Francisco Garcia, the Poor Man's Shane Battier

by clicc916 on Sep 4, 2009 4:19 PM PDT

With so many Francisco Garcia mentions in the past few days, I thought I'd contribute some FG analysis…

A thought occurred to me some time during the previous season when I picked up 'Cisco off the waiver wires for my fantasy team. He's a good source of three's, steals, and blocks (for a guard). Also a relative turnover machine (but we'll get to that in a bit). Hmmm. The year before that, I had Shane Battier who was also good for three's, steals, and the occasional block. Sweet. I had just picked up the new Shane Battier. That got me thinking—is 'Cisco really a poor man's Shane Battier?

Some quick stats:

Garcia's averages, per 36 minutes and his PER in his first four years in the NBA

Season	Age	FG%	3P%	FT%	ORB	DRB	TRB	AST	STL	BLK	TO	PF	PTS	PER
2005-06	24	.400	.285	.772	1.1	4.0	5.1	2.6	1.1	1.3	2.1	3.7	10.4	10.3
2006-07	25	.429	.356	.833	1.4	3.9	5.2	2.2	1.1	1.1	1.8	4.9	12.1	11.7
2007-08	26	.462	.391	.779	0.9	3.6	4.5	2.2	1.6	0.9	2.2	4.0	16.7	15.1
2008-09	27	.444	.398	.820	1.0	3.0	4.0	2.7	1.5	1.2	2.0	3.6	15.0	14.1
Career		.441	.368	.800	1.1	3.6	4.6	2.4	1.4	1.1	2.0	4.0	14.0	13.2

Battier's averages, per 36 minutes and his PER in his first four years in the NBA

Season	Age	FG%	3P%	FT%	ORB	DRB	TRB	AST	STL	BLK	TO	PF	PTS	PER
2001-02	23	.429	.373	.700	2.1	2.8	4.9	2.5	1.4	0.9	1.8	2.5	13.1	13.9
2002-03	24	.483	.398	.828	1.9	3.3	5.2	1.6	1.5	1.3	1.0	3.1	11.4	15.0
2003-04	25	.446	.349	.732	1.9	3.7	5.6	1.9	1.9	1.1	1.0	3.5	12.4	15.3
2004-05	26	.442	.395	.789	2.3	3.6	5.9	1.8	1.3	1.1	1.1	2.9	11.3	14.8
Career		.447	.388	.751	1.7	3.4	5.1	2.0	1.2	1.1	1.1	2.7	10.7	13.5

If we throw out both of their rookie years (adjusting to the NBA), many of their stats are similar. Garcia has a slight advantage dishing the ball, and consequently, turning over said ball. Battier is a slightly better rebounder, owing most of the statistical advantage to offensive rebounds. Both block and steal the ball at roughly the same rate. You'll notice that El Flaco gets 1.5 more fouls than Battier, over their 36-minutes-per-game adjusted averages. Garcia also scores slightly more, due to the fact that he takes and makes almost one more free-throw per game as opposed to Battier (I hope you'll excuse me for leaving out the FT attempts/makes stats but take my word for it).

Keeping in mind, these are extrapolated for 36 minutes (fourth time I mentioned this?), I'd say that statistically, Garcia is very similar to Battier. Things may be different if Garcia was actually made to play as many minutes as Battier (Shane played almost twice as many as 'Cisco in their first four years) but I don't expect anything other than three-point percentages, turnovers, and fouls to differ.

I don't know if you remember that Shane Battier was taken with the #6 pick by Memphis in 2001 and that Francisco Garcia was taken by our Kings at #23 in 2005. Considering that Battier's contract was about $7.1 million for the first four years versus Garcia's pay of about $4.7 million for the first four years, I feel Garcia was a relatively good pick (we'll leave David Lee [#30], Brandon Bass[#33], and Monta Ellis [#40] out of this).

Yes, I know we now have Garcia for 4 years and $23 million with a $7 million player option but I still feel he's worth the money.

[One last similarity-both Garcia and Battier led their respective college teams (Louisville and Duke) each year they were there. Battier got his title in 2001, but sadly, El Flaco only made it to the Final Four in 2005 before losing.]

(This is a FanPost from a member of the Sactown Royalty community. The views expressed come from the member, and not Sactown Royalty staff.)

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Comments

The problem with Battier is you can not evaluate his worth by looking at individual stats. Much of what he brings to the table is exceptional defense, both individual and team oriented. Offensively speaking, a comparison might be able to be made. Defensively, however, Battier is superior despite having similar block and steal stats.

Disclaimer: comments may have been made under the influence of alcohol. If the Kings start winning, this will probably change.

by Ball in Cup on Sep 4, 2009 6:30 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs

You saved me from having to post, good point

nice post clic. If Cisco had Battier’s basketball IQ and mental discipline it would be a fair point to make.

"We are in the business of kicking butt and business is very, very good." - Charles Barkley

by Bluejohn on Sep 5, 2009 12:05 PM PDT up reply actions

My thoughts as well

Never forget: I am a complete idiot

by Exhibit G on Sep 5, 2009 4:29 PM PDT up reply actions

I'd love for Garcia to be a poor man's Battier

A spot up shooter/ shut down defender would fir great with Evans/Martin.

But I don’t think they’re very similar players. Garcia likes to have the ball, and his defense is more energy and risks, while Battier waits on the side on offense, and plays smart D while avoiding fouls.

by DesertFox on Sep 4, 2009 7:02 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs

Nice breakdown

but the problem with a statistical comparison is the fact that Battier’s new nickname is the No Stats All Star. His stats don’t really show what he does really well. Defense is not measured very well by statistics. I think Garcia could be a Battier-type player, but I don’t really think he’s there. I’d love to see him become more focused on defense though

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by vfettke on Sep 4, 2009 9:55 PM PDT reply actions

Agreed with Vfettke

The problem with Battier is he takes the time to study how his opponents play, look at their tendencies. Defense is an art for him. And on offense, he hardly ever looks for his shot unless its the most efficient thing to do (like a corner three or a wide open layup), which is sort of the opposite of El Flaco, who shoots an abmormal amount of the most inefficient shots in the league (toe on the line threes).

Garcia is probably the best defender on the Kings right now, and he’s had several good crunch time defensive plays over the years, but I don’t think he’ll ever be All-NBA defensive team material. But he’s more than competent, and in a good system could thrive.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Sep 4, 2009 10:12 PM PDT up reply actions

And nice first post Clicc

It’s an oddity when a new guy comes on and actually presents a thought in a well-constructed manner.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Sep 4, 2009 10:13 PM PDT up reply actions

Keep in mind he is comparing their 1st four seasons, not Shane today vs. Cisco today.

Give FG a few more years under his belt and I wouldn’t be shocked to see him much closer to a Battier type player. Then again I wouldn’t count on it either.

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by kangsfan on Sep 5, 2009 3:46 PM PDT up reply actions

Not to tread old ground here but

(well OK lets do)

Aren’t some of you who are trumpeting that Battier is more valuable than his stats because of defensive prowness (artist?) also some who hated the idea of drafting a defensive specialist in Thabeet?

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Sep 10, 2009 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions

TROLBEEEEEEEEEET!

When you draft out of the lottery, a specialist is a good haul. When you draft top 5, you’re looking for a complete player.

Victory is tasty.

by iashwash on Sep 13, 2009 9:53 PM PDT up reply actions

I didn't want to draft Thabeet

because I have a feeling he’s going to get destroyed in the NBA by any big thats aggressive. He’ll be good at defending the rim from guards attacking the lane, but if I were the other team, I’d just feed it inside to my strongest player and just plow through him.

Father of the "Natt this!" movement and Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order.

by Aykis16 on Sep 14, 2009 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions