Quick Math on the Kevin Martin Injury
by Tom Ziller on Nov 6, 2009 9:06 AM PST
in Commentary
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PrintGames Kevin Martin would miss if he had his fractured wrist surgically repaired or allowed it to heal, assuming the longest stated schedule for recovery: 29.
Games Kevin Martin is under contract for with the Kings: 323.
***
Would you rather have Martin miss 29 while letting a fracture heal, or would you rather he play injured for eight weeks, then spending the rest of his lucrative contract hobbled by arthritis? Are the next 29 games more important than the subsequent 294?
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Kevin
Needs to let it heal… Get surgery and be back at the start of the year.
Get well Kevin.
Go Kings!
Blessings.Love.Peace
by lifestyleforthesellout on Nov 6, 2009 9:23 AM PST reply actions
No.
The next 29 games are meaningless. We will win fewer than 8 of them even with Kevin Martin.
Get the surgery.
And for the record, I don’t think you’re fragile, KMart, I think you play all-out and tend to get thrown around a lot.
The draft lottery has reinforced my belief that there are not enough bad words in the English language.
by LeaguePassAddict on Nov 6, 2009 9:25 AM PST reply actions
I don't think he knows how to play without throwing his body around
and he’s had some bad luck. It will all pay off when we draft Favors, Evans grows up and we’re contending in two years.
(please please)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 6, 2009 9:57 AM PST up reply actions
Uh...I'll assume you meant to say
JOHN WALL!
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
by PhutureKings on Nov 6, 2009 12:50 PM PST up reply actions
In all likelihood,
the arthritis probably wouldn’t set in until later in life…after his playing days are over. JK.
Thanks for pointing out that Garcia will have actually missed more games. I hadn’t realized that. I also don’t think Kevin is soft, I know he plays hard. But, “injury prone” does not equal “soft,” it equals “crappy for us.”
Lastly, on a totally unrelated side note, Modern Warfare 2 is out Tuesday. I’m on PS3 and would like to get a fairly stable clan going. If anyone is down, my PSN username is SPACIAL-D
Just send me a friend request (with a short message indicating you’re from StR).
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
Can't wait for this game to come out!!
My roommates and I already pre-ordered it. Too bad I’m on XBOX.
by UCIrvine kings fan on Nov 6, 2009 10:46 AM PST up reply actions
Trade him
Tell everyone it was joke, KMart is really Ok and trade him. Sorry, but time to bite the bullet. You people throw the word “potential” around too much with this team. Ya know, every young player has potential. Shoot, I even have potential. I just don’t have time to work on it given my already full time job.
Trade our only talent asset maybe throw in a Woof, get a true, proven, star and that in turn will draw other stars via free agency. Trust me. I minored in General Managing during home school.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
I have no idea what to say to this
Other than to go, huh?
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I don't comment on idiocy
Ok, sometimes I do, just not on important stuff.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 6, 2009 9:49 AM PST up reply actions
i don't think it was
Life is every mammal's journey from very very wet to very very dry.
I don't know...the guy has a point
I myself often wonder when Kevin Martin will finally realize his potential. I’m sick of seeing the fleeting, interspersed moments of greatness. I’m sick of the lack of consistency and poor shot selection. I’m sick of seeing him score 48 points one night, and then a lowly 28 the next.
When WILL Kevin Martin finally reach his potential and become a capable scorer!?!
(yes, this was sarcasm).
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
by PhutureKings on Nov 6, 2009 12:54 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
A bit Saracasm, a lot truth
You’re all on K-mart’s jock. Yes. He is good. But he is not the answer. I see too much KMart loving on this message board always combined with some sort of comment on how there is potential surrounding him. Sacramento needs a bonified star, simple as that. No star. No revenue. No revenue. No fans. No fans. No kings. Time to look at it the way the Maloofs have since day one. Professional Sports is a Business. And we have a poor business plan.
I’ve watched all the kings games this season and haven’t seen much change in his game. KMart does not show emotion on the court, he has lazy defense and hes injury prone. Yes, he is a GREAT scorer. Get something for him while we can.
Your all going to hate on me after this comment, but I’m looking towards the future and just call it like I see it. And I don’t see a kings team. Maybe a Sacramento A’s team..hey, maybe UFL. . . not kings.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
StR isn't a message board
’Nuff said.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Troll.
No more replies or mention of Sammyp831, please.
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
Yessah PK!
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
It's not a fan forum either
If you guys don’t allow opinions. It’s easy to get defensive when somebody suggest to trade your golden nugget.
Pookey, are you on your soapbox offline too? Or do you just hold this power when your identity is masked through the internet? Technology.. brings out the DB in everyone.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
My identity isn't being masked
What do you want my actual address where I live? I can save you the time. It’s a shithole.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
And who said anything about being defensive about trading Kevin Martin?
You didn’t come up with a trade proposal (that would most likely be stupid) that I would get to reject and show my outright snobbery with.
Who said anybody about NOT being a fan forum. I said StR is NOT a message board. Read what I write dumbshit.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
You're such an easy pushover
Look how quick you put your defensive walls up. I don’t care where you live man. I just wanted to know if you’re a DB to people in the real world or if it just happens on a forum where no face to face confrontation can occur.
And I said this isn’t a fan forum. There are a handful of people that dominate this forum and talk shit to anyone who says something different from their opinion.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
by Sammyp831 on Nov 6, 2009 2:08 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Fuck You
And the Horse you rode in on. Good day.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I want names!
Who are these handful? Is this another one of those “group think” posts?
This is a very good fan forum Sammyp831. I have spent the last few days defending counter points to both the Udoka signing and the Kevin Martin injury without having anyone talk shit about me or my views. There has been discussion of my points, rebuttal posts and research to lend evidence from both sides.
If this isn’t the type of conversation you are looking for please find somewhere else to toil.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
I also went back to see other debates that we have had Sammy.
And I think we had a pretty good discussion in the Bench-Blob “Is Cisco to Blame?” post. I posted this in response to your point of view as a personal trainer.:
I understand that you believe that you are coming from a position of knowledge on this subject. I just disagree with your position, reasoning and conclusion.
I wasn’t being mean or attacking you as a person. I just disagree with what you were posting and I gave evidence and reasoning to support my position as someone with an alternative experience on the same subject.
I guess we can kind of be like Paris France here at StR. People love Paris (Louve, Eifel Tower, Notre Dame, Arc de Triumph) but most traveler say they hate Parisians. You can love the information here and the Kings but you might not like some of the natives.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Fantasyland
I’ve watched all the kings games this season and haven’t seen much change in his game. KMart does not show emotion on the court, he has lazy defense and hes injury prone.
I guess we’ve been watching different games. I hope the Kings won more of the games you were watching.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 6, 2009 2:34 PM PST up reply actions
Sorry, but ...
Let’s go back to his 48pt night. Did you see his leadership on the court? I didn’t. I don’t see a guy yelling at great plays. Making his presence known.. Yeah, he acted like he road a horse for two steps but.. Now, Defense? Didn’t see much of that.. Unless of course you consider holding a player who who averaged 18.5 points a game last year to 22 points good defense. Kevin Martin is good. I’m not objecting to that. But he is not a “Star”. He is the Eric Chavez of the Kings. Great when he is healthy, but always injured. If you think this team should be centered around Kevin Martin, you’re crazy. Tell me one team that has won a championship with somebody at Kevin Martin status.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
It's a fundamental weakness of Speed Ed
He doesn’t fly, and it’s his fault that everyone else doesn’t sport wings so they all can become instantaneous 747’s at a moment’s notice.
It’s all Speed’s fault that he can’t stay healthy because he is supremely lazy, Benoit Benjamin lazy even, beyond relief. The organization has so much money invested in Speed and it’s all an elaborate cover-up to keep teams from knowing the truth.
Why don’t the Kings just trade Kevin Martin for Eddy Curry already. At least Curry is tough and can score down low.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
If we're not building around him
Then who are we building around?
Trade him. While he has value.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
Ok
Let’s trade JT and Hawes too because we are not building around them and they have value.
Any more smart suggestions?
The future begins now...
Yup
Get a new GM.
Trade KMART. HE is injury prone! he plays wildly by default (as in throws the body around), which in-turn brings a lot of beatings on the body. He will continue to play this way, it’s his style, and he will continue to get injured.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
No of course not
That would require knowing what you’re talking about.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Yea, lets a get a new GM
because its Petrie’s fault players are getting injured. It’s Petrie’s fault that he selected a player at #26 in the draft who isn’t a superstar, a player who has weaknesses. Small market teams need to draft well, and Petrie sure doesn’t doesn’t know how to draft. So who would you like the kings to replace him with as GM?
It was a response to Sammy
Click ‘up’ and you’ll see who you’re replying to. Takes a bit to get used to that feature.
The future begins now...
I know 4life
It’s okay. I’m not stupid enough to think Kevin Martin is a failure given where he was picked in the first place. Most picks are out of the league within 3 or 4 years.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Agreed
29 and 11 with a broken wrist – where’s the freakin’ leadership? (Note sarcasm)
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
He should have had 30 :)
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 6, 2009 8:48 PM PST up reply actions
Or 31.....
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Just 40?
He shoulda gone for 90.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I keep forgetting
Sorry.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
hmmmm
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 6, 2009 9:57 AM PST up reply actions
You're nicer than I G
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I dunno, I didn't major in sacasmology
But seriously, why trade Kevin Martin? It’s not like you’re going to get Chris Paul or Danny Granger. And, as a team, you don’t want to pick up an old vet, whether it be a Chris Kaman-type (consistent, above average, but still meh) or Carlos Show-Me-The-Monaaaaaay Boozer.
Let him heal, work on the team dynamics, then hope that we have another great draft next year. I promise I will try my best to not talk about the draft at least until March.
The idea does have merit
Ignore the ignorance about “potential” because I think that most people recognize that KMart is already an all-star calliber player. If he was on a competitive team and/or in a major market, I have no doubt he would be a perrenial all-star.
Don’t NBA players’ performance typically peak at about 29? If so, Kevin will be on the decline just as we are starting to be competitive as a team. As much as I would hate to see him go, I would love to see what he could do on a better team. I am not saying that he should be given away, but if we could get a younger KMart for him, we might both be better off.
I would still root for him just as I did for Mitch after he was traded for CWebb.
K9 should not be a throw in for any trade. That expiring contract is just as valuable for us, if not more so, than any other team. I say keep K9 unless we can get a quality young player or an early draft pick.
I'm 110% in favor now that I've slept on it
that K-Mart should sit here. The team has other options, and could benefit from Kevin being out (in the sense that they recognize how to make fitting him into the lineup easier when he returns).
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
And perhaps see if Evans works better as a two.
Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.
Or just get him comfortable
It’s going to take time to get him & Martin working together well as a tandem. They have games that mesh well, but each need to make adjustments (and some sacrifices) to make it work.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I hope you weren't pointing at your lap as you said
K-Mart should sit here
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 6, 2009 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
In the world of disposable razors, phones and marriages.....
Kevin Martin is a disposable hero. Now I love the guy but if I’m him, I play. I play until the thing falls off because this is my year. This is the year that I make an all-star team. This is the year I could win a scoring title. This is the year…maybe the last year, that I am the #1 option for the Sacramento Kings. If I am Kevin Martin, I fight for respectability by proving that I am tough enough to play with a broken bone- shit, I can beat you bitches with one hand behind my back, because I am that good.
Go ahead and tell me the risks involved and all that stuff but at the end of the day, Kevin Martin has the backing of the Kings medical staff to play if he wants to run the risk. After this season, Evans will be better, Thompson will be better, Hawes and Casspi will be better and Martin will become a valuable piece to a pretty well rounded team. Martin aspires to be great. We have seen it throughout his career and in the off-season every year. You can’t be great missing another 1/3 of a season but you can open a door to Tyreke Evans proving that he is really a 2 guard.
Go ahead and torch me guys but this is where I’m at if my name is Kevin Martin.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
by jjham15 on Nov 6, 2009 9:50 AM PST reply actions 3 recs
I don't think you should be flamed for this
its a great argument on the other side. It really is up to the doctors and Kevin. We don’t know what it feels like, what the chances are for a worse injury, etc.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
I agree...I was thinking this myself. If you can play on it w/ a soft cast, I prolly given all the points you brought up
I also was of the frame of mind that if it actually fully breaks, won’t that just be a 12-week absence. if you’re gonna be looking at 6-8 weeks, might as well say F it and go for broke (assuming he can still play well w/ the soft cast on).
Then again, his steals are up and his focus on D was pretty good so far. If he has a sore wrist, my guess is that swiping at balls and playing tough D goes out the window.
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
by PhutureKings on Nov 6, 2009 12:59 PM PST up reply actions
It would be legendary I guess
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Nov 6, 2009 10:09 AM PST up reply actions
you're a brave man, jjham15
I agree with you 100%. You only get so many games in your prime as an NBA player. If you are injury-prone (which Kev clearly is) then you need to seize opportunities to play through injuries. Because if you miss 25 games every season, you are really hurting your team and your own brief time in the sun. This is an opportunity to play through it. Tape it, put a brace on it, and play with heart and have a great stretch of games over the next 8 weeks.
Kev is going to get hurt again, and again, and again. He needs to accept that reality and figure out how best to succeed despite it.
Life is every mammal's journey from very very wet to very very dry.
Just like Kobe Bryant right?
Because All-Stars miss no games whatsoever.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
To prove my point
Look at the first stint of Phil Jackson when Kobe was with the Lakers. (99-00) Kobe played in about 88% of the games, and was often criticized for missing games.
I understand your point JJ, and I don’t have a problem with your reasoning. It’s just that I don’t really see what’s to be gained other than a few people who want to see Martin fail and then say " I told you so."
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Kevin Martin is not Kobe Bryant
I’m not saying Kevin shouldn’t miss these games, (that’s up to Kevin and I will support him either way) but he will not make the all star game if he does. And JJ is right in saying he is running out of years to do so. That being said, I don’t know if the all star game is his number one priority right now.
Kobe had already made 8 All-Star teams by the time he was 27- Martin's age now.
Martin has made it zero. Carpe diem dude. Martin isn’t going to make an all-star team this year if he misses 80% of the games before it and my point was that this is the year that he should break through and make it. Next year becomes exponentially harder due to the players around him improving causing a reduction in his numbers. It’s easier to become a two time all-star than it is to make your first.
If Martin can the all-star team this year, a reduction in production while his team improves won’t be held against him next year, where a reduction in numbers from one year to the next will probably have a more dramatic effect on a Martin’s chances if he has yet to make an all-star team.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
I understand that
You missed my point though.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Is it just about being an All Star?
Because that doesn’t really mean anything. I know you’re better than that JJ that’s why I ask. It shouldn’t be about recognition (All Star, scoring title), it should be about what’s best for the long term future of Kevin and the long term future of this franchise
The future begins now...
For Martin, it is about recognition for all the work he has put in.
Besides Martin, it would be nice for the Kings, the fans and his teammates to have a player representing them at an NBA show case event. Martin doesn’t work his ass off all year long so he can be a marginal player. He works to be great and an all-star bid means validation and that at least for that season, you are considered on of the greatest 24 players in the league.
Not that I think Martin will be a HOFer or anything but a player should strive for greatness. To obtain greatness, you have to play to your potential and gain acclaim. To gain acclaim, you have to make the playoffs, all-star teams and Olympic teams.
Long term viability of the Sacramento Kings rests in the hands of both the players and the people who make basketball decisions. At the end of the day, Martin will hang his hat on accomplishments gained throughout his career, not wins and losses because unfortunately for Kevin Martin, no matter how hard he has worked to improve, the Kings as a franchise has let him down by not providing the necessary support for his team to be great to this point in his career.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Ed
I see JJ’s point. He’s saying that it’s much easier to market Speed as an All-Star than a guy who is under-recognized in terms of recognition.
Hell, Deron Williams hasn’t ever made an All-Star team. If that doesn’t show how fickle the whole idea of an All-Star is, I don’t know what will.
On the other hand, there are fans who will likely forgive every shortcoming if K-Mart is an All-Star. So, there is a selling point to having a player like that who appeals to the masses.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I think Kevin wants to make the playoffs more than he wants to be an All Star
In that context sitting it out and letting it heal makes more sense.
by hozr on Nov 6, 2009 5:36 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Ding ding ding
We have a winner.
Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.
Kind of a selfish argument
Who really gives a shit if he makes the All-Star team this year or ever frankly? This is a team game. If the Kings become a good team and Kevin never makes the All-Star team, I am sure that’s a tradeoff he will take.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 6, 2009 2:40 PM PST up reply actions
Remember back when Grant Hill was a star?
In 1999 he was 27, just like Martin is now. He was putting up numbers similar to what only Lebron does now: 26, 6, & 6. Problem was, like Kevin, he was branded with the soft label too.
Grant seriously injured his ankle late that season —and followed your line of thinking. He knew he didn’t want to be labled soft; he was ‘the guy’ for his team. And now was his window. Completely shredded the thing in the second game of the playoffs.
Four seasons and five surgeries later, he finally played at least half-a-season.
by unfair weather on Nov 6, 2009 12:13 PM PST up reply actions
I'd feel differently if this was an ankle injury
Because you can do some serious damage by playing on it – to your ankle and also to your knee. I don’t think the risk is as great here of doing serious damage if he wears some sort of protective brace.
Now, I could be completely wrong on that. But that is an assumption I’m making.
Life is every mammal's journey from very very wet to very very dry.
And that's exactly it.
None of us have anything but assumptions.
But the point remains shedding a “soft” image or playing for the next game is the worst possible criteria to base this decision on.
“What would Hondo do?” is a horrible way to make medical decisions.The best way is to pay attention to the warnings and advice of the medical staff.
The reward factor is essentially nil at this point, so only the risk factors should be considerd. Kevin isn’t Kerri Strug going for his one lifetime shot at the gold. He is a guy under contract for nearly 4 more years and ~$50 mil on a young team that will be struggling for 25 wins with it’s best days in the future.
by unfair weather on Nov 6, 2009 12:54 PM PST up reply actions
It is his left hand (non-shooting hand).
Thus, I would speculate that it is nowhere near as career-threatening as an ankle or knee (or shooting hand) injury.
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
Hill had also made a handfull of All-Star games at that point.
This is about breaking through IMO. If Martin doesn’t do it now, he will end up as one of those “really good players who never made an All-Star team guys”.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Kevin's legacy
I think you make some excellent points. Makes Kevin’s decision that much harder. Very disappointing situation.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 6, 2009 12:53 PM PST up reply actions
Legacy-schmegacy...
Kevin’s a good player on a bad King’s team. Hopefully someday he’ll be a good player on a good King’s team.
Shareef Abdur Rahim was an All-Star, but that isn’t his legacy
by unfair weather on Nov 6, 2009 1:01 PM PST up reply actions
Given that he didn't win a championship and won't be making the NBA HoF (most likely)
It kind of is his legacy. What else does he got?
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
And that's exactly it...
Shareef’s legacy is that of being a decent player on some really crappy teams. Kevin can earn that this season.
But if it in any way impacts his chances at the big prize in the future, his goal was pretty short sighted.
by unfair weather on Nov 6, 2009 1:10 PM PST up reply actions
Chauncey Billups made an All-Star game when he was 29
And Detroit had been a quality team for years. I don’t think All-Star games exactly measure quality of players.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Yup. Let’s not blow it out of proportion.
It’s a friggin exhibition game.
by unfair weather on Nov 6, 2009 1:10 PM PST up reply actions
Dismiss it if you want
but if I were in Kevin’s shoes, I’m pretty sure I’d be thinking about my career in its entirety. My overall career goals, how I’m perceived as a player, how I’ll be remembered, etc. I’d weigh the risks. I know I’d be very frustrated about the last two seasons and really want to play. I’d consider all these angles.
It’s a tough decision and JJ brought up some interesting points. I don’t necessary care about the all-star thing. That’s kind of out of Kevin’s control, but having the type of career he wants to have, and factoring these goals into his decision is very reasonable.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 6, 2009 1:25 PM PST up reply actions
Nash was a late all-state also.
And I hope that this window will still be open for Martin later but this is his best opportunity to establish himself as a top tier player.
If this injury had happened the day after the all-star game and the Kings were 8-10 games under .500 then I would be singing a different tune. But in my opinion, this injury marks the end of the Kings season. I also believe that this injury can have a snow ball effect that will resonate through out the franchise for possible years to come.
The Kings were not going to make the playoffs. The Kings were not going to be good but if the last few games have showed us anything, the Kings are going to give most teams a fight and play it close on most nights. Without Martin, the Kings are going to be BAD. Not fun to watch. Not fun to talk about. Shitty.
By the time Martin gets back (assuming he misses the estimated 29 games), the Kings might have 5-6 wins- 5-29 or 6-28. With Martin, the Kings might be able to increase those win totals by 7-9 wins, setting them up for a bad season but one filled with near misses like we have already seen. Without Martin I see at least 20 games of the 29 where the Kings don’t even really compete. With a dwindling fan, this is the last thing we want for the Kings.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Saying Kevin Martin is good for 9 wins over 29 games.
Means that his presence alone is good for nearly 30 more wins for the team over the course of the season than his back up. Dubious.
by unfair weather on Nov 6, 2009 1:39 PM PST up reply actions
Ok, couple of things.
The Kings signed a career 6.0 point a game 2-3 to be the primary back-up at the 2. I’m in the pro Udoka camp but he just became the only shooting guard on the roster so yes, Martin is up to 9 games better than replacement.
More than that, Martin is playing in the backcourt with a rookie, 5 games into his career who is shooting .355 from the field and .111 from three but continues to shoot over 12 shots per game. If Evans found driving to the hoop hard before, just wait until Martin isn’t next to him to stretch the D.
This team is built around Martin right now. Without him or his back-up Francisco Garcia, the Kings are in for a long 6-8 weeks.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Ok, pretend without Martin, we're really bad.
Historically so. We’re good for say, 15 games, 6th worst of all time.
That means that a healthy Martin this season makes us a .500 team, a playoff contender. Not many people are calling us that.
by unfair weather on Nov 6, 2009 2:34 PM PST up reply actions
Without Martin this is a 10-15 win team.
I did say a 7-9 game (20-25 over a 82 game stretch) increase which may be a little high. This team could have won 30-35 games if things clicked with the new line-up and rotation. Martin will be back so I hope we won’t have to see if this team is historically bad but you never know.
No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.
-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)
Don't underestimate
the impact of winning a lot more early in the season on All-Star selection though.
Presume this year we win 20 games. If next year, we’re say 18-22 through our first 40 games, Kevin is killing everyone for 24ppg on ridiculous efficiency (probably manageable even on a better team where he gets fewer shots), its likely he’d get a lot of consideration for All-Star reserve based on being given some credit for team improvement.
I think in that scenario he has at least as good a chance to be an All-Star as this season if he’s average 30ppg but we’re terrible.
Professional Hyperbole Slayer
I think this is a better angle to take
But in my opinion, this injury marks the end of the Kings season. I also believe that this injury can have a snow ball effect that will resonate through out the franchise for possible years to come.
And it is definitely something to worry about. The clock is ticking, and time is running out on Sacramento as an NBA franchise. You all saw the pathetic crowd against the Hawks.
Despite all this, I remain hopeful the Kings can still be competitive this season, even without Kmart. It’s asking a lot of Omri Casspi, but I am hoping he really surprises us. Tyreke also has a huge opportunity here. The rest of the starters can compete.
Let’s support the team and help them get over the hump or watch them play in the Honda Center pretty soon.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 6, 2009 2:47 PM PST up reply actions
Not time to give up
Without Martin, the Kings are going to be BAD. Not fun to watch. Not fun to talk about. Shitty.
I’m not buying this at all. It certainly appears to be the likely result of a 17-win team losing its best player, but I like what I see out of this Kings team and I think they will remain competitive and fun to watch, even without Kmart.
"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."
by coolcatreportdotcom on Nov 6, 2009 2:50 PM PST up reply actions
How many injuries does it take to be labeled "injury prone"?
Has Kevin Martin already surpassed this line?
He needs to get the surgery.
If you were a NBA GM would you ever take a big chance on Kevin. It will be very interesting to see what his next contract looks like . . .
Ba-da
Ba-da bing.
Injury Prone. You nailed it.
The kings would give him a max contract even if he broke his leg.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
What the hell are you talking about?
He’s under contract for 3 years after this one, at far less than the max.
Spouting unsubstantiated hate is pointless.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 6, 2009 4:54 PM PST up reply actions
No shit
I’m just saying the kings are fond of signing people to absurd contracts.
Don't hate, I'm a realist!
No shit?
Just responding to what you posted, but I see now you were going for a double hate post, GP and Kevin. Very efficient. You are the Kevin Martin of senseless hate efficiency.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Nov 6, 2009 5:25 PM PST up reply actions
He'll be fine
“Hey, did you go to Hollywood Upstairs Medical College too?”
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.
by andy sims on Nov 6, 2009 10:00 AM PST reply actions 2 recs
Get it fixed, Kevin, We'll see you a few months.
Damn, just when I thought I was getting my League Pass money’s worth.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
You still might
Especially with a team as gifted as this one. :)
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I was just thinking
Martin, the last few years, has been close to leading the league in Free Throw Attempts per game …. meaning he gets a lot of contact ….
yet people call him injury prone …. could it be cause he gets beat up a lot?
Of course
If a guy is throwing his body into others who weigh more than him, he is on the losing end of that exchange. K-Mart is good at absorbing contact and also knowing how to fall to the ground. There is a skill to falling. Ask a stunt man.
But yeah all that physicality takes it toll. Ironic though the injury occurred against AI, one of the few players in the league slighter in stature than K-Mart.
Yeah.
that game against MEM was a joke. People were bull dozing the dude and no foul call. Straight-up clobbering our man and no respect from the refs…against the Grizz!
I don’t think Martin’s soft. But, like I said earlier, maybe injury-prone. I think if he can play effectively in a soft cast, he should. One of two things will happen – it’ll heal in about 8-plus weeks (right?) or he’ll break it, meaning he would miss 12 weeks. I think it’s worth the risk.
But, I’ll support him either way.
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
this blows
are we ever gonna see the kings with martin for a whole season and see what he can do? he was playing out of his mind also.
After sleeping on it
He needs to just let it heal. Yeah it will suck to not have him but it is what it is right now. No need to risk anything worse.
He needs to get that wrist repaired.....
Sammyp831 i wish i could reach through my computer and slap the SH!tT out your mouth for making dumb a$# comments like that! Go Kings we will be counting the days Kevin until you return, but i think some good will come out of this!
Miguel Cotto will defeat Pacquiao on November 14, 2009! For PUERTO RICO baby..
I want to see him play, but he shouldn't
This is not the playoffs. This is November. Even with K-Mart at full health, Kings are still underdogs in almost every game. Its disappointing because K-Mart could win scoring title this year, make the All-Star team, reverse injury trend from last year. But risking a complete break is not worth the potential reward. His last consideration should be his reputation. He score 30 points two nights ago with a broken wrist, If that doesn’t silence critics, not a lot will.
Baptism by Fire
It’s never ideal when the team’s best player gets hurt. But I think the silver lining is that Tyreke will be able to go through a baptism by fire and the team will be stronger in January than if Kevin had stayed healthy.
by OriginalBallboy on Nov 6, 2009 11:40 AM PST reply actions
I hope he plays
but I’m totally okay with it if he decides to get surgery. I feel bad for him. This has to be very frustrating. Do whatever you feel is best Kevin.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
My outlook
At our current win rate we would pick up 6 wins over those 30 games, at a 27 win per season rate we would win 9. Without him we probably win 3. So we are talking 3-6 wins. In other words a 10-25 record at best…a 4-31 record at worse.
If there is any risk to Kevin to make the injury worse, he has to shut it down.
Kevin Martin
Is a grown man. He knows his body best and he has the best doctors money can buy. We have to assume that he will make the right decision.
Kings rule! (They are royalty - right?)
The man went for 29 and 11 with that wrist the other night,
and yet that is not enough to wipe away the “soft” label for some. And that’s a crime.
Unfortunate? Absolutely. Soft? Get real.
Now, if there is a deal out there that involves Kevin Martin that will make this team better over the next couple of years, make the deal. But my bet is that 29 NBA GM’s have currently devalued Martin due to the fact that he has a broken wrist (yes, this news does travel to other NBA cities). Let’s put this another way – were you more or less excited about the prospect of obtaining Amare Stoudemire after he injured his eye? Certainly Amare had less value after the injury. He is currently re-establishing that value.
In closing, Kevin Martin does not have to play to prove his toughness to me, any more than B-Jax or Peja or C-Webb had to prove it to me. I know that these guys make millions, but injuries are injuries. I hurt getting out of bed in the morning, the result of 30 years of recreational baseball and softball. I can’t fathom what these guys go through physically, nor do I.
For emphasis – Kevin Martin has a broken bone in his wrist. This is an injury that will almost certainly require surgery at some point, and not fixing the problem immediately carries at least some level of risk. I don’t look forward to attending games and seeing Martin in street clothes, but what sane individual would insist that he has to play to prove his machismo?
Your call, Kevin. I support your decision, whatever it is.
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
by section214 on Nov 6, 2009 12:50 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
He may not be soft
But I do wonder if he is too injury prone.
Kings rule! (They are royalty - right?)
Wow
Its really easy to be good with other peoples pain
The Kings are not a good team and will be worse with an unhealthy Kevin Martin. If he plays is so he can make a push for an all star berth, which he won’t win as the 4th Laker Rep will need to be represented
How did he do last year playing through injuries, 17 games, did that really help?
Honestly, we're not a playoff team
so, whatever Kev decides is cool by me. If he wants some good publicity, then by all means play. If not, then don’t. worst case scenario we get more ping pong balls. I’d like him to play, cuz this year (unlike last year when I wanted losses for a better lottery pick…yeah, I admit it!) I wanted to see the growth of the team and more entertaining games.
So, IF Martin doesn’t play, what do you all think the lineup should look like? I’m going with this 8-to-11 man rotation (depending on matchups):
Beno
Evans
Casspi
JT
Hawes
Bench:
Serg
Noc/Udoka
Brockman/May/Thomas
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
Not stating anything new here, but...
GODDAMN that list makes me wonder when & where the F we’re gonna get another decent big man!?!
"We ain't in the takin' prisoners business. We in the killin' Nazi's business...and Cousin, business is a-boomin'."
Kevin gets hurt all the time
he will play approximately 50 games next season no matter what he decided.
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