WHO ARE WE?

by Bluejohn on Apr 29, 2009 3:58 PM PDT Comment 20 comments

This question came to mind as I read the comments in EX G's post "Evaluating Eddie's Experience". I was struck by Holmdel's quote from Bill Parcels "you are what you are" and started wondering;

WHO ARE WE?

One of the consistent observations about the Kings this past season was that they didn't play like a team, that they didn't trust each other and as soon as the first stress point came in a game we reverted to iso basketball, ball movement stopped, floor communication was minimal and the team never coalesced into something that was greater than it's parts.

Entering into the 09-10 season we have Beno, Kevin,Cisco, Donte',Nocs, JT and Spence. Depending on the draft maybe we resign Ike, maybe not. We will have 3 rookies and maybe a FA signing (hope not) or a player picked up in a trade (who is traded?). This is who we are.

When you look at this group of players what do you see? What is the area of commonality in their games? What do you see among these players that you would identify as a either a in common or complementary strength (s)? When you look at our core players do you see a group of men drafted,traded or signed specifically to play together for a common purpose?

This is what a new coach will see coming in. Obviously the draft and any players acquired or traded over the summer are going to be huge for us. I think G's post (good as always) is putting the cart before the horse. Before we discuss the new coach specifically I would like to hear what you think are the 3 - 5 priorities that you guys believe are necessary for the new coach to achieve?

Put another way: if the new coach is successful in implementing your most important issues and considering our core players what type of team do you see going into the 10-11 season?

(This is a FanPost from a member of the Sactown Royalty community. The views expressed come from the member, and not Sactown Royalty staff.)

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I am kinda on topic with this response

When looking at the core you have many areas of concern. First I will start with my premise that if you have 3 people on the court with the same flaws you have a bad team, 2 players and you’re probably not a good team….that being said lets start with perimeter defense,,,,you have 3 bad (Udrih,Greene and Martin) and 2 ok ( Garcia and Noc). The easiest way to fix that is move Udrih to the bench and pick up a point who can play some D (Rubio?). Hawes and Thompson are average rebounders….put a 3rd big in the rotation who is above average (Griffin?) and you have a good RB team , put in a Mikki Moore type and RB sucks…so a good RB big is required . Shooters are everywhere so you can afford a non shooter with no problem….I’ll stop rambling now but I think the best we can expect with this current group next year is average defense and above avg RBing with 2 solid pickups. Offense comes easy for this group, especially if Rubio is added to the mix, conversely Griffin fixes the Rbing and now I’ve looped back into my previous post. I’m going to go shower.

by ElRonToro on Apr 29, 2009 4:52 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I would agree with a lot of that

   Even one of our big men is essentially a ‘shooter’, at least at this point. We won’t fix all the problems in one off season, we have to pick one to concentrate on and try to address the other as best we can, hope that someone (23rd pick) exceeds our expectations.
   I’d mention again that the draft appears weak, very weak on big men and very deep at PG. When will we get another chance to solidify our frontcourt for years to come?
   The playoffs are again showing that teams who have interior players who can battle and take contact at the rim are more successful. I know thats not across the board as neither Boston nor Chicago really do it well right now and Dallas beat the aging and injured Spurs but the inside out game of Atlanta is schooling Miami and a less talented Houston team beats Portland whenever they really decide to play at the rim. I’d argue that dispite DHoward the 76rs have more players willing to ‘play’ hard at the basket.
  Thats just the way playoff basketball is officiated, contact and play at the rim is rewarded.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Apr 29, 2009 7:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Andre Miller and David Lee.

I think these guys are the complimentary players that can fill either the point guard void if the Kings can land the #1 or the frontcourt issue if the Kings land the #2. Very seldom does a team get one high draft pick and instantly improve but leaps and bounds. The 2010 FA lottery is a myth, I would prefer the Kings load up now with talent, use this and next years drafts to address the current player situations and hopefully be competitive in 2010-11. Miller is obviously a 2-3 year fix/transition while Lee would secure the front court along with Hawes and Thompson for the next decade.

To tie this back to the main idea behind this particular thread, I think that both Lee and Miller bring leadership and skill at need positions. Lee would probably cost the Kings the Houston pick to get rid of the RFA tag while Miller lives locally and might be had if the Kings can land Griffin to compliment. A new coach needs to implement a solid defensive identity but in order to take advantage of the current roster with the additions of either Rubio or Griffin the new coach needs to run a high octane running offense and focus on putting butts in the seats with a fun brand of b-ball.

A new coach needs to find leaders and cement roles for all 12 players, something that hasn’t happened since Adelman left. Adelman is successful because each man has a specific role and the guy behind him understands that role and is a competent replacement when injuries occur. This style of coaching not only gives a team continuity but it builds camaraderie, something this team is clearly lacking.

So…
1. Some sort of defense.
2. Uptempo offense.
3. Leaders.
4. Roles for all 12 players.
5. Build camaraderie.

Hot dogs, get your hot dogs.

by jjham15 on Apr 29, 2009 9:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I semi agree

David Lee would be a good fit RB wise….but none of the 4 bigs is an above average defender.
Miller would be ok short term but about 3-5 years ago he had 2 years in a row in the playofs of some of the worse late game PG decisions I’ve ever seen. I would prefer a young PG like Sessions with Udrih the backup

by ElRonToro on Apr 29, 2009 9:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sessions=Udrih=MLE talent

I prefer to wait for a star point, not toil with mediocrity because those two would make 12 million a year for the next 4 years and they aren’t worth that…not even close.

Hot dogs, get your hot dogs.

by jjham15 on Apr 29, 2009 10:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

It was a thought off the top of my head…its gone now

by ElRonToro on Apr 29, 2009 10:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I reluctantly concur

The sensible me says this is a great time to pick up a 3rd big man and set that position for a decade barring injury. It is harder to get bigs…I can name 10 damn good PGs (albeit some of them a little old)..but I can’t get to 10 damn good bigs.

by ElRonToro on Apr 29, 2009 7:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

What I see is the Phoenix Suns Light. Capable offensively, bleh defensively.

KMart, Bjax, Beno, Cisco, Hawes, Noce, JT and Greene all have to get better at defense. If KMart, BJax and Beno can make it harder for opposing guards to penetrate, JT, Hawes, Greene, Cisco and Noce won’t end up fouling guards or giving up dunks to the man they leave in favor of the penetrator.

Yes, the young big men have to learn to defend with their feet and not their hands but they aren’t as big offenders as the guards are.

Also, Noce has to turn his “help mode” off once in a while, as he often gets burned when his man can hit the outside jumper. Sometimes, the help is unnecessary. Cisco is probably our most polished defender at the wing but needs to get into defensive rebounding a bit more, since we don’t have a TD/Garnett/DHoward monster down there.

JT and Hawes seem to be eager defenders and there is no cure to foul trouble except playing through it and learning on the job. I expect better defensive games from both next. year.

I don’t see an LBJ or a Derrick Rose in this draft (sorry). Maybe an Elton Brand and an Andre Miller. Which means the team has to improve, because there is no savior in sight.

There can only be one Noce!

by NoceOne on Apr 29, 2009 8:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

That PHX formula

(which I think would have won a title if not for the suspensions) has to work perfectly, no room for error due to the lack of good D and interior scoring IMO. Very difficult to get through stretches when jumpshots aren’t falling. Though it IS possible to win that way, its even looser than the similar Princeton scheme. It does require a great PG (unlike Princeton) but has the problem of consistancy for a multi-year title run.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Apr 30, 2009 9:17 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Offensively & Defensively Points in the Paint

We have too many jump shooters & no one who can drive to the rim & finish. Unless a PG is capable of finishing at the rim, he will only be able to feed our jump shooters, and that won’t change the makeup of our offense. Too change our teams image, we need to get hi effecient shots down low, and that will set up the corner 3’s. Whether we get a PG or PF, we need to feed the ball down low. Play inside out, and not pass the ball around the arc until the shot clock counts down, and someone is forced to put up a long jumper.

Defense is still a team game. Most NBA teams still start their offensive sets with a screen or pick & roll. And, that means the players need to work together. People need to learn how to play defense, learn the help assignments, & play with effort. Effort isn’t a problem for our bigs. Hawes chased down players on breakaways and blocked their shot & stole the ball from the PG by running the court and coming up from behind. JT is nothing but effort. But, they’re still young with limited knowledge about defense, bring on the learning process. Beno is big enough and Martin is quick enough, to be good defenders. They’re not going to stop everyone, but if they know where the help is coming from they can force their man into the defensive help. It’s all about Team. Everyone can be beat man on man by someone.

"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom

by HighTops on Apr 29, 2009 11:02 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

Hawes improvement in defensive rotation over the course of the season was impressive….he was much quicker to the spot. Hopefully Thompson will show improvement next year also. With our weak perimeter pressure bigs must be able to rotate quickly.

by ElRonToro on Apr 29, 2009 11:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Without a SuperStar (not just a star)

in a wing spot (MJ, Kobe, LaBron), its almost impossible to be consistantly effective without a player who battles right at the rim. Even those guys’ teams struggle when jumpers stop falling. They’re often able to overcome it by ‘taking over the game’ though.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Apr 30, 2009 9:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

As for defense (sigh)

There’s a lot of work to do. Confidence in your teammates can be a big part of that. Some success will be necessary to build that confidence on a team that isn’t instinctively good defensively.
One player, one defender in your rotation can inspire a lot of lesser defenders to be more successful IMO. Look at KG in Boston.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Apr 30, 2009 9:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed....

Unfortunently, we dont have a Superstar OR a Star on the wing…However, I can with KMART on the wing if he developes his D, among other things…. Couple him with a stud low post player (Griffin?, JT) and a PG capable of penetrating (Rubio? Mills? Lawson? Jennings?) and I like our chances of developing that up-and-coming nucleus thats finally paying off for teams like Portland….

This Draft will be HUGE in finding out “Who we are”

by Hoops916 on Apr 30, 2009 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Where’s coolcat when you need him?

Donte? Donte'! Donté?!?!
'spect da 'xtra E'

by iashwash on Apr 30, 2009 2:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hush yo' mouth

Question: What kind of bear is best?

by otis29 on Apr 30, 2009 3:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

ON BJ's topic

The team has no idea ‘Who they Are’. Its a really big part of the problem, probably the reason we won 17 games instead of say, the 30 or so we should have won with this roster.
‘Getting it’ will require a coach who understands and wants to use the pieces GP provides and adapts game plans accordingly to maximize thier abilities.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
- lend the eye a terrible aspect
and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Apr 30, 2009 9:33 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs