting and it didn’t work.That would be nice to figure out also.
All the more reason I need to change my avatar. . .
Ba-da
Links are easy: click the chain link (it's next to quotes)
The purple boxes you see are the quote button. “B” makes it bold, “I” makes the words look like this, the only way you can insert a picture with a url like this
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
sweet.
The purple boxes you see are the quote button. "B"
Trying stuff out . . .
How do you get the URL for an image that you already have on your computer?
Ba-da
Can't do it that way in a comment (only on fanposts)
You have to have an image off an url. There’s a formatting guide SBN has that should answer all your questions.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Happy to
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Well golly gee whiz
You’d be happy with or without a trade? How utterly, riveting!
Is this anything more than, “Well, whatever.”?
Non-related but nonetheless -
You may or may not be a douche bag.
Read the comments, dunce. It explores the pros and cons of making this deal. As is the case with most fair deals, there is a positive and a negative on both sides. This is one of those cases.
If everything has to be far left or far right for you to make sense of it, that’s your problem. I found particular’s comments to be concise, cogent, and on point.
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
by section214 on Nov 15, 2009 9:19 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
How dare you have an adult opinion 214?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
I most certainly may or may not be a douche bag
or a douche nozzle or douche nugget, whatever your preference ;)
Regardless, this comment says:
“This possible trade could possibly be great!”
or
“This possible trade could possibly be the worst thing ever!”
How could you not agree ‘100%’ with that?
If that’s what is considered a cogent argument, nobodyinparticular should run for office.
Which is probably true notwithstanding however ‘left’ or ‘right’ you may be….
If that's how you are reading it,
then you are indeed as drunk as you claim to be. You have posted about 7-8 comments today, and they have all been of the cranky variety. Perhaps you should sleep it off and try again tomorrow. Regardless, you’ll have to forge ahead without me. You’re closing in on troll status, and life is too short.
Have a good evening.
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
Perhaps
you can explain how you are reading it… I’m not sure my comprehension will be any better sober… Sure I’m cranky, maybe I need someone to explain to me what other people, who are not you, are saying. Can you please supply such answers?
Sleep well my friend. My only hope is I awake tomorrow morning with your sage scripture to my inane and silly mind writings.
My one attempt
I can understand a lot of you guys…For all you who said you love this deal one minute and hate it the next, I am right there with you. And let’s be honest, it’s all about the two elements of how good Okafor is (or may not be) and how big the contract coming in is.
It absolutely is about how good Okafor is for the price he is coming with.
I am, too, not worried about the 2010 FA market. I’ve said for 2 years that it’s a complete crock to expect anything worthwhile so many teams trying to do something at the same time.
I am not worried about missing the opportunity to bring LeBron James in—let’s cut that off right now. Neither am I considering Bosh or Wade possibilities. It’s not the free agent market now that concerns me, but it is the possibility of being strapped by a player who may not be good enough to warrant the financial restrictions he places on the team. All this while the team is certainly not in a position to be looking to load in the last piece for a title run.
I agree with this point myself. Moving Noc for flexibility sake if the Kings acquired Okafor makes all the sense in the world. Plus, it’s a great way to see how good Hawes is at the PF as opposed to having him play C all the time.
In the end, I think I could be very happy with this trade as it would create a very good 3-man frontcourt rotation that I have looked forward to (and maybe some looks for Hawes at PF?). I would also hope a trade of Nocioni would follow to give the Kings some future cap flexibility although I could still find myself happy without such a trade.
Yet I would also be happy without this trade happening considering the possible negative ramifications of bringing in Okafor. And let’s be honest, we have a 4-game winning streak against (5 of 6) against borderline and bad teams and only one win was an away game. And hey, Hawes is only 21. ;-)
I feel the same way. Okafor is a huge risk if you’re going to take his money on. If he isn’t even an All-Star, you’re paying a guy a lot of money to be a valuable role player. There are valuable role players who cost less in the NBA.
I can see why the Kings have said no up to this point, or are simply just “considering”. I can also see why the Kings would say yes. This isn’t a simple A B C deal here, and has positive and negative ramifications. The Kings need to know can they live with the negatives as a balance to the positives.
If that isn’t a fair statement to you, well, drunk or not, you’re not really understanding the situation of what’s going on here.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Okay, thanks.
I just erased a very long response to this…I’ll try to recreate the essence.
I’ll stipulate point one and two.
Moving Nocioni has nothing to do with the proposed trade. Shit, I think it’d be great if Nocioni was traded tomorrow – I need no other trade to make me happy.
Plus, doesn’t Nocioni play the three? Plus, who gives a shit if Hawes plays the four? Can’t he do that with JT?
How is Okafor, a player you can obtain via trade – today – a questionable variable against, um, Thomas’ contract? Are we really saying that we’d rather see the franchise save money against the cap? What the fugg?
I’ve already gave thoughts on the fact that the Okafor/Thomas trade is a non-issue above so this all seems silly now, doesn’t it?
Very silly
Silly enough to have generated 800+ responses with 50 different people responding. Very silly indeed.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
That's what you have?
Silly? Somehow, I expected better.
Why fight with you?
What would the purpose be? If you think it’s silly then that’s fine. But there are at least 60-70 people who disagree with you (it’s quite a bit more than 50—that was a miscount on my part) to argue this very topic.
And, if it’s such a big deal, why stay up until almost midnight to argue it?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Dude, you argue with everyone
I mention a notion being silly because the beat writer who first mentioned the idea of acquiring a player later says it isn’t something being discussed any longer and I’m the dickface? How exactly does this happen?
I argue with everyone
Everyone being who? On this site? No. Sorry, that means I argue at every opportunity. That isn’t true, but, whatever, you seem to like this idea. Stick with it; it’s a good look for you.
The notion that NIP put forth was one I had wrote myself yesterday. It’s not exactly a new notion or one ill-advised or anything.
If the issue is dead, as Amick says it is via his Twitter, than why do you continue to argue the point? I disagree with you that it’s silly. It’s anything but. It’s a major decisions, yay or nay, for a franchise to make.
Even if the issue is dead, who cares if a few people choose to sound off? You don’t have to read it.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
yeah, I want to keep it going!
Even if the trade never happens, just talking about the rumor gives a poor shmuck like me a glimmer of hope that GP really does care about interior defense!
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
Someday you'll have to prove to me how shot blocking equates to interior defense
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
You don't think Okafor
is just a shot blocker, right? From what I’ve seen Emeka is athletic and mobile and can keep up with attacking opponents.
He’s strong, doesn’t give up a lot of ground. He has extremely long arms and can get in people’s faces, altering shots and passes.
And he looks like he knows what he’s doing on the court, anticipates action and gets in position to do something about it.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
I'm still awake
What’s your ideal situation?
good point MM
Having good interior defends includes shot blocking, but that’s not the only component. Having players alter shots, or take an extra pump fake because they fear having their shot blocked is easily as important.
by MichaelMack on Nov 16, 2009 12:13 AM PST up reply actions
Of course not MM
It’s clear you like Oka4. No reason not to at this point I suppose.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
'cept the ca$$$h
well, that and the buzzkill that this is all just a bunch of talk.
"When the going gets Weird, the Weird turn professional."
(Hunter Thompson)
Are you surprised?
He’s not a star, he’s not likely to be an All-Star, he’s not a personality a lot of fans can gravitate towards, many people question his heart and abilities down low (especially Hornets fans who compared him to Chandler in that respect), and he’s paid a lot of money.
I personally think that playing in Charlottte and Larry Brown is not necessarily the best thing for a guy like Okafor. He’s too reserved a personality, but here that doesn’t matter as long as you can play. Maybe I’m alone in that thought process though.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
My mistake
I forgot you are the bearer of goodwill. You need more yarn?
Fantastic you agree with what was written yesterday. We’re almost into tomorrow, don’t you think discussions should be based in the time we’re in? I ask you why isn’t it silly any longer? Why stay up til midnight? Because I am anyway…
I don’t want to be a complete dick here, but why are you responding to me and telling me I don’t have to read/respond to posts. I’ve been around long enough to understand that…
Of course you have
Far be it for me to suggest an action that coincides with propiety.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Or however you spell propriety
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Christ
You want to have a discussion, have a discussion. You responded to me. Don’t try and act a martyr.
What are you drinking?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
What aren't you drinking?
You poor thing!
Well I'm not drinking Mac n Jacks or Dos Equis
So, yeah.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
You aren't drinking sense either
So yeah…
What are you trying to clear up here?
Just wanted to know what you were drinking
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
I've graduated to water
I’m not sure it matters in the context, but I guess it may…
Best thing to get drunk off
At least you know you’ll be hydrated AND fucked up.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
Howl at the moon for me
Good night.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea
I swore to AI I was going to keep it real
Gotta bash the streak.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by 






















