Mike Fratello
by busybe on Mar 30, 2009 6:23 PM PDT
77 comments
Did anyone see the story about Mike Fratello "the czar of the telestrator" wanting to get back into coaching? He's a pretty successful veteran coach who could get respect, teach defense and possibly sign for a reasonable salary.
Was he too much of a defensive minded, slow-it-down, grind-it-out type coach?
Fratello was head coach of the Memphis Grizzlies from December 2004 to December 2006. In his first season he inherited a 5-11 team that he turned around to win 45 games and advance to the playoffs. Fratello built on that record the following year to win 49 games and return to the playoffs for a second consecutive season. Before departing in December 2006, his record was 6-24 taking his overall record with Memphis to 95-87.
Prior to working with the Grizzlies, Fratello had coached the Cleveland Cavaliers and the Atlanta Hawks. In his six seasons with the Cleveland Cavaliers his record was 248 wins and 212 losses. Fratello took the Cavaliers to the playoffs four times. Fratello coached the Hawks for seven seasons and posted a 324-250 record, making the post-season playoffs five times and winning the Central Division in 1987 with 57 wins. Fratello was named coach of the year for the 1985-1986 NBA season. His NBA career stats are 666 wins and 542 losses for a .551 average. His teams have qualified for the playoffs in eleven of his 16 seasons as a head coach.
One of the most respected basketball minds despite having never won an NBA championship as a head coach, Fratello ranks 19 on the NBA's all time win list and 21 in games coached.
This isn't an endorsement, just found it interesting to hear of a new possiblity in the coaching search. There is a coaching search right?. Any thoughts?
(This is a FanPost from a member of the Sactown Royalty community. The views expressed come from the member, and not Sactown Royalty staff.)
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Any thoughts??
I think that this should be a fanshot and you are about to get slammed by some people here followed by TZ probably shutting this thread. That’s what I think…
Bingo!
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I am the stone that builder refused..I am the visual...The inspiration..That made lady sing the blues....I'm the spark that makes your idea bright.....The same spark that lights the dark....So that you can know your left from your right...I am the ballot in your box....The bullet in your gun...The inner glow that lets you know...To call your brother son....The story that just begun...The promise of what's to come...And I'm 'a remain a soldier till the war is won....
that and I hope we don't hear any rumors about Dick Motta wanting to come out of retirement
Is he still alive? Wouldn’t make any difference anyway.
"We are in the business of kicking butt and business is very, very good." - Charles Barkley
forget dick motta
bring back gary st. jean. i loved seeing his face turn red in the first quarter. or he would just stand there with his arms crossed and a smirk on his face. or better yet, when he would pound the media table and throw a tantrum. damn i miss the early to mid 90s. say what you want about the team, but watching st. jean coach that team was better than watching the team itself.
www.myspace.com/cynemamusic.com
by Cynema the Band on Mar 31, 2009 6:40 AM PDT up reply actions
I had forgotten about Garry St. Jean and
these days I always associate him with the ruination of the dubs. It’s amazing how someone as incompetent (in my view) could be given that much power in the NBA. Even more incredible to me is that the Warriors rehired him to be their GM after he had spent 4 years with the Warriors as an assistant for Don Nelson. And even moreastonishing is that St. Jean had the 2nd longest tenure after Rick Adelman, coaching 395 games and posting a 403% winning record during the regular season for the Kings, which these days looks pretty dang good. He did have an uncanny ability to turn red and furious.d, you are correct, Eddie Jordan, one of his assistants was appointed as coach after St. Jean was fired . I remember St. jean as probably the nicest guy the Kings ever had as coach.
"We are in the business of kicking butt and business is very, very good." - Charles Barkley
I am all for it!
After a year with Mike Fratello this roster will appreciate the next coach no matter who he is.
WOW
Slammed by people (jerks), shutting this thread, Dick Motta…well excuse me.
Didn’t mean to offend the professional fans, the real Kings brain trust, the exclusive StR reporters.
I guess I don’t truly understand the difference between you people’s all-worthy fanposts and an admittedly silly post that should be a…..f a n s h o t.
I don’t think I understand this forum either (or atleast these guys; ed, dookey, Bj, bignerd). I routinely scoff and laugh at the ideas and viewpoints on StR, but would never attack someone over something so trivial. It’s a blog….about a game.
Get a life. One where you can try to be pleasant.
by busybe on Mar 30, 2009 8:44 PM PDT reply actions 7 recs
I think this is my 5th post on this forum . . . ? Also, I like the idea for my stated reason. Fratello won’t last a year but will force the young roster to finally grow up.
We don't want a coach that won't last a year.
We need a coach that will last 5-10 years. To see this group from valley to mountain.
Are you crying??
THERE’S NO CRYING!
You might want to see about some padding for that skin, or learn to take the high road. What eduardo said wasn’t really all that harsh IMO, just advising you that this might have been better as a fanshot.
P.S. The “reply” button is your friend. © 2007 otis29
by otis29 on Mar 31, 2009 5:22 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Rec'd solely for the "c" thingy
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I am the stone that builder refused..I am the visual...The inspiration..That made lady sing the blues....I'm the spark that makes your idea bright.....The same spark that lights the dark....So that you can know your left from your right...I am the ballot in your box....The bullet in your gun...The inner glow that lets you know...To call your brother son....The story that just begun...The promise of what's to come...And I'm 'a remain a soldier till the war is won....
That's from that movie right? "There's no crying in baseball..."
Not crying. Just attacking back. Maybe just more civil than some are used to (high road).
Not harsh, huh? Advising? That’s some pretty rude advise…expect to get slammed.
Might have been better as a FanShot? Might? No, it was… expect to have the post shut down.
I’m still waiting to hear if eduardo likes Fratello as the next King’s coach.
Not a big fan
There’s better candidates out there. If it come down to Fratello and Natt, then I would probably pick the czar
Internet tough guy?
I’m sure it wasn’t really all that harsh, in your opinion. Because you’ve got really thick skin, and you’ve probably never cried in your life.
I cried multiple times this morning, once after I looked at my bank account, and once after I looked at my gmail account to find that nobody had responded to my craigslist escort services. But that’s just me. Let it be known that crying is forbidden on StR. This is a basketball blog. With lots of dudes. We’re all tough, ’specially the regs.
However, there’s a fine line between “advising” new members that may not know better, and just being a dickhead. Popular sentiment regarding busybe’s response (as evidenced by the color of busybe’s comment), does not support your opinion. Be forewarned: I am a member of StR Groupthink mentality. The green just makes me giddy with Groupthink.
AK47, SN13, B52, and K9. One guns, Another runs, He fits, while it licks.
by CAB on Apr 1, 2009 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Reread what eduardo said
Then tell me where he was being a “dickhead”. In fact, I’d say busybe’s response was way more snide and attacking than eduardo’s, which came off (in my mind) as an effort to inform a relatively new member of what was probably in store for him.
Now, if that “dickhead” was reserved for me, I’ll plead guilty. I doubt you are presenting any new information to StR by saying so, however. :)
He probably wasn't being
a dickhead in the traditional StR sense. Curt and direct is probably a more accurate description. There are plenty of times when people are curt, direct, and a dickhead on here. I really don’t find these to be out of place, or inappropriate.
Being direct, and curt to a newer members with which you don’t have a previous history of dialogue with, is a dickhead move imo. The regulars are certainly exempt from such pleasantries, because if Pookey started writing like I did here, I’d probably throw up.
Bé foréwarned: I am a mémbér of StR Groupthink mentality. The gréén just makés mé giddy with Groupthink.
I find this exchange to be very on-point:
The Wolf: Get it straight, Buster. I’m not here to say “please”. I’m here to tell you what to do. And if self-preservation is an instinct you possess, you better fucking do it and do it quick. I’m here to help. If my help’s not appreciated, lots of luck, gentlemen.
Jules: No no, Mr. Wolfe, it’s not like that. Your help is definitely appreciated.
Vincent: Look, Mr. Wolfe, I respect you. I just don’t like people barking orders at me, that’s all.
The Wolf: If I’m curt with you, it’s because time is a factor. I think fast, I talk fast, and I need you two guys to act fast if you want to get out of this. So pretty please, with sugar on top, clean the fucking car.
"It's shyte being Scottish. We're the lowest of the low. The scum of the fuckin' Earth. The most wretched, miserable, servile, pathetic, trash that was ever shat into civilization. Some people hate the English. I don't. They're just wankers. We, on the other hand, are colonized by Wankers -- Can't even find a decent culture to be colonized by . . . It's a shyte state of affairs to be in...and all the fresh air in the world won't make any fuckin' difference!"
by PhutureKings on Apr 1, 2009 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
Excellent Parallel
Especially if Eduardo is press for time.
Bé foréwarnéd: I am a mémbér of StR Groupthink méntality.
by CAB on Apr 1, 2009 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Wow....
obvously I have some fans here. First of all let me say I was just trying to make a funny situation before someone would’ve ACTUALLY come in here and curse busye out. If you’ve been around her for a while, you know that happens. I wasn’t predicting thie thread being closed to be a dick, I did it because that’s what has happened in the past. Most times, when a post is not in the right place, Ziller tells the author to move it and then deletes it. I thought this was going to be the same thing, obviously I was wrong, which is fine. I’m a pretty chill dude so I got no reason to antagonize no one here…
Busybe was the one that came back at some of us because he felt attacked. Yes, this is just a blog, but like everything, there’s rules and you should respect them. It’s really not that hard. It is annoying when people come in here without reading them and kinda disrupt things. I know it’s not that big of a deal, but if I read the rules and understood how everything worked here before I posted for the first time, why can’t you?? It’s really that simple.
By the way, thanks Otis for giving me a hand here….
Quite fair
I’m assuming busybe hasn’t posted too many fanshots/fanposts. So he probably takes the reactions he receives seriously. I do see your point. My take: a mistunderstanding between the vets and rookies.
Bé foréwarnéd: I am a mémbér of StR Groupthink méntality.
Watch out, eduardo
a mistunderstanding between the vets and rookies
busybe is probably plotting to mess with your ride.
Coming to you live from the land of interim coaches.
by LeaguePassAddict on Apr 2, 2009 7:05 AM PDT up reply actions
or how well you like dog food
"We are in the business of kicking butt and business is very, very good." - Charles Barkley
yeah busybe
next time you shoot someone in the face make a fanpost that’s 40% opinion 60% quote, don’t get defensive when people dismiss it completely.
We visit StR every day. Clearly our time is of the utmost value.
Hey holmes
Check this out: http://www.sactownroyalty.com/guide/welcome
It’s a link that shows up when you first register. It gives you the ins and outs.
People get frustrated when someone shows up and neglects to figure out what they are doing before they decide to do it. Some get a little too frustrated, and that will stop. But understand: a lot of these folks have been here forever, and follow the style rules. It’s not difficult to figure out, you know?
Thanks TZ
But the fanpost instructions say “if you have something to say about a trade, a game, A COACH or last night’s lousy lineup, take a few moments and express your thoughts in a FanPost.”
I had something to say (Fratello’s thrown his name in the ring, he’s a veteran coach more successful than some-Eddie Jordan), so I expressed my thoughts (he’s too defensive minded, slow-it-down), what’d I do wrong?
When “other blog members can respond to it”, the first response was I was going to get slammed and you’d probably shut this thread. You didn’t shut this thread. In fact there were some normal, non-righteous replies. But you need to tell me how I need to figure out what I am doing and tell me about these style rules before I frustrate (so sorry to the easily frustrated) the righteous ones.
you did reformat your post
It’s much better now. You can see that there is very little of your “thoughts” in there and a lot of “quote”. That’s why it might be better as a FanShot – which is for links and quotes. A FanPost is supposed to be more for original ideas.
But the way you have it formatted now, it probably wouldn’t have drawn any criticism, or not much.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Mar 31, 2009 10:50 PM PDT up reply actions
If I didn't come to enough of a conclusion
My complete thought would be..if the King’s can get a relatively successful, veteran coach, not in high demand, on a good contract to garner instant respect, teach the game with a focused plan, especially defense, increase the win totals, reach the playoffs, have experience coaching playoff basketball, and win a championship…I’d be happy.
Oh by the way, thanks Kfan.
Hey Kfan, how do I go back and add this to that last entry?
Is Mike Fratello that coach? Probably not.
I wonder what eduardo thinks.
If by last entry you mean your comment
you can’t. No option to edit comments.
Ball movement ... is like jogging for most people: They do it occasionally, and it makes them happy. Then they go back to not doing it. - Henry Abbott
by Kfan in Korea on Apr 1, 2009 2:43 AM PDT up reply actions
well excuuuuuuuuse me.
didn’t mean to be rude and I’m sorry you took it that way.
"We are in the business of kicking butt and business is very, very good." - Charles Barkley
No offense taken
Your response was just….a clever response, funny not rude.
I don't want Fratello
but if he’s throwing his hat in the ring I don’t see why he couldn’t be part of the discussion here. He’d probably get dismissed pretty quickly by a lot of people, but he is a veteran coach with a pretty good track record. That at least warrants some consideration, in my opinion. Hell, if Natt is being discussed for head coach next year then you really can’t rule anyone out.
Fratello just doesn’t look like a good fit for this franchise right now though.
Kings fan in OKC
I think we were a little harsh on BB
His first post
but I don’t want Fratello either
(remember my disclaimer a few days ago about not knowing shit about coaches)
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
Aye, as the kids at McCovey Chronicles like to say
“Do not want”.
And if what was said in this thread got busybe so pissed off, I weep for his future! Those “attacks” would be considered pretty tame at the Hello Kitty board.
fellow mccoven..
reporting for duty sir!!!!
www.myspace.com/cynemamusic.com
by Cynema the Band on Mar 31, 2009 6:41 AM PDT up reply actions
Two things re: Fratello
1. He will run the slowest, most controlled offense in the league. I like to see Martin and Thompson (and one of Griffin/Rubio/Evans) run.
2. He uses a massive rotation. We have a solid front six, and we wish Natt would play Greene more. But do you really want the equivalent of next season’s Booth/Solomon/Simmons getting BIG minutes every game, at the expense of Hawes/Martin/Thompson?
hey ziller
what’s wrong with a 28-25 halftime score?
www.myspace.com/cynemamusic.com
by Cynema the Band on Mar 31, 2009 6:42 AM PDT up reply actions
While I agree that
Fratello does run a SLOW offense, However, he and Hubie Brown took Jason Williams, Bonzi Wells, Pau Gasol and a few other decent type starters/role players (who were defensive minded Stromile Swift/Battier/Posey) to the playoffs.
Not saying that he should be the coach for the next 10 years but if we signed him on the cheap to right the ship I do not see the problem, it would probably settle the revolving door at head coach for 3 years or so and then we make another change to get us to the “mountaintop”.
However, if we add a Rubio/Griffin type player I want to see this team MOVE up and down the court.
Blessings.Love.Peace
by lifestyleforthesellout on Mar 31, 2009 10:11 AM PDT up reply actions
2.
Quickly scanning basketball-reference, it doesn’t look like the Czar’s ever failed to get his top three players at least 30 mpg each (except in 2006-2007, when Chucky Atkins was Memphis’s third best player and Fratello got fired after 30 games).
It seems like the deeper rotation minutes would come at the expense of Beno, Garcia, Nocioni.
The Coaching Question
I think a lot of us are struggling to accept the (apparently) prevailing opinion around here that Eddie Jordan should be the next head coach of the Kings. Can anyone link to a (relatively) comprehensive case for Eddie Jordan? Has one been written here, or on a related site? I guess I’d like these questions answered:
- What reason do we have to believe that he would be able to achieve more in Sacramento than he did in Washington (.468 winning %, 8-18 playoff record)?
- How does Jordan’s history with the Kings make him a better candidate given: a) the Kings were not good during his tenure as an Assistant and Head Coach (1992-1998). b) the Maloofs did not have a controlling interest at the time. c) Pete Carrill hadn’t yet been hired by the time that Jordan was fired.
- What other factors contribute to the argument in his favor?
I agree that hiring an established coach with a strong system is necessary to lend stability to the young talent-base anchoring this struggling franchise. But, objectively, it seems that several currently-unemployed coaches have established their own systems more successfully in the NBA than has Jordan.
Sudden Realization...
I think I have this whole coaching search thing figured out…but first, a few points:
1) Given his knowledge/record/etc., I think the Czar at least deserves SOME consideration (even if it only lasts for all of 30 seconds).
2) Why struggle over Eddie Jordan as a leading candidate. It does seem like a good fit.
Ok, so here is my proposal for selecting our new head coach (in 4 easy steps):
1) The Kings organization go to Pete Carill.
2) The organization then asks Mr. Carill who HE thinks should be the next head coach.
3) Mr. Carill answers the question.
4) The organization seeks out identified coach and acquires his services.
Viola! Done deal.
Is there any reason this is NOT a solid plan?
"It's shyte being Scottish. We're the lowest of the low. The scum of the fuckin' Earth. The most wretched, miserable, servile, pathetic, trash that was ever shat into civilization. Some people hate the English. I don't. They're just wankers. We, on the other hand, are colonized by Wankers -- Can't even find a decent culture to be colonized by . . . It's a shyte state of affairs to be in...and all the fresh air in the world won't make any fuckin' difference!"
I don't get it
I like Carill as much as the next guy, but geez. The deification of this guy mystifies me.
He's our Buddy Ryan, our Tex Winter
the architect behind the man. The secret weapon.
Just go ‘uh huh’ when it comes up and move on.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Mar 31, 2009 4:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Mike Fratello is the answer
… to the question “What team would be more boring to watch than the one coached by Jeff Van Gundy”?
by hozr on Mar 31, 2009 4:38 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I think that
watching a disheartened loser is boring, and we should consider every reasonable model for improvement.
I seriously doubt that Spurs fans minded that their teams were perceived as slow and boring while they were hoisting championship banners.
I think
that once Fratello is measured without shoes, it will be determined that he is too short to be our coach.
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
by section214 on Mar 31, 2009 10:34 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
rec'd for
humor.
hahaha
Blessings.Love.Peace
by lifestyleforthesellout on Apr 1, 2009 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions
do we really need him to take off his munchkin shoes to prove that?
www.myspace.com/cynemamusic.com
by Cynema the Band on Apr 1, 2009 2:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Then we wouldn't be able to tell where was by the sounds of the bells!
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Apr 1, 2009 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Where 'he' was (sigh) by the sound of the bells.......
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Apr 1, 2009 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions
what is scaring me is that my mind is inserting the words your keyboard is missing
"We are in the business of kicking butt and business is very, very good." - Charles Barkley
See, but he really doesn’t have the vertical needed to compensate for that height loss either – I mean, what’s he supposed to do? use a step-ladder to get in Hawes face?
And really, do you want a coach with that limited of a wingspan? How’s he supposed to pull players away from scuffles, point Beno to the bench, or put his finger in a referees face? I mean honestly:
Weak.
Though, truthfully it’s all about the shoes. And I think Fratello can wear some great shoes. Look at that tie!
Donte? Donte'! Donté?!?!
'spect da 'xtra E'
I swear to God -
That’s a rubber mask, and underneath lies…
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
That Is Right
Mussleman was the lead assistant to Fratello while he was leading the Grizz.
Blessings.Love.Peace
by lifestyleforthesellout on Apr 1, 2009 3:43 PM PDT up reply actions
But...
Has anyone ever seen them in the same place at the same time since then?
Coming to you live from the land of interim coaches.
by LeaguePassAddict on Apr 1, 2009 5:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Musselman has a creepy smile in that picture
"Greed is the inventor of injustice as well as the current enforcer." - Julian Casablancas
dude does someone work at mens warehouse? where did you get that shot? are his teeth bonded?
Draft Balls Be Kind, The Kings Need Blake! The Padres need Strausberg and the Chargers need Mauluaga!
by bringbackbuddytrees on Apr 1, 2009 9:53 PM PDT reply actions
I think...
This picture was taken at a suit fitting…you know, the one he wore to court for his DUI?
Oh snap!!! That’s right…I went there.
"It's shyte being Scottish. We're the lowest of the low. The scum of the fuckin' Earth. The most wretched, miserable, servile, pathetic, trash that was ever shat into civilization. Some people hate the English. I don't. They're just wankers. We, on the other hand, are colonized by Wankers -- Can't even find a decent culture to be colonized by . . . It's a shyte state of affairs to be in...and all the fresh air in the world won't make any fuckin' difference!"
You went there...
…by mentioning Muss’s DUI? Umm, okay.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I am the stone that builder refused..I am the visual...The inspiration..That made lady sing the blues....I'm the spark that makes your idea bright.....The same spark that lights the dark....So that you can know your left from your right...I am the ballot in your box....The bullet in your gun...The inner glow that lets you know...To call your brother son....The story that just begun...The promise of what's to come...And I'm 'a remain a soldier till the war is won....
My Understanding of "Going There"
Is mentioning embarrassing and/or socially-awkward personal subjects. I believe this counts. Do you have a different definition?
"It's shyte being Scottish. We're the lowest of the low. The scum of the fuckin' Earth. The most wretched, miserable, servile, pathetic, trash that was ever shat into civilization. Some people hate the English. I don't. They're just wankers. We, on the other hand, are colonized by Wankers -- Can't even find a decent culture to be colonized by . . . It's a shyte state of affairs to be in...and all the fresh air in the world won't make any fuckin' difference!"
by PhutureKings on Apr 3, 2009 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions
Yes
He was embarrassed. But, if you ask me, finding out that he couldn’t figure out how to interact with his own players as the head coach was far more embarrassing than a mistake that millions of americans do daily.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I am the stone that builder refused..I am the visual...The inspiration..That made lady sing the blues....I'm the spark that makes your idea bright.....The same spark that lights the dark....So that you can know your left from your right...I am the ballot in your box....The bullet in your gun...The inner glow that lets you know...To call your brother son....The story that just begun...The promise of what's to come...And I'm 'a remain a soldier till the war is won....
I didn't ask you...
…that’s right, I went there.
Just kidding, Pook…you know I respect your 2 cents! I saw the suit, the goofy grin, and just thought, “This is probably not what his smile looked like in court.” Besides, there’s plenty of shit to rip on Muss about. I didn’t know I was supposed to pick the greatest embarrassment.
"It's shyte being Scottish. We're the lowest of the low. The scum of the fuckin' Earth. The most wretched, miserable, servile, pathetic, trash that was ever shat into civilization. Some people hate the English. I don't. They're just wankers. We, on the other hand, are colonized by Wankers -- Can't even find a decent culture to be colonized by . . . It's a shyte state of affairs to be in...and all the fresh air in the world won't make any fuckin' difference!"
by PhutureKings on Apr 3, 2009 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions
We can agree
He’s a cheeseball who happens to be very rich.
No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I am the stone that builder refused..I am the visual...The inspiration..That made lady sing the blues....I'm the spark that makes your idea bright.....The same spark that lights the dark....So that you can know your left from your right...I am the ballot in your box....The bullet in your gun...The inner glow that lets you know...To call your brother son....The story that just begun...The promise of what's to come...And I'm 'a remain a soldier till the war is won....
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