The superstar list grows as the Rockets move on

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 21, 2009 2:53 PM PST Comment 33 comments

Injuries have put Amare Stoudemire and Tracy McGrady out of commission and onto future NBA trade lists.

We've talked a lot about Amare, so not much to recap there except that he is developing quite a rep for getting hurt. T-Mac already was wearing that mantle.

Unfortunately, to follow (perhaps not exactly) the Chris Webber model, those are going to be the kind of guys we can get down the road if we want them. Talented guys who have worn out their welcome due to injury or attitude or both.

I haven't read in detail the stories about Adelman throwing McGrady under the bus after the T-Mac decided to have surgery, but it doesn't surprise me. That might be the last time you see T-Mac wearing a Rockets jersey.

I find it interesting that Artest called out T-Mac recently, and some folks were then pointing the finger at Ron, blaming him for the Rockets recent struggles. But if you look closer into that situation, there were a lot of mini-dramas going on in Houston.

Seems like they have decided to move on with Aaron Brooks at the point after dumping Alston. It looks like Artest will be playing some 2 guard for them, and Adelman will be paring down the lineup and playing 7-8 guys a lot like he did sometimes in Sacramento.

I think the Rockets are going to go off on a streak here and show that, as we have discussed, sometimes teams improve by addition through substraction. You have a superstar in Yao, three high basketball IQ guys who know how to play in Scola, Battier and Artest, and a young energy guy in Brooks. I think that team just got a lot more dangerous.

I also think the way the Rockets are going about things is going to be more of a model for NBA teams like Sacramento going forward. Instead of the 2-3 superstar model, which is hard to develop because it's difficult enough to get one superstar to sign on let alone 2-3, it's going to be more about building around one superstar with a bunch of solid players -- basically what we did in assembling our great teams around Webber. There's also a lot less risk in that model and it costs less to compete, which will be important as owners like the Maloofs face growing economic pressures.

(This is a FanPost from a member of the Sactown Royalty community. The views expressed come from the member, and not Sactown Royalty staff.)

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Are you suggesting

that we pick up T-Mac? An injury prone superstar on the downside of his prime who is about to undergo microfracture knee surgery? Haven’t we been through that before?

www.mancancook.net

by vfettke on Feb 21, 2009 3:12 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Nope

Not at all.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 21, 2009 3:55 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Who would take T-Mac next year?

Unless he proves he’s recovered, which I think would require 1/2 a season of healthy play, I think there’s little chance the Rockets could trade him for anything at all.
No matter what Houston would wish….

As for your main point about the type of star we may be able to get, I tend to agree.

So imitate the action of the tiger!
Stiffen the sinews, summon up the blood,
Disguise fair nature with hard-favoured rage.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect,

Now set the teeth - and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Feb 21, 2009 3:59 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Which is why we're probably better off trying to just draft our own

“The Webber method” of trading for a young problem player who then turns into your superstar has happened how many times in the last 20 years in the NBA?

Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott

by Kfan in Korea on Feb 21, 2009 4:09 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

The last 20 years

The champions have generally been led by guys like Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, MJ, Hakeem, which means 5-6 teams have passed around the spoils. Probably Rasheed Wallace would be the exception and even then he wasn’t a superstar.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 21, 2009 4:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

not sure what pass around the spoils means

but if you allow for MJ*1 and Isiah Thomas*2 to be interesting exceptions the only team to win the NBA title while not being led by a #1 pick during the last 25 years was the Pistons in 2004 and of course, the Celtics last year.

I dunno if the Kings should look to other NBA rosters for superstar help but I hope they don’t package up a deal for McGrady.

- was the #3 pick behind Olajuwon and would have been #2 if it weren’t for Drexler.

- was the #2 pick and played with that same #1 pick (Mark Aguirre) on those title winning teams in 89-90.

still Swish Fan #1.

by ChrisCEIT on Feb 23, 2009 11:56 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

if ANY team trades for McGrady as anything other than a salary dump

it may mean Billy King is back as a GM

by betweentheeyes on Feb 23, 2009 9:55 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe in 2010

but someone really special would have to become available (cheap) for a deal like that next yr

So imitate the action of the tiger!
Stiffen the sinews, summon up the blood,
Disguise fair nature with hard-favoured rage.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect,

Now set the teeth - and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Feb 22, 2009 1:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree a bit

There are always teams willing to take the gamble to acquire a superstar. Whether McGrady is one ot not that’s another story. I think is a bit like the C Webb situation when Philly took him thinking pairing him with AI would put them over the top.

With that being said, the Kings should not trade for McGrady and probably won’t

"Let's stop arguing and get together and agree on who really is the problem: PEACHES" - HighTops

by eduardo_m7 on Feb 21, 2009 4:11 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I think there is a ZERO chance

The Kings show any interest in McGrady. My point there is that he’s going to be available and that’s the kind of circumstance that generally makes that kind of guy available.

I probably could have added situations where a team sucks and they get rid of a superstar similar to what could end up happening in Toronto if they don’t right the ship.

Bottom line, though, as I point out at the bottom I see teams heading towards a different model rather than stockpiling 2-3 guys of that caliber. That could mean more of those types of guys will become available and get spread around a bit more rather than concentrated on the best teams.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 21, 2009 4:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Did you just call Ron-Ron a high IQ player?

I guess there is a difference between “knowing” how to play and actually calming all the crazies inside your head and showing it. Did you by chance get a shot at seeing him when he wore 93 in purple?

by bringbackbuddytrees on Feb 22, 2009 2:01 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

Ron Artest can ball

Never doubt that. Question his sanity, please, go ahead – I did more than my fair share – but never doubt the game. Have respect for his game, he’s still the most feared defender in the NBA, years removed from his statistical prime.

Donte? Donte'! Donté?!?!
'spect da 'xtra E'

by iashwash on Feb 23, 2009 2:01 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I would say Ron Artest is a High IQ player - on the court only

by betweentheeyes on Feb 23, 2009 9:55 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Last I checked

that’s where the playing takes place.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 23, 2009 10:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Last I checked

It’s not the only thing you judge a basketball player by…

"Let's stop arguing and get together and agree on who really is the problem: PEACHES" - HighTops

by eduardo_m7 on Feb 23, 2009 10:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

You need a Team

he causes problems in that regard because he’s apparently just as aggressive in the locker room as on the court.

He lacks the even occasional subtlety in his interpersonal skills.

But I’m a big fan on the court.

So imitate the action of the tiger!
Stiffen the sinews, summon up the blood,
Disguise fair nature with hard-favoured rage.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect,

Now set the teeth - and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Feb 23, 2009 11:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yet the locker room his deteriorated

Per Adelman, and that’s clearly affected the product on the floor.

Mambo King

by otis29 on Feb 24, 2009 5:01 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Hard to say if its Ron Ron

or the ongoing T-Mac drama……

not that I’m arguing really.

So imitate the action of the tiger!
Stiffen the sinews, summon up the blood,
Disguise fair nature with hard-favoured rage.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect,

Now set the teeth - and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Feb 24, 2009 10:37 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I think the trade and injury

may clear up some of that “deteriorated” locker room.

While it’s too early to say definitively, the early returns are the product on the floor has improved. I guess time will tell.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 24, 2009 12:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Personally

I think some of that may have to do with Ron’s personality, but I bet a lot of it just has to do with Tmac’s availability. I don’t find it surprising the Rox considered trading Ron though.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

I am the stone that builder refused..I am the visual...The inspiration..That made lady sing the blues....I'm the spark that makes your idea bright.....The same spark that lights the dark....So that you can know your left from your right...I am the ballot in your box....The bullet in your gun...The inner glow that lets you know...To call your brother son....The story that just begun...The promise of what's to come...And I'm 'a remain a soldier till the war is won....

by pookeyguru on Feb 24, 2009 3:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

And now we pause for a moment of reality

Yep, it sounds like they are really deteriorating …

Resilient Rockets roll on

Some sample quotes:

The Rockets have lost Tracy McGrady for the rest of the season to a knee injury, Rafer Alston to a trade to Orlando and Carl Landry to a sprained ankle. But that’s the only losing that’s happening in Houston these days.

Yao: “We are really focused, focused on 48 minutes, not like before.”

Adelman: “These guys really believe there is no reason we can’t win.”

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 24, 2009 6:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

If the Rockets make real noise come playoff time (which they might)

Then your statement holds true. Until then, I find it hard to believe the Rockets are anything short of a guarantee (regardless of Ron’s behavior at a given time—the West is just that tough).

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Feb 25, 2009 2:47 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

No doubt

The playoff spots in the West are up for grabs, and the Rockets will have to keep up their recent play just to get in. They helped their cause last night by beating the Blazers in a close game.

As indicated in the original post, I see the way the Rockets are building as a potential model for the Kings rebuilding process. Not exactly, because there are no Yaos on the roster or in this year’s draft, but the basic ideas of building the way we did the first time and finding pieces that fit well together.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 25, 2009 5:31 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

You must be insane

You want the Kings to try to become like the Rockets?

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think the Rockets have gotten out of the 1st round and it’s looking more and more like McGrady is just done, and Ron is a free agent this summer and may leave for nothing and Yao isn’t getting any younger and they aren’t anywhere close to being in contention for a title.

If GP is trying to model this team on the Rockets without a Yao, he should be fired yesterday.

Oh, and this would be a great discussion on a Rockets blog. Can’t we just put Ron behind us. He’s nothing more than a minor blip in the history of the Sacramento Kings and really should only be mentioned in passing. Kind of like Keon Clark or Greg Ostertag or Ralph Sampson.

Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott

by Kfan in Korea on Feb 25, 2009 6:13 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Geez

What a whiny little bitch you are. Enough said.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 25, 2009 6:24 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Fuck off

Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott

by Kfan in Korea on Feb 25, 2009 1:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Blips and building teams

Can’t we just put Ron behind us? He’s nothing more than a minor blip in the history of the Sacramento Kings and really should only be mentioned in passing. Kind of like Keon Clark or Greg Ostertag or Ralph Sampson.

Usually the best player (or, to be charitable, the co-best player) on a team for three years warrants a little more than a blip, particularly if he was on the team last year and the franchise has totally fallen apart in his absence. He sure wasn’t a blip on these boards when he was here.

That said, I don’t think the debate is about Ron; it’s about the building of a team, and I just used the Rockets as a current example of how one is being assembled. Plus the news (at the time of posting) that McGrady was, in my opinion, now trade fodder.

You want the Kings to try to become like the Rockets?

I can think of worse things to become. Frankly, just about everyone looks pretty good compared to where we are now.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 27, 2009 1:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Not everyone

I wouldn’t want to be the Clippers. That’s just one team I wouldn’t want to be.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Feb 27, 2009 3:49 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

You mean

The team that just beat the Celtics? Who will win tonight?

You’re right, though, just not a lot of “fun” guys on that team.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 27, 2009 4:19 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Oh yes

Beating the Celtics is a qualifier that the Clippers are a team I want the Kings to emulate. Thank you CC. I totally forgotten what it means to beat a quality team actually does for a team when they’ve lost 3 times as many games as they’ve won.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Feb 27, 2009 4:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

You're right

It’s been a while for us. Except we’ve lost four times as many as we’ve won.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 27, 2009 8:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Rockets run win streak to five

From Yahoo after last night’s win:

Artest: "Our record (36-21) doesn’t show it, but we’re starting to show the type of team we are. We’re starting to come together."

G Ron Artest led the Rockets in scoring for a second consecutive game, following his 26 points on Sunday with 21 against the Blazers, hitting four consecutive free throws in the final half-minute to seal the win.

The Rockets will get another stiff test when they host Cleveland Thursday night.

"The basis for winning an NBA title is having a superstar in his prime. Not an all-star, or a bunch of all-stars, but a superstar."

by coolcatreportdotcom on Feb 25, 2009 6:22 AM PST reply actions 0 recs