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Maloof Money

By all accounts, the Monarch weren’t making the Maloofs money but the team wasn’t losing much either.  In November, the Maloofs abruptly folded the Monarchs claming they needed more time to focus on the Kings.  A few weeks later, the Maloofs decided to sell their family beer distributorship – which was a reliable profit center for decades.  Once again, the family insisted the move was solely about focusing their energy on Sacramento and Las Vegas.  Looking at the facts below, while the Maloofs overall wealth remains substantial, it appears they might be experiencing cash flow issues.  This shouldn’t come as a huge surprise as both the Kings and Palms require huge operating costs and rely on discretionary income during an economic crisis.

 

In 2002, the Maloofs opened up their books to the Sacramento Bee.  (Footnote (FN) 1.)  The family’s assets were estimated at approximately one billion dollars with four main components:  the Kings, the Palms, the New Mexico Beer Distributorship, and Wells Fargo stock.  (FN1.)  Seven years later, the values of the Palms and stock have fallen sharply.  Some fans focus on the Kings losses, but those figures are merely a fraction of the losses the Maloofs have suffered recently.

 

Now, the family is selling the business that was both the cornerstone and backbone of their empire for many years.  Therefore, it appears that sale – and to a much lesser degree the closing of the Monarchs – have more to do with freeing up cash than prioritizing their businesses.

 

A.  Background

 

The family has been in the beer business forever.  Based upon the need to move beer from Colorado to New Mexico, the family also operated a successful trucking business.  George Maloof bought the Rockets in 1979.  After his death, the family sold the team in 1982.  (FN1)  In 1994, the family built the Fiesta Casino in Las Vegas for $30 million dollars.  After successfully managing the small casino, they sold it for $170 million in 2000.  (Id.)

 

B.  Wells Fargo & Co. Stock

 

1976, the Maloofs paid $10 million for a 77 percent stake in First National Bank in Albuquerque.  (FN1.)  In 1994, the bank merged with Salt Lake City-based First Security Corp. in a $200 million stock swap.  In 2000, Wells Fargo & Co. acquires First Security in a stock swap, with the Maloofs receiving nearly 4.87 million shares of Wells Fargo stock.  (Id.

 

In 2002, when the price was trading at almost $50 a share, their Wells Fargo stock was worth $248 million.  (Id.)  Friday, the stock was trading just above $25.  However, that price is up significantly from its low of $7.80 in March 2009. 

 

C.  Beer Distributorship

 

As a preliminary matter, beer distributorships are profitable, extremely hard to get, and almost recession proof.  You get the exclusive right to sell a product with a decent margin.

 

The family the family obtained a Coors distributor ship in 1937, with the exclusive right to supply the state of New Mexico.  In 2002, the company was valued at 45 million dollars.  (FN1.)  The next year, the company expanded.  In 2003, the Maloofs bought the third largest distributorship in the state and merged the companies.  At which point, the supplied 42 percent of the states’ beer, with exclusive rights to all Coors, Miller, Corona, and Heineken sales as well as 40 other products.  (FN2.)

 

Since the expansion, the business has remained profitable.  In May 2009, George Maloof, Jr. described 2008 as a "huge successes" for the distributorship.   (FN3.)     Michael Bellas, chief executive of the New York consulting firm Beverage Marketing Corp recently estimated the annual revenue is "likely well more than $100 million."   (FN4.) 

 

D.  Palms

 

The Palms opened in 2001.  In 2005, the Maloofs opened the "fantasy tower" at a cost of approximately $600 million.  In 2008, the Maloofs opened a third tower called Palms Place, which includes a hotel, spa, and 600 condo units.

Station Casino Inc. owns 6.7 of the Palms.  Station is currently in Chapter 11 bankruptcy.  The Maloofs aren’t providing any specifics about the value of their casino, but Station’s filings with the SEC indicate the value of the Palms continues to fall sharply.  (FN3.)  In March of 2009, Station filed papers with the SEC that claimed their share of the Palms fell from 25.9 million in January 2008 to 3.3 million.  (Id.)

 

Station’s filings also address the overall value of the Palms.  It was reported that in early 2008, the casino had a value of $386 million.  In March 2009, Station reported the value was only $50 million and cash flow had fallen 19% from the previous year.  (Id.)  On September 30, 2009, Station indicated the value of the Palms was $20 million. (FN4.)

 

Here are a couple of things to consider.   Because they are in a bankruptcy proceeding, Station has an incentive to emphasize liabilities and minimize assets whenever possible.  At the same time, perjury - particularly to the SEC - has significant consequences and a $366 million loss isn’t exactly "fudging" a number on a balance sheet.  Moreover, no one disputes that most Las Vegas casinos are in serious economic trouble.  MGM Mirage, which owns 10 casinos, the most on the Strip, posted a $750.4 million net loss. And Harrah's Entertainment Inc., which owns eight casinos in Las Vegas, had more than a $1 billion net loss.  (FN5.)

 

While the Palms remains world renowned and a popular tourist destination, like the Fiesta, it is located off the Strip in order to attract to local customers.  Because Las Vegas is among the cities hit the hardest by the collapse of the United States housing market that money has dried up significantly.

 

Because reports indicate a combined $900 million was spent on the Palms this decade, it is hard to comprehend the value could be only $20 million.  However, the fact accountants can even make that claim, under the threat of SEC fines and jail time, is staggering.  We know that Station is reporting their share of the Palms has fallen 87% over the last two years.  (FN3.)  If you apply that figure to 900 million, the value of the Palms would be 108 million.  While that’s significantly higher than 20, it would still reflect a three quarter of a billion dollar loss.  When you consider at least some of the $600 million investment was borrowed, it’s entirely possible the Palms is worth only $20 million.

 

Other than vaguely claiming the casino is "holding its own" the Maloofs aren’t talking about the status of the new family flagship.  Kings fans pouring over the Forbes franchise values, but these are the numbers that are truly frightening for the Maloof family. 

             

E.  Kings

 

In 2008, it was reported that the Kings were on track to lose between $25 and $28 million dollars last season.  After making several trades in early 2009, the team trimmed the loss to $2.8 million but the overall value of the franchise fell 13%.  (FN6.)  The Maloofs still have lot of equity in the Kings – which is where a significant portion of the profits in professions sports are derived.

 

In the off season, the team trimmed overhead significantly, with employees and pre and post game shows falling by the wayside.  With the salary of Kings’ players exceeding $55 million, everyone recognizes that running an NBA team requires massive operating costs.  But many fans fail to recognize the overhead associated with day-to-day operations like the Kings telecasts.  Unlike some other teams, Comcast doesn’t pay team for the right to broadcast games.  Instead, the Kings buy airtime from Comcast, produce the telecasts, and sell ads during the broadcast.  Therefore, like ticket sales, the Kings television revenue is based upon a model where the Kings spend large sums of money before the season and try to make it back during the season based upon fan support.  The structure of the deal causes one to question the amount of revenue derived from the numerous ads for concerts and events at ARCO Arena.

 

However, it is unclear whether the overhead that was trimmed last summer will be enough to avoid further losses this season.  While the Kings continue to report crowds above 10,000 fans, paid attendance has fallen to 7,606 fans a game, down 21.1 percent from this time last year.   (FN 7.) 

 

Finally, it should be noted that some of the team’s best years and their recent failures at the box office were caused by the same event – the fracturing of the season ticket base.  In the 90s, most of the season tickets were held by either one person or a pair of partners that had owned the tickets for many years.  In 2002, the Kings captured the hearts and minds of Sacramento during a time when the housing market and interest rates led many to believe they were wealthy and massive debt was not a problem.  Ticket prices rose sharply.  Many fans compensated by taking on additional partners and selling tickets on a thriving secondary market.  But when the demand fell off, those options were no longer available and many long time customers reluctantly left the season ticket rolls along with the bandwagon fans.  Consequently, the season ticket base is now at an all time low.  The Maloofs could not have collected huge ticket revenues earlier this decade without fracturing the season ticket base, but for the first time ever the franchise relies primarily upon walk up tickets to fill most of the arena.  Which leads to things like 10,000 people showing up to watch the Pacers.   

             

F.  Conclusion. 

 

When you step back, an overall picture starts to emerge.  For many years, the Maloofs were family that built its fortune on key local businesses – the beer distributorship, banking, a small local hotel and stores in New Mexico.  When the sale of distributorship is completed, all of those businesses will be gone.

 

In 1994, the Maloofs parlayed their banking success into the Fiesta, which was also a smashing success.  In 2000, the Well Fargo transaction dwarfs all prior achievements.  Around that time, the Maloof family lays out a ton of money to become the primary share holder in two businesses with large operating costs.  (They spent 247 million on the Kings; the Palms cost 265 million to open as was expanded to the tune of 600 million.)

 

Right now it looks like it could have been too much at the wrong time.  You can justify both moves.  After running the small Fiesta, the family wanted to try their hand with a large casino.  The Maloofs also wanted to get back into professional sports and there was at least some reason to believe the Kings could become profitable.  Although the Kings were chronically mismanaged prior the Maloofs talking over, the team generally didn’t have problems selling tickets – even during down years.  When the team became wildly successful during the Maloofs tenure, the history of the NBA (although not California) suggested the public might finance most of a new arena –which would provide the franchise with both new revenues and a drawing card for several seasons.  Then, Webber’s knee popped, the city didn’t make a deal, and the voters said no. 

 

At the same time, Wells Fargo went into the tank and Las Vegas started to experience its leanest years.  Soon, the Maloofs will have most of their assets invested in two businesses with uncertain futures.  Both rely upon discretionary income during a period of time when the country is in an economic crisis.  Based upon the facts above, it appears the assumptions of some fans that the Kings are awash in red ink are overstated, or at the very least premature.  But at the same time, the condition of the Palms and the overall holding of the Maloofs are underreported. 

 

The Maloofs have claimed the sale of the distributorship is about "prioritizing their businesses" and "a good deal" but they don’t spend much time in the 47th state and by all accounts the distributorship was the most consistent business over the years and recently the most profitable.  Therefore, it appears the former backbone of the family’s fortune will be liquidated to provide operating capital for the other businesses – particularly the Palms.

 

 

1.      (Bee story.  April 14, 2002; Bee: Maloofs losing money now but they're investing for the long haul; http://www.kingsfans.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-16321.html)

2.      http://sacramento.bizjournals.com/sacramento/stories/2003/07/14/daily8.html

3.      http://www.sacbee.com/business/story/1883492.html

4.      http://www.sacbee.com/topstories/story/2378296.html

5.      http://www.thesunnews.com/business/story/1199248.html

6.      http://www.forbes.com/lists/2009/32/basketball-values-09_Sacramento-Kings_327146.html

7.      http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/18850386?source=rss_blogs_NBA

(This is a FanPost from a member of the Sactown Royalty community. The views expressed come from the member, and not Sactown Royalty staff.)

20 recs  |  Comment 61 comments

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Some serious reporting here

It certainly paints a bleak picture.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Dec 14, 2009 1:02 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

One thing I don't understand
Station’s filings also address the overall value of the Palms. It was reported that in early 2008, the casino had a value of $386 million. In March 2009, Station reported the value was only $50 million and cash flow had fallen 19% from the previous year. (Id.) On September 30, 2009, Station indicated the value of the Palms was $20 million. (FN4.)

The cost of the 2nd tower was $600 million, presumably the other two cost at least that much again (and likely far more), and hell, even that pool they built a few years back cost $40 million.

I understand that things depreciate, and the market dictates what a thing is worth in the real world, but you just don’t take property and assets in Vegas that cost over a billion dollars a few years ago, and find them worth only $20 mil. You could knock all of that shit down with a wrecking ball, and sell the scrap for more than $20 million.

Also, it’s still a casino. People come in, drop their money on the floor, then they go home after a few days. There may be fewer customers, but money is made on 99.9% of the ones who step inside.

From the footnoted Bee article:

A source familiar with the Palms’ finances said its cash flow – a measure of profit before certain expenses are deducted – fell 19 percent last year, to $51 million. The source declined to be named. Maloof wouldn’t discuss the Palms’ finances, other than to say it is profitable.

Even assuming that somehow 90% of that $51 million profit figure evaporates after “certain expenses are deducted,” well, that’s a clean $5 million profit. I know nothing about what cash flow means in this context, but I doubt 90% of it is floating away.

The other thing I couldn’t find (and it’s early) was that valuation of the Palms at only $20 mil. I saw this:

Station Casinos Inc. of Las Vegas, said its stake in the Maloofs’ Palms Casino Resort has dropped 87 percent since January 2008. Based on Station’s declaration, filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission, the value of the Palms fell to an estimated $50 million March 31, from $386 million 15 months earlier.

For the same reasons I cited before, the holdings in Vegas are worth a hell of a lot more than $50 mil, even as scrap.

The other issue you have, is that if the value of the Maloofs’ holdings is down, so what? You’re underwater on your house? Who cares?

Unless you’re trying to sell it.

If the family has no intention of selling the casino property, a dip in value (even as extreme as the Bee story claims) is meaningless. They’d be idiots to sell a casino. They are not idiots. This family is in the casino business, own a nice hunk of Wells Fargo, and they also have a basketball team.

We should all be doing so badly.

Pretty interesting read, LD. Preeeeeeetyyyyyyyy preeeeeeeeetyyyyyyy interesting.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.

by andy sims on Dec 14, 2009 7:03 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

A couple of thoughts

First, the Maloofs probably “own” the Palms the same way most of us own our houses. I seriously doubt they pulled $600m out of their pocket. If they barrowed when the value (and income) of the hotel was high, they could very well be under water now. I could easily see $50m a year disapppearing in opperating expenses and P&I on the loan. In fact, why would they sell the family business—that is constantly in the black—unless they needed cash to weather the storm with their casino? If it was even breaking even, why sell a cash cow?

Secondly, as LD pointed out they no longer have a source of consistant income. If their money is now in equity, what does that mean for the Kings? If the casino buisness takes longer to recover and they need more cash, their only equity source is the Kings. However, I’d love to know how much they sold a $100m a year business for. Assuming a 3-5x EBITDA, the business was worth around $400m. Hopefully that is enough to last out.

We should all be doing so badly.

That’s what people said about a lot of big companies that are gone. When you stand to make a lot, you also stand to lose a lot. I’d love to have a company bringing in a $100m a year. I’d hate to be so badly off that I had to sell that company.

Finally, who the heck is Larry David? This is an amazing amount of research for one person to do on a whim. And before this he wasn’t even a STR member. Not saying there is any ulterior motive here or anything but if his sig was just another real dude, I’d have to wonder. Nonetheless, great, great info. recd.

"Shut up and Coach!"
Vfettke

by SavageBeast on Dec 14, 2009 8:41 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

curb your enthusiasm

clever, and rec’d.

Someone who has an insight into the financial picture has taken the time to help us StR threadheads. After getting this information – all public – what do we know in the context of what we (collective we, meaning me ;) ) care about?

A company strapped for money due to speculative investing subjected to bad timing of shortsighted but decent decisions (let’s leave hindsight out of it). Will this team move? Move because they are financially obligated? Sell the team?

At this point – with the knowlege presented above, there are no answers. As for the Maloof business in general – sounds like they are doing what they need to do to survive. I expect that to continue – maybe with some more commercial flights and prudent penurious hirings, firings and trades but these guys appear to be willing to buckle down and swallow enough ego to sing along with Gloria Gaynor. Lean years ahead. Join the club, sorry it applies to billionaires and millionaires too. Here’s to living through it together.

by betweentheeyes on Dec 14, 2009 12:55 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Very intersting stuff here- both the article and comments.
Finally, who the heck is Larry David? This is an amazing amount of research for one person to do on a whim. And before this he wasn’t even a STR member. Not saying there is any ulterior motive here or anything but if his sig was just another real dude, I’d have to wonder.

This is a murky post, filled with intriguing research and statements about things that we as fans should know very little about. I am always leery of the “new poster with TMI” that occasionally pops up so I feel like I need to do some research on my own.

No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.

-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)

by jjham15 on Dec 14, 2009 1:03 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

What do you mean by
things that we as fans should know very little about.

?

Why is knowledge ever a bad thing?

"I hate all sports as rabidly as a person who likes sports hates common sense."
-H.L. Mencken

by thelettere on Dec 14, 2009 1:38 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

It's not a bad thing.

I’m not saying that knowing this information is wrong, I’m saying that typically this is information that we aren’t handed or privy to. I want to look at the sources and do a little research myself because these aren’t the type of things that as a common fan that come across my proverbial desk. Also, I am always slightly apprehensive about information that comes from a source that I am unfamiliar with, no matter how well it’s written. With google comes a paper trail, one that I would like to follow as part of my understanding of the information put forth.

Knowledge isn’t a bad thing, I’m a little tired of hearing about every skank Tiger Woods has ever slept with but I guess it’s knowledge someone, somewhere might need to know (like his wife).

No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.

-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)

by jjham15 on Dec 14, 2009 2:53 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You have a proverbial desk?

Lucky. Mine is mission style. Did you get it as an antique, or is it a replica?

StR Token Female

by LeaguePassAddict on Dec 14, 2009 4:45 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Interesting stuff

Attendance is all about season ticket holders. Attendance is built on thier backs. Its no suprise the numbers went way down with the combination of a team first treading water for a few years then obviously on a sharp downswing in talent, effort and excitement.

Those things are changing and I expect season tix to start to climb fairly sharply over the next season or two. The good news is that unlike in our last rebirth as a playoff team good tix will be available and affordable for the next couple of seasons to regular fans who want to catch a half dozen games. For those who can, I highly recommend planning ahead for the ‘partners’ idea that I participate in. My wife and I actually set aside a little money in a seperate account every month for next seasons tix and for other things we want to do, our ‘luxury’ account.
Of course we aren’t very interested in things like shiny new cars (the worst investment ever in my book) as a matter of philosophy.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 14, 2009 9:27 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

The young players are helping, but I don't think they're enough on their own.

The average ticket price is still in the top 1/3rd of the league. That may have been okay (even justified) when the Kings were competing for a title, but when you’re staring at a year (at the minimum) until the team is likely to make a playoff run, in a horrible economy, it’s not going to get it done. For now, I’m happy to poach good seats off of craigslist for face value (and often under) to a few games this season (or buy direct, almost every game is available).

by cabz on Dec 14, 2009 1:28 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ticket prices and such.

LTTG, you make some very good points and your discretionary fund for “luxury” items is a great idea. I think the product on the floor is only a small part of the overall issue with the Kings. The Maloofs, being business men, went after a business market because they knew that as the ticket prices climbed, the bottom line dollar amount of owning tickets would be lost in the world of tax write offs and bureaucratic under site. They priced out the common fan, banking on the economic stability of the wealthy and not the “Joe paint your face purple and black while ringing a cow bell”. Basically, they took the fans out of the stadium, including banning those proud cowbells because that was not the image they wanted to sell to a high end client.

In short, they are now reaping what they sowed and trying to respond with “$10 seats so our arena doesn’t look empty on ESPN” gimmicks and $1 beers nights. I made this comment a few days ago about the service that I received at the Hornets game and I will repeat it here: It takes years to earn a customer and seconds to lose one. The Maloofs spent years alienating the true fan base while chasing the tails of bigger fish (Tiger Woods esque) and now they have to rebuild from the floor up by earning the trust of mom and pop Kings fan. This isn’t going to happen if they continue to short change the customer with sub par staffing that provide a low quality of service in stadium that I have witnessed first hand.

I want to spend my money at Arco. I want to bring my boys to games but if I go and sit in 4- $140 seats and then pay for parking and hot dogs and Slamson plush toys and leave a $650+ carbon foot print for an evening out then I better get the service equal to that cost. Again, if I went to Morton’s and dropped this kind of money, it wouldn’t matter how good the steak was, if the service was shitty then I would walk away pissed.

No law when it comes to me.
I let you type critics write and I just keep it hood.
That will never change.
I am not kissing no ones ass because I'm in LA. Suck a cock.

-Ron Artest (e-mail exchange with Kyle Slavin)

by jjham15 on Dec 14, 2009 1:39 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Really incredible

Just wanted to thank LD for putting this together. Lots to chew on.

by Ziller on Dec 14, 2009 1:51 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I'm so confused by what I saw that I have nothing to say

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 14, 2009 4:32 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

That’s what she said.

StR Token Female

by LeaguePassAddict on Dec 14, 2009 4:46 PM PST up reply actions   2 recs

LOL

"When you look at him, you say: 'Holy God.'" - Pete Carril on Tyreke Evans

by otis29 on Dec 14, 2009 5:01 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ty LPA

I’m glad you approve of this message.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 14, 2009 5:19 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

REc'd and WRec'd for bringing us down...

Anyone wanna play Russian Roulette?

Perception is strong and sight weak. In strategy it is important to see distant things as if they were close and to take a distanced view of close things.

Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt — When catapults are outlawed, only outlaws will have catapults"

by SactownheartOChouse on Dec 14, 2009 4:52 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Can you review my finances next?

I need a lot of help.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Dec 14, 2009 5:40 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

Automatic rec for Princess Bride reference

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 14, 2009 7:18 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

So how come you don't rec everything LTTG posts?

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Dec 14, 2009 8:42 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Because he doesn't have an Antonio Banderas avatar.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 14, 2009 9:50 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Rec'd

And have fun storming the castle.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Dec 14, 2009 8:47 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Insanely good post

This is the type of reporting normally found in Newspapers or magazines. Beyond well done. Don’t forget, the Maloofs were also reported to be invested deeply in Madoff. The picture is bleak in deed.

Wait....Why is everybody clapping? Everyone around me is clapping.... I guess I should be clapping too... GO LAKERS!!! I hate living in So Cal

by 27freethrows on Dec 14, 2009 8:08 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Wow

I was expecting the rants and raves of a looney, but phenomenal job. Well done. Though, I have to ask this question: how entitled are we, as Kings fans, to information on the Maloofs? If their financial status is relevant, then is their personal life also relevant? At what point do we consider that we are being too inquiring – when we’re videotaping Gavin on the toilet?

GREENE! You’ve been superfluously apostrophe’d! - andy sims

by iashwash on Dec 14, 2009 11:13 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I heard a rumor

that he’s shitting gold bricks. It had to be done.

Bé foréwarnéd: I am a mémbér of StR Groupthink méntality.

by CAB on Dec 15, 2009 11:38 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

He's a shitty alchemist!

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 15, 2009 12:11 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Selling a Beer Distributorship is a bit of a flag

I bet they didn’t want to sell but was probably the only major asset in which they would have been paid it’s worth.

As for the worth of the casino, I’ve read a few legal books about selling and evaluating the worth of business. There are a couple different avenues to pin a “worth” estimate down with widely varying results. I’m sure Stations is using the least valuable worth calculation they found to pass off to the courts. It’s not illegal, but they are trying to hide from collectors and are going to force them to come with the numbers to say they have the money to pay.

by bignerd on Dec 14, 2009 11:23 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Why post this?

This information was shared for a reason. Larry David, why did you share this with us. What is your intent here. I know you have to be reading the comments and we are wondering what gives…

Because without further information it seems you are a person who wants to get the message out that the Maloofs are in trouble financially to effect a specific purpose.

I could guess at why, but would like to hear from the author. This is no casual post typical of this forum and it has us scratchin’ our heads a bit.

Don’t get me wrong. This post is extraordinary and deserves some recognition. I just want to know why?

by MustangMBS on Dec 15, 2009 1:09 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Agreed, this is fishy.

Joins and immediately posts and exhaustingly researched report on the Maloofs’ cash flow. I’m not questioning the validity of his claims. He cites his sources far to clearly for that. I’m just wondering who he is. And what he expects telling us all of this will cause. This is some high level intrigue right here.

by hlebtasic on Dec 15, 2009 1:31 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ok, enough of the slander presumption

Maybe he was just decided to publish to bring some clarity to the situation instead of everyone arguing about rumors and perception.

by bignerd on Dec 15, 2009 3:41 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Slander?

Slander is A false defamation (expressed in spoken words, signs, or gestures) which injures the character or reputation of the person defamed.

This is an anonymous post and I have no ability, nor does anybody else, to determine the identify of this person. This is except for TZ who might be able to do that from the profile information entered and that is only assuming they entered any identifying information.

Even if I could determine who this person is I would not do anything to injure them. I hope I didn’t come across as slandering this person. Hell, this guys work could easily be published.

This piece is like a story with no conclusion. What is the rub? It tells us all this information for no delineated reason or rationale and doesn’t say what we should do with the information.

by MustangMBS on Dec 15, 2009 4:23 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm with Mustang

This is a great article. Very informative and well written, no doubt about that. I’m just a bit skeptic as to why this person would come in here, post such a good piece on a topic that hasn’t really been debated (that much) around here, and then not even say a word. Granted it’s only been a day but I don’t know who this guy is and where he’s coming from with this information.

I would love for larry to participate in the conversation and explain why he decided to write such a good post. If it’s just a ‘post and run,’ then it does seem a bit shady. I’m making zero assumptions about the object of the piece, but I think it is a little weird this popped up here and anothe Kings blog in such a short period of time.

Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...

by edm7 on Dec 15, 2009 4:41 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

We are not the target of this article

This is just a way to get the Bee and someone like Amick or one of their business scrubs or The Sacramento Business Journal to pay attention.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Dec 15, 2009 10:26 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You have to have certain things to sign up for an account

But it is very easy to use a fake name.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 15, 2009 7:04 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

are you saying his name really isn't

Larry David? This could have been a post about nothing.

by betweentheeyes on Dec 15, 2009 11:48 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

It was also posted yesterday on KingsFan.com

on

KingsFan.com
.

There are some additional comments there of interest.

I am also interested in the motives of the writer in getting this information out. Hit piece? Axe to grind? Wannabe or actual journalist? Show us your cards, Larry.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Dec 15, 2009 7:16 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

StR Token Female

by LeaguePassAddict on Dec 15, 2009 11:33 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Replace it with pookeyguru

And you’ll be correcct.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 15, 2009 12:10 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Rec'd

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Dec 15, 2009 8:13 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Very nicely done. REC.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Dec 15, 2009 10:12 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Excellent reporting/analysis, from the few available sources.

I find the Maloofs with their NBA team/Casino holding very interesting. It’s an odd combo, and one that other sports might never allow.

 Funny that the state that made their wealth is not the one that got them in trouble, and make no mistake, they are in trouble. Selling the beer distribution business is a bad, bad, sign. No one wants to sell cash cows, especially ones with huge long-term gains in them, even if the basis on the gains perhaps reset when the elder Maloof passed away, or maybe reset with acquisitions.

There are some things I wish I knew:

1. The Palms facility is worth just 12% of what it was worth at the beginning of 2008? Really?

2. How much debt is the Palms carrying? When is it due? I’m too lazy to see if I can’t glean it from the station filings. There’s really little reason to believe the Station filing on value, except as a floor, unless there are huge debt payments on the Palms facility, and no way to handle them except to sell the NM beer distributorship.

3. OR – the Palms is just hemorrhaging money – since “operating profit” is also EBIT – with the “I” being interest. It could be that the Palms still makes money operating, but can’t cover the interest on its debt – with an expansion program of (I think) over $1 billion the likely interest is likely between 75 million and 125 million per year. I am assuming that the Palms expansion wasn’t paid out of free cash flow, so the Palms is likely going in the hole $25-$75 million on operating profits of $50 million.

On reflection, I’d say that there was a major principle repayment due on the Palms, and no way to raise the money (this being a bad time to get money for casinos, obviously) without resorting to the sale of the NM beer distributor.

If it was me, I might let the Palms go, and try to buy back into the Chapter 11, and thus, keep it, rather than selling the beer company. Unless, perhaps, the beer company was pledged against the Palms debt. And there is also ego involved, too.

by Xiane on Dec 16, 2009 2:13 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

This is what I was trying to get at up at the top

After factoring in my ignorance of economic principles, I mean.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.

by andy sims on Dec 16, 2009 6:57 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ah, its mostly vocabulary.

The thing about econ/finance is that when things are explained in less jargony terms, most people get it immediately. Don’t sell yourself short. I am guilty of jargon of course.

by Xiane on Dec 16, 2009 3:05 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Interesting, and definitely a solid piece of work, but I'm waiting for part 2.

Which I assume will come with some explanation for why Larry David is so interested in this topic, or in some way tie this back to why we should care at this point (ie: omg the Maloofs are going to sell the Kings next OR they don’t have the money to spend even if a stud is available during free agency OR we should all help them by pitching in for a new area OR we all need to rush out and get season tickets to save the Kings/Maloofs – etc.).

by cabz on Dec 16, 2009 11:43 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Why does he need to make a conclussion?

I don’t get this line of logic with anyone who has made the suggestion. If you read the information he provided no one can reasonably draw a conclusion, hence he hasn’t jumped into the fallacy of making one.

by bignerd on Dec 17, 2009 2:46 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Larry Davis is found

I found him at Kingsfan dot com. He has been for a number of years according to his profile, since 2006. He answers some questions and goes back and forth a bit.

Since he has ignored us here I am posting this here.

by MustangMBS on Dec 18, 2009 7:51 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Hit & Run poster

If you’re going to post something like this, you should stick around to defend/explain your post.

StR Token Female

by LeaguePassAddict on Dec 18, 2009 8:46 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree

It needed to have a conclusion… Something like..

Considering the financial times and losses of the Maloof’s they are hurting. They have lost millions in assets and wealth. They continue to lose money and may have continue to sell of assets in order to survive these tough economic times. It is quite possible that they may have to sell the Kings next if things get any worse.

OR

The Maloof have been increasingly focused on sports and entertainment ventures for some time. Selling the distributorships is just another indication that they are more invested in this new area and see the Kings as an integral part of future business.

by MustangMBS on Dec 18, 2009 9:26 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Most of this stuff

was reported in the Bee Dec. 8.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Dec 18, 2009 9:10 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

I would beg to differ

The post above dug a lot deeper and provides a lot of historical stuff that would not be easy to get. It doesn’t just represent a rip off of the Bee piece or any other publication. I Googled sections of the text in quotes to see if anybody else had written up this stuff and didn’t find anything.

And it isn’t just the fact that this person pulled all this stuff together… They paint a comprehensive and indepth look into the finances of the Maloofs in a way that really pegs where they are at. If I was doing corporate type of intelligence gathering I would hire this guy.

by MustangMBS on Dec 18, 2009 9:31 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Best comment on the Bee story
Within five years Joe and Gavin will be asking ‘Do you want fries with your order?’.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Dec 18, 2009 9:22 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Is it in Havisu Arizona?

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 19, 2009 2:32 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

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