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Around SBN: The Animated GIFs Of January

On Kevin Martin, and Why It's Foolish To Buy Him a Train Ticket

It has been discussed in the Asinine Trade thread already, but I think Marc Stein's ESPN.com Weekend Dime piece on "what the scouts say" deserves further discourse. Mostly because it's stupid to a nearly ridiculous level. Stein, of course, is fantastic, one of my favorites and the best national NBA reporter (competing with Yahoo!'s Adrian Wojnarowski). This is not an attack on Stein, or on ESPN. This is one Western Conference scout, and what he thinks about the Kings' backcourt situation, and how (so, so, so very) wrong he is.

Star-divide

Point 1: "Martin takes the ball out of Tyreke Evans' hands and Beno Udrih's hands."

Martin played with Evans and Udrih for five games this season. These also happened to be the first five games of Evans's NBA career, which you would know and take into account, if you knew Evans is a rookie, which one can assume this scout knows, but about which we can't be certain, given the points which follow.

Of these five games that Martin played with Evans and Udrih, Evans was injured for 1-1/2 games, Martin had a broken wrist for 1-1/2 games, Udrih didn't play in one game due to coach's decision, and three of the games were on the road. Just so we're clear on the observable data here.

Point 2: "Now they have Tyreke and Beno attacking the other team's worst defenders ..."

Tyreke and Beno are guards. Kevin Martin is a guard. If you replace, say, Beno/Tyreke with Tyreke/Kevin, logic would dictate that Tyreke and Beno would now be attacking the other team's worst defenders. I mean, how on Earth does this make sense? Are opponents all stashing a Secret Defender Weapon X on their bench, keeping it out of use because Kevin Martin is injured? If Tyreke and Beno are currently attacking bad defenders, I assume Kevin will be afforded those same defenders.

If the assertion is that Tyreke and Beno attack whereas Kevin does not, well then I'd like to point out that while Beno has now drawn enough fouls to get himself 24 FTAs in 17 games this season, Martin has had two games in each he attempted at least that many, and on this season has attempted more than twice as many (49) as Beno despite playing in only five games.

Point 3: " ... they've loaded up the floor with shooters ..."

Andres Nocioni became a starter in the final game before Martin's absence began. In fact, Desmond Mason was replaced on the roster by Ime Udoka (who I guess you could call a shooter, I suppose, maybe) before Martin's MRI. Beno can be considered a shooter, yes, but was added (temporarily) to the starting line-up because he was playing out of his mind and because he was clearly (at that point) the team's third best guard. Donte Greene shot 32 percent from the field last season, and has been put in the starting five first due to an Udrih injury and now for defensive reasons, primarily. Omri Casspi is a shooter, yes, but it hardly seems like the Kings used the No. 23 pick on him for a spot in that coveted "Tyreke-Beno Strategic Plan for Sacramento's Renewal." If you think Spencer Hawes is in the starting line-up over Sean May because of shooting, well, then we're done here. Move along.

Point 4: " ... and they've taken one of their weakest defenders off the floor."

I don't want to fault this particular scout for obviously not having paid attention to Martin's defense through five games this year -- Martin has a reputation for poor defense that has been backed up by numbers and observation for about two years now. We know he improved this year (markedly) but you can't very well expect every scout to know that. It's fine. The problem is in failing to realize that the player which replaced Martin in this scout's apple-y eyes is among the worst defenders in the league, or at least was last year. That line-up also led Evans being used to guard shooting guards (because Beno can't), which hurts the team's defense. That's a big reason Beno is back out of the starting five.

Point 5: "Sometimes in the past they worked so hard to find [Martin] that three other guys ended up sitting and watching."

This is just too laughable for words, really, and I feel a bit silly for even responding to it, so I'll keep it short: do you remember the Artest-Bibby-Martin era? In which Martin was the only 20-point scorer ... even though he was third on the team in FGAs per game? Or how about every other season Martin has been a starter, in which the only player to score 20+ points a game on as few FGAs as Martin uses has been Amar'e Stoudemire? Have you ever noticed how Martin usually creates most of his own attempts, which would by definition diminish the lead to find him on offense, since he can just get the ball out on the perimeter and attack from there? Also, there's the matter that his supporting cast completely sucked on offense last season. In case you forgot.

Point 6: "If they put him on the floor with Tyreke and Beno, other teams are going to take advantage of them when they do it. Maybe they try to trade him."

Other words of wisdom from this Western Conference scout:

"If Brad Pitt flies a wax hang glider to Jupiter, his head is going to explode due to atmospheric pressure. Maybe he sells his beach house in Fiji."

"If Darvin Ham eats turkey for dinner, he'll be a walking contradicition. Maybe he picks up his dry-cleaning tomorrow."

"If Tiger Woods teams up with Bella Swan and Edward Cullen, stars of Twilight: New Moon, to sell Balloon Boy merchandise in between Girls Gone Wild and ExTenz infomercials, other celebrities will raid Larry King's refrigerator. Maybe they build snowmen in El Dorado Hills."

I, for one, would prefer:

a) Brad Pitt to either not try to fly a wax hang glider to Jupiter, or if he does to take precautions against atmospheric pressure.

b) Darvin Ham eat whatever he like for dinner, and to PICK UP HIS CODDAMN DRY-CLEANING TODAY OR ELSE.

c) Tiger Woods play golf, Bella Swan and Edward Cullen to stay off my early A.M. must-see TV schedule, Balloon Boy to practice hard because he too can become a world class badminton star and celebrities to shut the ufck out of Larry King's damned refrigerator, it smells terrible I said TERRIBLE anyway you dreadful vultures.

and d) for the Kings to not make a decision on the future of the Sacramento backcourt until they can get more than, you know, 0.5 completely healthy games in as a unit. I am positive this is what will happen, though I can't speak for Brad, Darvin, Tiger, Bella, Edward, Balloon Boy or the celebrity vultures.

***

In conclusion, Western Conference Scout should stop talking for a while. Maybe sit a few plays out.

(And booyah! Ended with a timely movie quote! TZ. IS. ON. FIRE.)

Comment 88 comments  |  8 recs  | 

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Have you ever noticed how Martin usually creates most of his own attempts, which would by definition diminish the lead to find him on offense, since he can just get the ball out on the perimeter and attack from there?

Ummm … no. They don’t watch this team, otherwise they wouldn’t make such dumb statements.

by Dub_TC on Dec 7, 2009 11:53 AM PST reply actions  

I have to admit

I wondered how the Kings chemistry would be when Martin returns. Would Reke or the other guys still take shots or would they defer to Martin? It will definitely be interesting to watch the Kings once Martin returns.

"It ain't over till it's over." - Yogi Berra

by 49er16 on Dec 7, 2009 11:55 AM PST reply actions  

My possibly rose-colored view

is that over the long term it was a very good thing for Kevin Martin to get hurt early in the season.

As strange as that sounds, I think it permitted Evans to flex his muscles, not worrying about deferring to KM. It will be easier and much more fluid for KM to find his place in the flow of the offense than it would have been for Evans to learn his place.

When Kevin comes back and, after two full months, Tyreke has fully established that he belongs here, it could actually be scary.

Lower their expectations and rise to met them

by left hand on Dec 7, 2009 5:47 PM PST up reply actions  

I think there's some truth there

but I think enough is enough – I’m ready to see him back.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 7:05 PM PST up reply actions  

With ya.

Lower their expectations and rise to met them

by left hand on Dec 8, 2009 12:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Word.

Agreed. If it works out, I don’t think scary is a strong enough word for that duo.

I heart Kev’reke.

33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.

by JETisKing on Dec 7, 2009 8:17 PM PST up reply actions  

The GM of the Grizzlies is also a Western Conference Scout?

"Sometimes the capriciousness of youth anesthetizes common sense." -Let Geoff's words guide our patience this season.

by AnotherStupidSN on Dec 7, 2009 12:07 PM PST reply actions   2 recs

First off...

That is damn funny ASSN. Any shot at Wallace is well deserved.

To the point though, and it is also addressed down in the thread a bit, it will be interesting to see how Martin fits back in when he returns. I couldn’t agree more that there is no indication that Kevin’s ego would get in the way of letting Tyreke be “the man” – in fact, it could be said that it is Kevin’s nature to play off of someone else rather than to be the one initiating the offense.

Personally, I think it could be a beatiful thing to watch once they get used to playing together. Kevin moves so well without the ball, and Reke gets into the lane at will – Tyreke’s assist totals should jump almost instantly. Also, every other perimeter player should receive almost zero attention with those two on the floor at the same time…

"Granted, this is not a great situation, but when all you have is lemons, you add some vodka to dull the pain..."

by Mcamp49 on Dec 7, 2009 1:37 PM PST up reply actions  

Agreed

Patience will be the key, as it could take some time (i.e. the rest of the season) for us to really know what we have with our ’Reke/K$ backcourt, especially considering one of them is technically still a rookie, even if his game has disguised this fact lately.

"Sometimes the capriciousness of youth anesthetizes common sense." -Let Geoff's words guide our patience this season.

by AnotherStupidSN on Dec 7, 2009 2:52 PM PST up reply actions  

Somewhat

The Spurs did the same thing though.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 7, 2009 4:09 PM PST up reply actions  

Yep.

Kevin always plays better when he’s not the focus of the opposing defense. The possibility of it all is pretty dern exciting.

33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.

by JETisKing on Dec 7, 2009 8:19 PM PST up reply actions  

Overall right, a couple flaws

Martin’s FGAs are deceiving b/c of how often he ends up on the line. If you count total attempts, it would give a true account of how much ball Martin handles. Secondly, the fact that his points are not assisted says two things, a) he had to create his own shot, b) he scores off of creating his own shot. This one-on-one basketball was largely the result of a bad team, but if it continues, it will isolate Martin from (what has been a very good) offense.

by sactown on Dec 7, 2009 12:08 PM PST reply actions  

I have a feeling that Martin won't force the issue. He strikes me as being like Ray Allen.

When he has needed to, he will play one on one. But when he became surrounded by good players and was part of an ensemble, he happily accepted being the spot up shooter. Now we have a healthy Tyreke, who is an incredible one on one player (A la Paul Pierce with more speed but not a lethal jump shot), so Martin won’t have to go one on one.

And if people stand around waiting for him to make something happen, that is their fault, and the coach’s fault for not motivating them to keep cutting and spacing themselves out.

"Thou must give props" - Ice_9ine

by tomroadrunner on Dec 7, 2009 12:14 PM PST up reply actions  

True.

The scary thing is…Tyreke will have a lethal jump shot eventually.

I could see Kevin and ‘Reke just dominating games at the foul line alone. It’ll be interesting to see them create for each other, themselves, and the rest of the team.

Kev’reke will be awesome.

33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.

by JETisKing on Dec 7, 2009 8:22 PM PST up reply actions  

Agree to a point...

The scout’s comments are ridiculous as you so adroitly point out. However, that is not to say that there is no valid reason to “shop” KMart. The fact (and it is a “fact”) is that he can not seem to stay on the floor. His injury history is harmful to the team and I wonder if you can count on him for the future. Some might argue that his injuries have all been different, (i.e. “flukes”) and that it is just bad luck, but some guys simply have the injury bug and never are able to get rid of it. I fear KMart may be terminal. That is not to say that he should be given away. But I would have no problem with a fair trade of KMart because I think his long-term future on the Kings is in doubt.

by longtimelistenerfirsttimecaller on Dec 7, 2009 12:12 PM PST reply actions  

I for one can't wait to see Martin back

and hope it will be sooooon!
but -

Maybe they build snowmen in El Dorado Hills.

I hear it did actually snow there this morning – so there’s that.

Seriously, I don’t think there’s too much debate that when healthy (if) we’re more than a little wing heavy on this roster as Casspi and Donte’ both seem to have a future.

On most folks wish list is Another big man to fill in in case of:
1. injury
1. foul trouble
2. bad nights
3. bigger rosters
4. just to take some pressure off
5. in case one of our young bigs just isn’t a starter

I personally think KM is untouchable in all but a “Wow!” deal and that we have some pieces that can probably translate into a servicable 3rd big man without touching our core.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 12:12 PM PST reply actions  

I totally agree with your last sentence lttg

I’m also only giving up Kevin on a "Wow’ deal. I think what he does is too valuable and unique to give away for something just good, not great.

Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...

by edm7 on Dec 7, 2009 12:21 PM PST up reply actions  

Usted destacó un punto clave.

Necesitamos un Centro o Delantero grande. Ojalá Donté se aumentará de peso para jugar el PF.

"Thou must give props" - Ice_9ine

by tomroadrunner on Dec 7, 2009 12:22 PM PST up reply actions  

Or just draft one.

"Thou must give props" - Ice_9ine

by tomroadrunner on Dec 7, 2009 12:24 PM PST up reply actions  

Estoy de acuerdo

Pero creo que Donte no esta tan delgado. Subira de peso naturalmente, solo tiene 21

Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...

by edm7 on Dec 7, 2009 12:28 PM PST up reply actions  

Te creo.

"Thou must give props" - Ice_9ine

by tomroadrunner on Dec 7, 2009 12:34 PM PST up reply actions  

Que

….sadilla

Judgment day is coming!

by Widowwolf on Dec 7, 2009 6:21 PM PST up reply actions  

Thanks for touching on this Z

This is what I envisioned when I posted the fanshot. Glad to know I wasn’t crazy when I thought that analysis was pretty ridiculous.

Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...

by edm7 on Dec 7, 2009 12:22 PM PST reply actions  

I think it is great

Kevin is sitting on the bench during games, and not off in the baseline corner with Cisco. And his suit jacket was cool. The pants and shoes did not quite match, but the jacket was happening! Its called GQ style, look it up. Anyway about his new seat, I think this is a conscious effort by the coaches to incorporate K-Mart as much as possible in anticipation of his return. K-Mart can get a better sense for strategy, coaching maneuvers, and pass along words of wisdom to Tyreke and anyone who will listen.

Hopefully, K-Mart returns one month from today!

As far as this scout, he must work for the T’Wolves, Dubs, or Clips. But I think he makes a valid point in which teammates would tend to watch when K-Mart has the ball on the wings. And play would come to a stand still. Sometimes. Not always.

But lets not kid ourselves. We have a player in Tyreke playing the game at one level. An all-star, game-defining level. And then we have teammates playing at a lower level. A contributory, yet inconsistent level. Occasionally, a player will rise up and play on same level (see Donte Greene outburst versus Knicks), but not often. To beat quality teams, we need another player playing at the same superior level as Tyreke. And a player who can be counted upon to play that way most nights. That player is Kevin Martin.

Last two games K-Mart was the missing piece. Come back soon, Kevin.

by bench_blob on Dec 7, 2009 12:24 PM PST reply actions  

Great point about Kevin sitting next to the coaching staff

I don’t think anyone brough it up yet but it’s definitely a positive sign of how the coaching staff views Speed

Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...

by edm7 on Dec 7, 2009 12:30 PM PST up reply actions  

That jacket is cool in the fashion world?

Just for fun, estimate the average IQ and good taste quotient of that industry.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 12:43 PM PST up reply actions  

But you're other points are solid

(just no accounting for taste I guess)

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 12:50 PM PST up reply actions  

Your /or /you are solid on your

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 12:51 PM PST up reply actions  

That jacket last night

was the best argument yet to hope Kevin will be wearing a basketball uniform again soon.

Professional Hyperbole Slayer

by ForThree on Dec 7, 2009 1:05 PM PST up reply actions  

Can someone

please point out for me a time (on or off the court) where Kevin Martin has given us any indication that he is a me-first, get mine ballplayer? Can someone give me one example that would cause us concern that he cannot “fit in?” Would we perhaps like to have a an offensive player of Martin’s caliber on the floor when our offense bogs and we need a hoop?

This guy figured out a way to play with Artest and Bibby when they refused to defer, managed to co-exist with the ball-pounding John Salmons. Martin has been through hell with the Kings, the one player that was a rotation guy on the last playoff roster and has been along for the ride all the way down to 17 wins.

Someone has to explain to me why/where we perceive that his return will cause problems. We’ll have too many productive players? More, please.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Dec 7, 2009 12:30 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

Exactly. That's why I kind of compare him to Allen.

I think he will fit in where he fits in. He is a low drama, high shooting percentage kind of guy. He fits where you put him.

"Thou must give props" - Ice_9ine

by tomroadrunner on Dec 7, 2009 12:37 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

+1

I am with you completely. Martin seems to have little to no ego problems and there is absolutely no evidence that he would have a problem playing with anyone. Especially after what has happened which as you clearly point out is evidence supporting him doing well with Evans.

Further, I would like to point out that we don’t have a lot of players who are a down right amazing talent or even close to all star level. Martin is the only one besides our up and coming Evans IMHO.

Why is it that everytime we get a player doing well at one position that we have to trade away our best or our up and coming talent. We need talent and depth so badly and these trade away threads or comments make me want to pull our my hair at times.

by MustangMBS on Dec 7, 2009 12:40 PM PST up reply actions  

Exactly 214.

And Kmart does not get enough credit for being perhaps the most well adjusted star NBA player. No ego in the guy. Just team. No trouble. A great attitude.

by amonk81 on Dec 7, 2009 1:08 PM PST up reply actions  

Perhaps this is just another reason why the Kings are performing so well this season…the other teams are obviously not scouting them very well…

Once Martin comes back the Kings will be better, and considering they are already playing well, I look forward to the day.

by DirtyDribblers on Dec 7, 2009 12:41 PM PST reply actions  

Scouting report for the Kings:

Evans: Will drive. Unspectacular shooter.
Casspi: Will shoot threes and play tough. Hack-a-Jew.
Maxwell: Athletic, average shooter.
Mobley: Solid shooting stroke, not a great ball handler.
Martin: Locker room cancer, offensive black hole.

"Thou must give props" - Ice_9ine

by tomroadrunner on Dec 7, 2009 12:47 PM PST up reply actions   2 recs

Robertson: Not a true point guard.

by DustyG on Dec 7, 2009 4:04 PM PST up reply actions  

Definitely.

6"5’, scores prolifically and rebounds? I’ll pass!

"Thou must give props" - Ice_9ine

by tomroadrunner on Dec 7, 2009 7:31 PM PST up reply actions  

Bobby Jackson: Soft, will not play through injury.

Barry: Versatile, will hit the three, balding, not his father.

by mayfieldcol on Dec 7, 2009 7:44 PM PST up reply actions  

Bag on the scout all you want

But everyone knows that having too much talent is a terrible burden, and not a single talented squad has won an NBA championship since before the Civil War.

So, Martin comes back, plays his game, Evans scores 5 less a game, but gets 3-5 more assists a night. How awful for us.

Martin spreads the floor, and when he drives, he collapses defenses. Someone will be open. This scout couldn’t find his ass with both hands and a road map.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.

by andy sims on Dec 7, 2009 12:44 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

I honestly don't see Tyreke's scoring being affected even that much

Because the other team won’t be able to focus they’re entire defense on him.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Dec 7, 2009 12:46 PM PST up reply actions  

Maybe this scouts from the Clippers

and thats why he’s so in awe of Beno.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Dec 7, 2009 12:47 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

With

I see Evans scoring going up because he make easier shots when KMart in on the floor. The other team can’t just clog up the lane.

by MustangMBS on Dec 7, 2009 12:58 PM PST up reply actions  

I can't agree more TZ

(By the way, before I forget, did you get that e-mail I sent you?)

Martin is the best shooter on this team. Tyreke needs shooters around him. Donté’s improved his stroke this year, but most of his improvement has come from attacking the rim. With Kevin on the floor, you have to pick between two very lethal poisons in Tyreke or Kevin, unless you’re a team that happens to have two exceptional backcourt defenders (Off the top of my head, only pair I can think of is Westbrook and Sefalosha).

Kevin Martin is the reason I loved the Tyreke pick. We have a chance to have one of, if not the, most lethal backcourt in the NBA, in terms of scoring the ball, and getting the other team into foul trouble. Kevin and Tyreke are like Yin and Yang: One shoots the ball with extreme accuracy, the other gets to the rim at will. One needs the ball in his hands, the other excels at playing off the ball. I honestly think this could be a matchup made in heaven, and I think its why Kevin Martin had been campaigning so hard for us to pick Evans in the draft (as he’s mentioned several times during interviews).

People just got too caught up with how well the Kings had been playing without him, and comparing it to the Webber situation back when he came back from microfracture. This is not even nearly the same, Webber was never the same player after that, because it took away a lot of his athleticism, while Kevin’s out because of an injury to his non-shooting wrist. If it had been Kevin’s ankle again, I might have been a bit more worried. But I’m not. And Kevin has been the consummate professional, you always see him cheering his team on, giving his teammates words of advice during timeouts, I just don’t see him breaking any chemistry when he comes back.

Come back soon K-Mart, we’re going to need you, because the going is about to get a lot tougher.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Dec 7, 2009 12:45 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

I love me some angry Ziller

Good stuff all around.

Never forget: I am a complete idiot

by Exhibit G on Dec 7, 2009 12:49 PM PST reply actions  

I don't understand this...
We know he improved this year (markedly) but you can’t very well expect every scout to know that. It’s fine.

Besides the fact that it’s their job? I mean this is what they get paid to do. To KNOW these things!

by Smills91 on Dec 7, 2009 1:03 PM PST reply actions  

The only way KMart shoudl be traded is for an all-star big...

and even then I’m not sure it’s a great idea. “Experts” who don’t follow the team on a daily basis are information deprived. It’s a joke. Just watch when Kmart comes back. Let’s recall the insane match-up issues he and Reke caused.

by amonk81 on Dec 7, 2009 1:05 PM PST reply actions  

Or Danny Granger

I’d do K-Mart for Granger in a heartbeat. Not sure if Indy does it though.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Dec 7, 2009 2:07 PM PST up reply actions  

They don't

They need a SG but what would they do at SF? And they desperately need to lose a PG and/or one of thier big men – but especially a PG. They have $25 mil or something crazy tied in those guys.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 2:58 PM PST up reply actions  

The sad part is I can't name one of them outside of TJ

and I guess they’re still paying Tinsley.

GREENE! You’ve been superfluously apostrophe’d! - andy sims

by iashwash on Dec 7, 2009 3:36 PM PST up reply actions  

right

TJ = 8.5/8.5
Tinsley = 5.2/5.4
Watson = 2.8
Diener = 1.7
AJ Price = $500k

Thats a bunch of bored but well fed PGs
(OK, not $25 mil but -)

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 4:08 PM PST up reply actions  

Are you allowed to booyah yourself?

That may tear the sports-time continuum.

by RMJ equals Hero on Dec 7, 2009 1:28 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

Exactly like the stock market

You’re supposed to sell low, right?

by EvoStrife on Dec 7, 2009 1:35 PM PST reply actions  

I agree about Stein & Woj

I think they do a good job given the limitations of being national writers. (And they do aim to get things right.)

I think the scout is stupid. Well said TZ.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 7, 2009 1:43 PM PST reply actions  

Another example of the national media not paying much attention to the smaller market teams

I too like Stein but as I recall the scout reported on 5-6 teams. Stein, if he really knows what’s happening with the Kings should have picked another team to have the so – called scout give his take on. There’s a bunch of speculation on the internetz about Kevin Martin and right now he is probably the number 1 player in trade proposals floated in the national chats. Actually this “scout’s” take is about on par with some of the more ludicrous proposals.

It’s going to be interesting to see how the Kings incorporate both Kevin and Cisco back into the lineup but that isn’t to say it can’t be done. Besides having a superstar and playing consistent d, the other ingredient superior teams have is depth. Based on this scout’s take, the Celtics should have traded KG when he came back from his knee injury.

If Omri and Donté continue to play well and improve as players I do think it does make Noc and Cisco more likely to be traded, probably Noc based on his contract and reputation. The only way I can see the Kings trading Kevin would be as lttg says for a “wow” big and they are about as easy to find as elite shooters like Kevin.

"I make love to pressure" - Stephen Jackson

by Bluejohn on Dec 7, 2009 3:49 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

Exactly BJ

Great points all around.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 7, 2009 4:02 PM PST up reply actions  

To desire desirelessness is the key to happiness

       We want more, I know I do. I see the potential for more this year and that potential for more now will take a few moves by Petrie. We have all seen the talent and the moxy that this team is playing with. They will beat the bad teams at home and on the road. They can beat the good teams at home and maybe steal a few here and there on the road too. So what is the next step.
       This is why I think Martin’s name keeps coming up. JT, Evans, Green, and Casspi I do not think are going anywhere. So the names of Beno, Cisco, Noce, KT, and maybe (Hawes and Sergio) keep coming up as potential pieces we want to move. But what will these latter names get us??? Not something that will give us “the more.”. Martin is the name that will give us “the more.” And let us not forget is has missed 20-30 the last two years and this current year. I would count on him missing 20 games next year too.
      Moving Martin and his injury proneness may give us the next step to “more.”

by noreboundsnorings on Dec 7, 2009 2:26 PM PST reply actions  

And I have no problem with trading Martin for "the more."

I do have a problem with the notion that we are forced to move him due to a logjam of talent or the fear that he is a gear that will not mesh with the other gears.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Dec 7, 2009 2:42 PM PST up reply actions  

Exactly

That’s just ignorance speaking.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Dec 7, 2009 2:49 PM PST up reply actions  

In reference to people who want to move him for stupid reasons.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Dec 7, 2009 2:49 PM PST up reply actions  

I want to move him because I hate all professional basketball players from Zanesville OH

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 7, 2009 4:08 PM PST up reply actions   2 recs

Really

What kind of place is named “Zanesville”? I think we’ve had enough zany players…

GREENE! You’ve been superfluously apostrophe’d! - andy sims

by iashwash on Dec 7, 2009 8:50 PM PST up reply actions  

O-H-I-O!

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.

by andy sims on Dec 7, 2009 10:59 PM PST up reply actions  

At first, I was confused. Then, I realized: Oh! Hiyoooo!

GREENE! You’ve been superfluously apostrophe’d! - andy sims

by iashwash on Dec 8, 2009 12:11 AM PST up reply actions  

K-mart is not the type to "not mesh"...

and as for trades due to a “logjam”, I can think of a couple of other names that would be on the list long before K-Mart…

Purveyor of Bull Plop

by SayWhat? on Dec 7, 2009 5:13 PM PST up reply actions  

Kobe Bryant, in the beginning of his career, only played 79 games three times in the first nine years, missing 11, 3, 32, 16, 14, 17, and 16 games. Shaq from age 23-26 missed 28, 31, 22, and 33 games. Vince Carter through those same ages missed 32, 10, 7, 22, and 39 games. Steve Nash at the ages K-Mart is now missed 42, 26, and 12 games. Allen Iverson missed 34, 2, 11, 22, 0, and 34 games at the same stretch of his career. My point, other than knowing how to use Basketball-Reference.com, is that having a bad couple of years with injuries is hardly indicative a pattern. Not everyone is going to be Grant Hill or Tracy McGrady.

by MichaelMack on Dec 7, 2009 4:01 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

aaaaannnd

if anyone was watching the last five minutes of the second quarter last night against the Heat, we need K-Mart’s considerable offensive prowess badly.

by MichaelMack on Dec 7, 2009 4:04 PM PST up reply actions  

Mack FTW!

Godfather of the "nice ass" movement.... the future begins now...

by edm7 on Dec 7, 2009 4:06 PM PST up reply actions  

Nice!

I remember Shaq being out all those games now

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 4:11 PM PST up reply actions  

Didn't have 'Oden' type injuries though

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 7, 2009 4:12 PM PST up reply actions  

MM, FYI, I posted this in the Bee and credited you on this.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Dec 8, 2009 10:50 AM PST up reply actions  

This is a recording

The fact that the Kings are 1-4 with Kevin Martin and 8-6 without Kevin Martin is not proof that the team is better without Kevin Martin. Unless you can see into some alternative universe where Kevin wasn’t injured, you have no way of knowing whether the team would have gone 6-8, 2-10 or 14-0 with a healthy Kevin Martin.

"When you look at him, you say: 'Holy God.'" - Pete Carril on Tyreke Evans

by otis29 on Dec 7, 2009 3:05 PM PST reply actions  

I do submit the Kings would be 0-5 in the first 5 games

Tyreke genuinely struggled in those games (sans the New Orleans game) and was not the self we’ve seen since.

Also, playing with Donte hasn’t hurt Tyreke one bit. So i’m not exactly sure how Kevin Martin is guarnateed to hurt this team.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

Oh, hes in the laegue two and Jayson Thomson and that Boggins dude on Milwokee, and Occur for the Jizz. Its a talented laegue.--Kfan in Korea

by pookeyguru on Dec 7, 2009 4:05 PM PST up reply actions  

I did want to trade Kevin last night after seeing the smoking jacket/Tux

but this morning I woke up thinking he’s just bored.

"I make love to pressure" - Stephen Jackson

by Bluejohn on Dec 7, 2009 4:18 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

Reminds me of a great line from "Cheers"

Diane: Sam, do you happen to own a smoking jacket?

Sam: Hey, I’m smoking in any jacket.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Dec 7, 2009 6:11 PM PST up reply actions  

Mrs. section214 hates M*A*S*H*

I turn it on just to hear her yell at me to turn it off. Now that’s entertainment.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Dec 7, 2009 11:30 PM PST up reply actions  

... they've loaded up the floor with shooters ..."

My first thought was that this was the scout’s way of saying that the King’s frontline is weak on the low block. The game against Miami I think supports this point. Spencer and JT should have owned the low block but got denied by shorter stronger players.

by getPGwithbounce on Dec 7, 2009 6:46 PM PST reply actions  

How about those Ginobili arms in that pic? Dude is cut.

I’d like to buy a pair of those for Spencer and maybe another pair for Kevin to use as legs.

Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott

by Kfan in Korea on Dec 7, 2009 7:08 PM PST reply actions  

Nah

Ginobli is just on Team Jacob, and they were working out together. Hence Manu’s automatic antagonism towards bats.

GREENE! You’ve been superfluously apostrophe’d! - andy sims

by iashwash on Dec 8, 2009 12:30 AM PST up reply actions  

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