Complete and utter nonsense

by R-Man on Jul 29, 2009 8:23 PM PDT Comment 55 comments

Do not continue reading if you hate purely hypothetical situations that have no real chance of becoming reality.

There. You've been warned. If you are still with me, consider this implausible scenario:

First, from the not so crazy file, we will suck balls next year, and be in the lottery. That much is grounded in reality. Then allow youself a flight of fancy, and consider the possibilites if the Kings were, in fact, to completely luck out and win the top spot in the lottery.

We now are in position to draft a potential superstar in John Wall. But wait, there's more...

John Wall plays point guard and so does Tyreke Evens. Neither is a particularly good outside shooter, so they don't necessarily fit well together. Too much yin, not enough yang. So what do you do?

Consider this: Trade Tyrke to Golden State for Anthony Randolph. Draft Wall. Sit back and enjoy.

Why Golden State would do it: Tyreke is the absolute perfect fit next to Monta Ellis. Ellis is a small 2 that can guard the point but has trouble gaurding 2s. Tyreke is a big 1 that can guard the 2. Much like when a Baron Davis was there, Ellis will thrive next to a big physical point. Also, GS is probably going to be in the lottery again. And, the upcoming lottery is stacked with power forwards that could replace AR.

Why Sacramento would do it: Randolph is an extremly athletic and skilled 3-4 combo. I think he has All Star talent, and I believe John Wall is the best player in the draft. By getting Randolph and Wall, we have 2 potential All Stars and some good complementary pieces in Hawes and JT.

Shield your eyes. This lineup would be almost to good to be true.

1- Wall
2-K. Martin
3-AR
4-JT
5-Hawes

(This is a FanPost from a member of the Sactown Royalty community. The views expressed come from the member, and not Sactown Royalty staff.)

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of course there is no certainty we get wall

by gedrosolan on Jul 29, 2009 11:25 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

There is also the possibility

that Anthony Randolph faces the wrath of Don Nelson again this season and remains a player with more flashes then actual substance while Tyreke scores close to 20 a game and establishes himself as “untouchable” for the Kings.

Consider also that Mr. Wall doesn’t play up to standards and other players enter the picture as better candidates for the top pick, not to mention that Anthony Randolph is all anyone here in the Bay is talking about when it comes to basketball. I’m sure that unless Nelson outright proclaims he doesn’t want him or if Randolph demands a trade he isn’t going anywhere. (Although both of those have a half-way decent chance of happening I will admit)

I Don’t really like the chances of either player switching teams for a long time.

by jstnblke41 on Jul 30, 2009 12:26 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

All I read is "we draft John Wall."

So, I’m on board.

I think realistically, we’re picking in the top 5 or 6 next year, maybe higher, I just don’t know how well so many new and young faces are going to gel. There’s a great deal of potential, but expecting it to be realized in the upcoming season is foolhardy. I want to see improvement, not just in win total, but in the play of the team. If this team ranks in the top 20 in the league for defense and only wins 20 games, I’ll consider it time well spent. I’m hoping for more, of course.

I covet John Wall like a fat kid covets cake, but as we know from the way ping-pong balls bounce, we don’t know shit til we know it. I suppose all I can say is that no matter where we draft, 1st or 12th, if Wall is available, I pick him every time.

Been at the Powerhouse drinking, so bite me.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.

by andy sims on Jul 30, 2009 12:27 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Mr. Simsachev

Tear Down This Wall!!!

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Jul 30, 2009 2:54 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs

Normally anything Ronald Reagan would not be rec'd....

But, in this case……I’ll make an exception.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Jul 30, 2009 3:03 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs

Rec'd

And Pookey’s response with it.

From the people who brought you Reggie Musselnatt.

by My Losing Season on Jul 30, 2009 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Don't hang me out to dry!

I’m only doing what you told me to do, boss!

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen.

by andy sims on Jul 30, 2009 9:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Anthony Randolph has a tiny pea head, therefore I don’t want to speculate about acquiring him.

I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken

by joeytothelimit on Jul 30, 2009 12:29 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Scott Howard-Cooper

and others think that Randolph will ultimately be a PF.

Given Reke’s size, strength and wingspan, I’m not convinced he doesn’t have small forward potential. He’s already bigger than Cisco (albeit one inch shorter). So he’d be a bit undersized but still long, strong and quick. In which case:

PG-Wall; SG-Martin; SF-Evans; PF-Thompson; C-Hawes

From the people who brought you Reggie Musselnatt.

by My Losing Season on Jul 30, 2009 12:52 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I've had the same thought

(sheesh – another SF?!)

As for John Wall, you draft him and figure it out later.
(droool)

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Jul 30, 2009 8:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, you could figure it out later

but I am figuring it out now because there is nothing else going on.

by R-Man on Jul 30, 2009 8:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The thing about Evans

is he could probably play every position but Center. He’s not lying when he tells people he doesn’t have a position, he’s a basketball player.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Jul 30, 2009 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

already a star at 4 positions

and hasn’t played a real minute yet

yes, a looooong summer

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Aug 5, 2009 11:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Rubio is doing razor adds

and he isn’t even on a team. Long summer, indeed.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Aug 6, 2009 7:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I concur with the title

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Jul 30, 2009 8:13 AM PDT reply actions 7 recs

I'm as excited as anyone else to see John Wall play

But let’s not annoint him King until we actually see him play some college ball, huh? This time last year, Rubio was the best point guard ever, and guaranteed to go #2. Evans? Not so much. I don’t even want to think about next year’s draft until the people we are talking about drafting have played someone tougher than high school kids and we’ve seen what our guys can do. It amazes me that you’re already drooling at the thought of trading one player for another player and drafting a third player that have done very, very little combined in actual NBA games.

"Shut up and Coach!"
Vfettke

by SavageBeast on Jul 30, 2009 10:31 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Just responding to myself

But I have a sneaking suspicion that by the end of this season you would be laughed off the board for suggesting trading Evans for AR.

"Shut up and Coach!"
Vfettke

by SavageBeast on Jul 30, 2009 10:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

We could just skip the step and do it now SB

But, maybe that’s my cynicism showing.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Jul 30, 2009 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm with you on that!

"Shut up and Coach!"
Vfettke

by SavageBeast on Jul 30, 2009 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Alright SavageBeast...

…you’re on. Gentleman’s bet. Meet back here in 9 months.

Sneaking suspicions aside, I am stating for the the record that no one will be laughing at Randolph at the season’s end. Which is not to say Tyreke won’t do well. I think he will, but AR is going to blow up this year.

by R-Man on Jul 30, 2009 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

but AR is going to blow up this year. ...

… Sean’s going to share his donuts?

by Mystic on Jul 30, 2009 10:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're on

"Shut up and Coach!"
Vfettke

by SavageBeast on Jul 31, 2009 9:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I suggest a Wall Moratorium

until the Kings lose 1 game next season..come on guys we’re undefeated.

by ElRonToro on Jul 30, 2009 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You've just lost all creditability when you said...

“Consider this: Trade Tyrke to Golden State for Anthony Randolph.” …Especially when Tyreke can play the 3. Trade off a potential superstar for just a solid starter, even before the season has started?? Are you out of your mind?

by CloudyEyes on Jul 30, 2009 8:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

C'mon Cloudy

First of all, I’m not in favor on trading tyreke for AR, and I dont see why either team would do it. I dont see a reason to go overboard on the guy for putting together a speculative post.

Having said that, Tyreke can play the 3 now? And I dont think you can say Tyreke is a potential superstar while Randolph is just a solid starter. By measure of both talent and accomplishment they have to be considered to be pretty similar right?

by DustyG on Jul 30, 2009 11:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

“Tyreke can play the 3 now?” Of course. In fact, I think the 3 is Tyreke’s natural position. Evans is 6’6", he seems built enough, he can certainly defend and his game is to slash to the basket. He has SF with great ball-handling skills written all over him.

As far as comparing talent and accomplishment in the NBA…ok, you got me on that one, but there’s a reason why Evans was drafted 4th (Probably #2 or even #1 on GP’s draft board). I’m hearing everywhere that Tyreke’s going to be great in the NBA. Even Dalt99’s player rankings say Tyreke’s going to have superstar potential, while Randolph was at 89. Don’t get me wrong, Randolph is going to be a good player in the league, but a sudden streak toward the last 10 games of the season wouldn’t convince me enough to trade off Evans, purely based on that.

by CloudyEyes on Jul 30, 2009 11:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He’s 6’5.25" in shoes, but he is strong (And I know he has long arms.). Sure he could play the 3 on offense, but he can’t guard a huge portion of 3’s. You think it’s his natural postition, so natural in fact that all the scouts and coaches that have been around him really havent ever mentioned him playing the 3 at all. Ol CloudyEyes just saw something that they all missed.

But hear what I was saying in my first reply to your post: I dont see why either team would do this because neither really knows what it has. Prospects are rarely traded for prospects. But to say that someone lost all credibility and to ask them if they are out of there mind is a little much, right. Especially when your rationale for calling them crazy is based on the fact that Reke is a natural 3.

by DustyG on Jul 31, 2009 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

“but he can’t guard a huge portion of 3’s” Really? What gave you that assertion? He has long arms and averaged like 2.5 steals his freshman year in college. What makes you think he can’t guard a 3?

“You think it’s his natural postition, so natural in fact that all the scouts and coaches that have been around him really havent ever mentioned him playing the 3 at all.”
Actually, he was labeled as a SG going into this draft. It’s not a completely new thing that SGs play the 2 and 3 spots in the NBA. There isn’t much difference between the two positions.

“Prospects are rarely traded for prospects.” Right. Why trade off a top 4 pick for another prospect that has yet to prove himself fully? I wouldn’t trade a pick like that off until at LEAST AR achieved Aldridge/Horford stats on a consistent basis. You think he can’t play the 3, R-Man thinks he can’t play along with John Wall, I think he can play with John Wall if need be and can play the 3 if he wanted to. Lets leave it at that.

by CloudyEyes on Jul 31, 2009 8:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’m trying to think of one 6’5" SF. They are few and far between, for sure. It’d sure make for a crazy mismatch.

I like your argument: Some scouts think of Reke as a 2. And some 2s can play the 3. Therefore, Reke is a natural 3. What a joke! Hey some 3s play the 4 spot. Tyreke is a PF! He has long arms and gets steals…he must be a Center!

by DustyG on Aug 1, 2009 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Average SF height is 6'7"

And Yahoo! has him listed at 6’6", I was going by that, too. Maybe he’ll grow half an inch, who knows?

“What a joke! Hey some 3s play the 4 spot. Tyreke is a PF! He has long arms and gets steals…he must be a Center!”

Now you’re putting words into my mouth and being a complete jackass.

by CloudyEyes on Aug 1, 2009 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I wasnt putting any words in your mouth. I was trying to get you to recognize your train of thought by ridiculing it. Tell me if your agrument was fundamentally different than I described: “Some scouts think of Reke as a 2. And some 2s can play the 3. Therefore, Reke is a natural 3.”

Hey, maybe you’re on to something, I dunno. Tyreke might be an unconventional 3. I hope he’s strong and gritty enough to guard 3s.

Also, my main reason for replying to your original post was to cal you out for overreacting (IMO) to R-Mans post. Please don’t overreact to mine by saying I’m being a jackass.

by DustyG on Aug 2, 2009 12:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Whatever dude

I described Tyreke as a natural 3 in terms of his style of play. I even had little examples of why, so you could read it. What does a 3 do? 3’s are usually mid-range shooters who typically are slashers, athletic, and can rebound. Tyreke does all of the above.

I never said Tyreke was a center. There is a lot more to playing a position than ONLY height. I hope you can realize this. You want train of thought? here’s yours. Tyreke is half an inch too short so he absolutely cannot play the 3. Forget everything else.

by CloudyEyes on Aug 2, 2009 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

There's not really a difference between a "natural 3" and a natural 2

other than who that player is best suited to guard. As far as their roles on offense are concerned, 2’s and 3’s are pretty much interchangeable. There are plenty of SF’s like Peja that like to hang out on the perimeter and shoot jumpers, and there are plenty of SG’s like D-Wade that are better at slashing and rebounding. Peja is a SF because he’s bigger and better suited to guard other SF’s (sort of), and D-Wade is a SG because he’s shorter and better suited to guard other SG’s.

It’s for that reason that Tyreke is a guard (I won’t start the argument about PG vs. SG). He’s only 6’5" and 220 pounds. At his size, he’ll have a much easier time defending other guards. If he can defend bigger SF’s, then that’ll be a bonus – it doesn’t make it his natural position.

by Charlieb on Aug 2, 2009 6:39 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs

Thank you for making a sane argument

Truly appreciated.

No mistakes in the tango, darling. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 2, 2009 10:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

All I’m going to say is 220 pounds is fairly big and a decent enough weight to guard small forwards, (since he’s at about the average weight for a SF), and his huge wingspan could more than compensate for being half an inch too short. He certainly possesses the lateral quickness as well.

There’s much more to NBA positions than only height, though. A prime example would be Charles Barkley. He was 6’5", but played Power Forward, Small Forward, and sometimes even Center. He more than made up for his height with muscular build and skill. I could name others, but I’ll just leave it at that.

by CloudyEyes on Aug 3, 2009 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Most SF's in the league today are taller than 6'5.75"

So I have no idea where you are getting this 1/2" thing from.

And you should have left it at that before you compared Tyreke to the round mound of rebound. Tyreke is nowhere near round enough to be mentioned in the same discussion as Sir Charles.

by Charlieb on Aug 3, 2009 5:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

How was I comparing Evans to Barkley?

I wasn’t. I was using an example of how someone, vastly undersized, can play a position. I wasn’t saying Evans = Barkley, in fact, no where close to that.

by CloudyEyes on Aug 3, 2009 8:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

ok.....

I was using an example of how someone, vastly undersized, can play a position.

Comparison; Definition: The act of comparing or the process of being compared; a statement or estimate of similarities and differences.

by Charlieb on Aug 4, 2009 4:38 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah? And how was I saying Evans and Barkley were similar? I wasn’t directly comparing the two, or, at least, it was not my intention of doing so.

Barkley overcame insane height differential with his strength and weight. Tyreke can possibly overcome his (much less) height differential with his 6’11" wingspan. If I was doing anything, I was justifying my point by using an extreme example. Tyreke’s case is no where close.

by CloudyEyes on Aug 4, 2009 3:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Some notable NBA SFs (combo GFs or just primarily SF) at 6’5" to 6’6" (Yahoo! listed heights):

Andre Iguodala – 6’6"
Vince Carter – 6’6"
Jason Richardson – 6’6"
Michael Redd – 6’6"
John Salmons – 6’6"
JR Smith – 6’6"
Josh Howard – 6’5"
Corey Maggette – 6’6"
Quentin Richardson – 6’6"
Kelenna Azubuike – 6’5"
Marquis Daniels – 6’6"
Anthony Morrow – 6’5"

by CloudyEyes on Aug 1, 2009 3:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, I lost all credibility...

…suggesting we trade the “potential superstar” who has yet to play a single NBA game.

Fact is, we don’t know who will turn out to be a superstar, but I am saying here that what I saw from Vegas made me think that Randolph is on his way.

by R-Man on Jul 30, 2009 9:41 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

In all fairness -

you suggested trading for a guy that couldn’t make 3rd team all rookie. Blame it on Nellie if you must, but that does not change that fact.

So, if you’re going by what Randolph did in his 2nd VSL, then wouldn’t Tyreke’s performance in his 1st VSL be just as impressive? And if you’re going to count that, then wouldn’t you want this year’s VSL Quincy Douby and last year’s VSL Donté Greene as well?

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Jul 30, 2009 9:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, I did make the suggestion...

…and it is a bit of a reach and impossible to support, but I plainly said as much in my original post.

The part that irked me is Cloudy claims I have “lost all credibility” for throwing this crazy idea out there and then, in the same breath, makes just as big of a reach by annointing Reke “superstar” status.

Lastly, I was impressed with Randolph at Vegas, but I was also impressed with his last month of the 08/09 season. If he turns out like Douby or Greene (and, yes, I did just put Greene in the same category as Douby, a bust), you have my permission to light me up whenever the mood strikes you. Heckle away, Captain. However, if AR breaks out, I get my credibility back.

by R-Man on Jul 30, 2009 10:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I wasn't the one that said you lost your credibility

But I was the one that said your title was appropriate. In fact, given the salient nature of most of your comments, I did a double-take when I saw that the post was from you.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Jul 30, 2009 11:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

From salient to salacious...

Not good. What can I say? Dog days of summer. I needed a little more banter. It’s tough to get excited about preseason schedules and basketball youth camps.

by R-Man on Jul 31, 2009 6:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

but don't forget that Summer League is only one part (very,very,small) of analysing a players game

and that both Spencer Douby and Marco Belinelli to mention both a King and a dub have both lit it up in Summer League only to contribute almost nothing in the regular season. I have no doubt that Anthony Randolph is to grow into a very good player but your proposal is so premature and you did give fair warning about hypothetical situations that I’m just going to chalk this up to the doldrums, the dog days of the basketball season have driven you mad.

"We are in the business of kicking butt and business is very, very good." - Charles Barkley

by Bluejohn on Jul 30, 2009 10:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Spencer Douby?

Isn’t he one of the Doobie Brothers?

From the people who brought you Reggie Musselnatt.

by My Losing Season on Jul 31, 2009 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

the original

but oh, how he tore it up in Vegas. I was going to say that’s what I get for posting after midnight, but shoot, I was only past 10. Must be the doldrums and drinking too much salt water from going no where fast.

"We are in the business of kicking butt and business is very, very good." - Charles Barkley

by Bluejohn on Aug 1, 2009 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fair enough

I was even on the draft Randolph bandwagon until he refused to workout with Sacramento last year during pre-draft workouts.

by CloudyEyes on Jul 31, 2009 12:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Rather have Reke

I compare John Wall to much the same of Brandon Jennings. Both are slender, highly athletic, can pass, and attach the basket. The one plus on Jennings is that he has a much more consistent jumper (And that’s no compliment to Jennings, just a comparison).

I love watching John Wall and Brandon Jennings play, but neither are going to be franchise players due to attitude. Reke is going to be Sacramento’s franchise player with a humble attitude and smooth persona. Wall and Jennings will both be on ESPN in the near future with attitude related issues. They’ve never been coached, and they’ve always run their own show.

by SugaB on Jul 31, 2009 1:26 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Not to change the subject or anything

But you probably have the single best profile image on this site.

And now back to our regularly scheduled comment thread.

From the people who brought you Reggie Musselnatt.

by My Losing Season on Jul 31, 2009 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wall reminds me of Wade...

…the way he attacks the rim. Don’t really see the Jennings comparison.

by R-Man on Jul 31, 2009 6:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Too early

Last year we would have been thrilled if we heard that Petrie drafted Holiday or Mullens. Those guys didn’t even make the lottery.

by sdfd on Jul 31, 2009 10:38 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

But

they still may turn out to be good players.

by DustyG on Aug 1, 2009 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

What 214 said...no disrespect.

Randolph is athletic and we all know that blowing up the competition in Summer League means absolutely nothing.

Tyreke will be a star…not necessarily a superstar (ie. Wade, Kobe, Shaq) but a star within a few seasons. I’m not trading him. And yes, I’m going off of my b-ball gut feeling and my magic 8-ball. His ‘superstar’ potential will be contingent on who he’s surrounded by and how successful the Kings are in the next 5 years. I’m thinking this incarnation of the Kings’ coaching staff will be the right combination of experience to teach our young players and help them evolve. Go Kings.

Sactown Royalty: 4,080 Fat Sean May jokes and counting...

by JETisKing on Aug 3, 2009 12:38 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs