Analyzing DeMarcus and Hassan's Games with Advanced Stats
by Aykis16 on Jun 28, 2010 4:12 PM PDT
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PrintThis post is going to show you some of the Advanced Statistics of DeMarcus along with the statistics of some of the guys drafted in the past 5 years for comparison. The source for the statistics are from Ken Pomeroy's blog.
Defensive Rebound Rate (Percentage of Defensive Rebounds a player grabs):
DeMarcus Cousins - 25.1% Ranked 28th in NCAA
Hassan Whiteside - 24.2% Ranked 48th in NCAA.
Players drafted since 2005 with a better Defensive Rebound Rate:
2010: Cole Aldrich (25.7%), Greg Monroe (25.2%), Tiny Gallon (25.1%), Larry Sanders (24.8%), Damion James (24.5%), Jerome Jordan (24.3%), Ed Davis (24.2%)
2009: Blake Griffin (32.4%), DeJuan Blair (27.8%), Jon Brockman (25.7%),
2008: Michael Beasley (29.9%), Kevin Love (28.5%), Jason Thompson (27.8%), Mareese Speights (26.4%), Joey Dorsey (25.7%)
2007: Nick Fazekas (28.0%), Al Horford (27.1%), Jason Smith (26.5%), Aaron Grey (25.3%)
2006: Tyrus Thomas (26.4%), Leon Powe (24.6%), Paul Millsap (24.5%)
2005: Andrew Bogut (30.0%), David Lee (26.2%), Sean May (26.1%), Patrick O'Bryant (24.8%), Danny Granger (24.7%), Ronny Turiaf (24.4%)
Offensive Rebound Rate (Percentage of Offensive Rebounds a player grabs):
DeMarcus Cousins (19.6%) Ranked 2nd in NCAA.
Hassan Whiteside (11.7%) - Not ranked in the top 100 in NCAA, but 5th in Conference USA. Derrick Caracter at 11.8% is one spot higher.
2010: Nobody drafted, but Zoubek is one spot higher.
2009: DeJuan Blair (23.6%)
2008: Nobody drafted, but Kenneth Faried is one spot higher.
2007: Nobody drafted, but Kentrell Gransberry is one spot higher.
2006: Nobody drafted and Nobody period.
2005: Nobody drafted and Nobody period.
Obviously DeMarcus is an absolutely ridiculous Offensive Rebounder. Hassan compares favorably to Jason Thompson (11.2%), who has become an above average offensive rebounder in the NBA.
Block Percentage (Block percentage is the estimate of the percentage of opponent shots blocked by the player while he is on the floor):
Hassan Whiteside (18.8%) - Ranked 1st in the NCAA.
DeMarcus Cousins (7.5%) - Ranked 70th in NCAA. Derrick Favors at 60th with 7.9%.
2010: Nobody drafted and Nobody Period.
2009: Nobody drafted and Nobody Period. Hasheem Thabeet was the best shot blocker drafted, and had a Blk% of 11.94%.
2008: Nobody drafted, but Larry Sanders would be higher.
2007: Nobody drafted, but Mickell Gladness would be higher.
2006: Nobody drafted, but Shawn James would be higher. Former King Justin Williams was 2nd with 18.3%.
2005: Nobody drafted and Nobody period. Best shot blocker drated was Patrick O'Bryant and he only had 13.32%
Conclusion: Hassan is an incredibly skilled and gifted shot-blocker.
Offensive Rating (Points Produced Per 100 Possessions):
DeMarcus Cousins (113.1) - Qualified 9th in the Over 28% of possessions used category.
Hassan Whiteside (103.7) - Did not Qualify in the Top 100 in the Over 24% of possessions used category.
2010 (All players listed are in the Over 28% of possessions used): James Anderson (116.9)
2009: Marcus Thornton (118.2), Stephen Curry (117.8), Jodie Meeks (117.4), Blake Griffin (117.2), Eric Maynor (116.2), Nick Calathes (113.8)
2008: George Hill (125.4), Ryan Anderson (121.1), Michael Beasley (119.8), Courtney Lee (116.9)
2007: Nick Fazekas (125.4), Al Thornton (117.3), Kevin Durant (116.5), Sean Singletary (114.9), Rodney Stuckey (114.7), Carl Landry (114.2)
2006: J.J. Redick (120.2), Adam Morrison (120), Quincy Douby (115), Randy Foye (113.6)
2005: Travis Diener (126.6), Andrew Bogut (121.8), Danny Granger (119.9)
Percentage of Possessions Used:
DeMarcus Cousins (31.3%)
Hassan Whiteside (25.1%) - Not ranked in top 100 of NCAA, but 11th in Conference USA.
2010: Evan Turner (34.7%), Luke Harangody (32.2%)
2009: Stephen Curry (38.0%), Tyreke Evans (33.5%), Eric Maynor (33.0%), James Harden (32.7%), Blake Griffin (31.7%)
2008: Michael Beasley (33.5%), Brook Lopez (32.3%)
2007: Rodney Stuckey (34.3%), Kevin Durant (31.6%)
2006: J.J. Barea (38.1%), Quincy Douby (32.8%), Adam Morrison (32.4%), Leon Powe (31.5%)
2005: Nobody drafted, but 11 people higher.
Effective Field Goal% (takes into account that 3 pointers are worth 1 more point):
DeMarcus Cousins (56%) - Not in the Top 100 of NCAA, would rank 8th in SEC with only Patrick Patterson (60.7%) ahead of him of drafted players.
Hassan Whiteside (52.8%) - Not in the Top 100 of NCAA, ranks 16th in Conference USA with Elliott Williams (53.6%) and Jerome Jordan (54.9%) ahead of him of drafted players.
Fouls Drawn Per 40 Minutes:
DeMarcus Cousins (8.3) - FT% is 60.4%
Hassan Whiteside (6.0) - Not in top 100 of NCAA, ranks 5th in Conference USA with Elliott Williams (6.4) and Jerome Jordan (6.8) ahead of him of drafted players. FT% is 58.8%.
2010: Nobody.
2009: Nobody, but Blake Griffin came close with 8.
2008: Nobody drafted, but 2 players ahead.
2007: Nobody drafted, but 2 players ahead.
2006: Nobody drafted, but 3 players ahead.
2005: Website doesn't have the data.
Fouls Called Per 40 Minutes:
DeMarcus Cousins (5.5)
Hassan Whiteside (3.7)
Assist Rate:
DeMarcus Cousins (9.2%)
Hassan Whiteside (2.2%) - 9 assists on the year.
Turnover Rate:
DeMarcus Cousins (15.8%)
Hassan Whiteside (16.1%)
Conclusions:
DeMarcus is obviously a prolific rebounder, on both ends of the court. Especially on the offensive end. Offensive Rebounding is more than just luck, as really good rebounders actively go for the ball. Hassan is a decent rebounder on the defensive end, and with those long arms, you can expect him to get better as he gets stronger.
Where Hassan really shines though is blocking shots. Absolutely unreal how often he does it. DeMarcus isn't a prolific shot blocker, but he does it a good amount of the time, very similarly to one Derrick Favors, who is touted as a shot blocker. But DeMarcus's biggest problem on defense is fouls. He gets called for a high amount, (5.5 p/40), which is the real reason he was only able to average around 23 minutes. This definitely needs to improve in the NBA. Hassan does a much better job at avoiding foul trouble, getting called for only 3.7 per 40, which is amazing considering how many blocks he gets. The NBA will be a much more difficult place to get those blocks though, and he'll definitely need to bulk up to compete with the more physical big men.
On offense, DeMarcus is one of the most productive big men in a while. If you notice, a lot of those players with higher offensive ratings are guards that can stroke the 3. Only Blake Griffin, Carl Landry, and Michael Beasley are bigs that had a better Offensive Rating than DeMarcus, and only Beasley was a Freshman (and he also shot and made the 3 in college quite a bit). DeMarcus used a LOT of possessions on offense though, the most for his team which included John Wall, Patrick Patterson, and Eric Bledsoe. He definitely needs to become more efficient and learn to play a little better off the ball. Quite a few of the players with higher Possessions Used than him in years past were the only options on their team. DeMarcus obviously wasn't the only option on his team loaded with talent, so it either speaks to his ability to be dominant or that he looks to score a lot. I think its a bit of both, especially when you look at how many Fouls the man draws. 8.3 per 40 is a ridiculous number as you can tell by the historical data. Boogie is a foul magnet. He'll definitely have to increase his FT% because of this. 70% isn't out of the realm of possibility considering he possesses a quality mid-range jump shot.
Hassan needs the most work on the offensive end, as he's not very efficient, and as you can tell by his assists, once he gets the ball, he looks to score. Learning to pass the ball when scoring is not an option will help his efficiency and help him become more involved with the team.
All-in-all, the Kings got two big men who are dominant in some areas, and need work in others. It'll be a learning process, but what isn't.
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So, you're saying Cousins is almost as good as Quincy Douby?
"If you're going to lead the orchestra, you have to turn your back on the audience." -Geoff Petrie
by AnotherStupidSN on Jun 28, 2010 4:21 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
We can only hope.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
what ever happened to Quincy?
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Traded to Toronto last year
Waived by Toronto a few months later, now playing in Turkey.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
why is it that whenever players get sent to toronto in a trade they either are on the end of their careers/retire or leave the l
because they dont belong in the NBA? I.e hakeem, douby, rafeal aruajo? I cant remember anymore
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
I thought Araujo was sent from toronto to utah and then disappeared
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 5:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh damn, I forgot about that, but still Joey graham has kind of had the same ordeal, same thing with villanueva, and the most tragic one is shawn marion
and Jermaine O’neal, and nathan jawai and roy hibbert even tho he ver played with them lol, the list goes on
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Toronto is a big reason as to why marion sucks so much know, he did drugs in toronto; his voice has changed as has his personality the guy has transformed from all-star to bum in only two years; he hasnt had any significant injuries
people up there are allowed to do drugs b/c their laws are very lax
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
um, okay?
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions
Sorry, That is more of a personal thing, I'm sorry for um, "describing" to you this
Its just that marion was my favorite player for a while even though I was a laker fan, it makes me so teary-eyed, I’m doing it again, I’m just a sad mess do me a favor and don’t mind me because there ar tears in my eyes right now
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
well if you are going to accuse him of drugs
what drugs are you talking about
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd say marajuana b/c it is in canada but he could have had access to weed too.
I’m not a drug expert but marajuana seems like the likely candidate
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
So, you are guessing.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
Lol, as I said I'm not a drug expert but I know there is something behind that changed, slurred voice and those hideous eyes
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
I think you need to get out more...
this exchange is funny in a “Dana-Carvey-Church-Lady” way.
by BPaoliano on Jun 28, 2010 6:42 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
lol, I'm glad you find this so funny, but I personally can't stand watching one of my long-time favorite people transform to perennial all-star/possible HOF consideration to
a pathetic pile of sh*t
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Exactly how did you get to the decision it was weed? Prostitution is legal up there too.
Maybe it was all the free health care? Or the clear air? Everyone is so polite, maybe he lost his edge and took up needlepoint?
You ever done needlepoint, on weed?
Wait....Why is everybody clapping? Everyone around me is clapping.... I guess I should be clapping too... GO LAKERS!!! I hate living in So Cal
by 27freethrows on Jun 28, 2010 8:01 PM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
I bet he killed a hooker too
That’s not illegal there. Too bad they test for “hooker killing” during the season though. Unlike weed or marijuana.
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 8:09 PM PDT up reply actions
You ever killed a hooker...
…on weeeeed?
Wait....Why is everybody clapping? Everyone around me is clapping.... I guess I should be clapping too... GO LAKERS!!! I hate living in So Cal
by 27freethrows on Jun 28, 2010 8:12 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
You ever got free health care....
…on weeeeed?
Wait....Why is everybody clapping? Everyone around me is clapping.... I guess I should be clapping too... GO LAKERS!!! I hate living in So Cal
by 27freethrows on Jun 28, 2010 9:34 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
yes, and it was wonderful
especially the part about the doc writing a prescription for weed
Let us usher in the era of Reke DMC!
The Trifecta!
on weed
"So your a Yank? Thats ok, were all just people. People are all the same. But we like Canadians better." - Guy at the grocery store. "wow"
lol
You ever done needlepoint, on weed?
by TheFifthMookie on Jun 29, 2010 1:06 AM PDT up reply actions
In the Mariuana vs Weed controversey
I think we have all missed the Marion as HOF comment which is pretty funny as well
LaMarcus Aldridge is the most over rated and over paid player in NBA. Tyreke Evans will be better than Brandon Roy this year.
by KingsFanInPortland on Jun 29, 2010 11:01 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Hmmm
Someone needs to get to the bottom of this. Doratio Kane possibly?
LaMarcus Aldridge is the most over rated and over paid player in NBA. Tyreke Evans will be better than Brandon Roy this year.
by KingsFanInPortland on Jun 29, 2010 10:57 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
So it's either marijuana or weed...
hmmm
by BPaoliano on Jun 28, 2010 6:40 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
lol, I'm about 93% certain that Marion did marijuana; you see I've known marion for a long time and his season in dallas was not like him.
His attitude has changed, his speech has become more slurred, his eyes look like they are always red, he doesn’t look like the shawn marion that I know; judging by the differences in him the only plausible explanation is drugs; more or less I’m certain that b/c marijuana is so easy to ellicit in toronto
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
so you are assuming
that an nba player did drugs. well thanks for the report Mr.Stein
"I have missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I have lost almost 300 games. On 26 occasions I have been entrusted to take the game winning shot...and missed. And I have failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why... I succeed." Michael Jordan.
by Surprise Team on Jun 28, 2010 6:49 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm sorry if I cant take it if a player that i have loved for so many years be reduced to rubble just because of f*cking drugs
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
That is partly why I cant stand living in LA, the politics have F--ked this city up; there are drug stores available next to synagogues for the love of G-d
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Hey, Jews get sick too.
"If you're going to lead the orchestra, you have to turn your back on the audience." -Geoff Petrie
by AnotherStupidSN on Jun 28, 2010 7:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Almost every Jewish person I know, myself included, are anti-drugs
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
"is" anti-drugs..
What are you, high?
Wait....Why is everybody clapping? Everyone around me is clapping.... I guess I should be clapping too... GO LAKERS!!! I hate living in So Cal
by 27freethrows on Jun 28, 2010 8:03 PM PDT up reply actions
DRECK !!!
When I die, I want to go peacefully like my Grandfather did, in his sleep -- not screaming, like the passengers in his car.
by nothingbutnet on Jun 28, 2010 8:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Not even cough medicine?
Is this Tom Cruise?
"If you're going to lead the orchestra, you have to turn your back on the audience." -Geoff Petrie
by AnotherStupidSN on Jun 28, 2010 9:20 PM PDT up reply actions
I meant illegal drugs not meds, damn
You guys are real funny, lol,
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
thats a ridiculous assumption
"I have missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I have lost almost 300 games. On 26 occasions I have been entrusted to take the game winning shot...and missed. And I have failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why... I succeed." Michael Jordan.
by Surprise Team on Jun 28, 2010 7:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Someone needs to smoke out BKJ immediately
Let us usher in the era of Reke DMC!
by Shizzo on Jun 28, 2010 7:20 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hey, if you've seen what i've seen, everything is a possibility
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
wow
you know the guy? that’s awesome.
"And Solskjaer has won it!"
by 'tough as nails' spence on Jun 29, 2010 1:19 AM PDT up reply actions
I know Marijuana may seem harmless
But weed is no laughing matter
LaMarcus Aldridge is the most over rated and over paid player in NBA. Tyreke Evans will be better than Brandon Roy this year.
by KingsFanInPortland on Jun 29, 2010 4:49 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
So you're saying
he had access to marijuana AND weed…!? I always heard marijuana was a “gateway” drug, but he fell all the way to weed? Damn!
"he looks like he is going to take a bite out of a huge invisible sandwich..." - wallywagon11
by Sacto_J on Jun 28, 2010 7:46 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
wow
just wow. not a drug expert is an understatement. and a crying laker fan… way to have no facts and rag on a player
crying Laker fan? did I say that? I meant to say ex-laker fan
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Being a Laker fan is like getting herpes
It’s a terrible decision that will stick with you for the rest of your life. You can try to cover it up, but you can never get rid of it.
"If you're going to lead the orchestra, you have to turn your back on the audience." -Geoff Petrie
by AnotherStupidSN on Jun 29, 2010 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
This gave me a good laugh. Brought me back to junior high
I’d say marajuana b/c it is in canada but he could have had access to weed too.
I actually still remember, a girl I went to grade school with said the exact same phrase about someone else and we teased her all the time for it. Good times.
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 7:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Maybe a little research might have helped
on this one. The guys speech started to slur and now he’s smoking marajuana.
Really! I mean Really!
The legalization of maruajuana is on the ballet in California’s November election.
This may be the end of the Lakers Dominance to say nothing of the Kings, Clippers or Warriors
When I die, I want to go peacefully like my Grandfather did, in his sleep -- not screaming, like the passengers in his car.
by nothingbutnet on Jun 28, 2010 8:27 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
Oh no, not the ballet too!
I knew the legalization of marijuana was on the ballot, but I never knew they were trying to get it in the ballet!
Can you imagine all those guys in tights spinning around high? It will be crazy. Next thing you know, they will all be on weed doing those wild splits and stuff.
Yea
After living my life in Northern California where we only had Marijuana I visited Canada where they have weed too. If only I had known Marijuana let to weed I never woulda tried it and would never have spent years in and out of rehab. Damn you Canada!
LaMarcus Aldridge is the most over rated and over paid player in NBA. Tyreke Evans will be better than Brandon Roy this year.
by KingsFanInPortland on Jun 28, 2010 11:28 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Now I have tears in my eyes too....
from laughing….
"he looks like he is going to take a bite out of a huge invisible sandwich..." - wallywagon11
WAIT WAIT WAIT
Did he start this off by saying “even though i was a Laker” fan ….
Excuse my language.
by mbcarval on Jun 28, 2010 8:42 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
At the time I was a laker fan; I've watched marion since 2000 at which time I was a laker fan
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
No offense Bkj
But about three-quarters of the time, I don’t know what the f#ck you’re getting on about.
"Matt Cain's better at this than I've ever been at anything in my life. He's better at this than you'll ever be, at anything. Matt Cain has a gift. He has a gift, and when you acknowledge that, then maybe we will have something to talk about."
by otis29 on Jun 28, 2010 7:22 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
90% of the time, it works every time...
Wait....Why is everybody clapping? Everyone around me is clapping.... I guess I should be clapping too... GO LAKERS!!! I hate living in So Cal
by 27freethrows on Jun 28, 2010 8:02 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
Just cuz I brought this whole marion conspiracy? I'll agree, I'm most definetly not the brightest guy out there,
but seriously I’ve been here since May 31st, I don’t mind if you don’t undertand/agree with me, hell I don’t care if you hate me, but I was bringing up my own stupid theory; what else have you honestly heard me say that made you go who the f*ck is this guy?
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Wow, where did I say anything even remotely negative about you?
Imay be the most welcoming “old guy” around here. All I have done is made some pop culture movie quotes in reference to the subject being dicussed.
(anything)… On weeeed = Jon Stewart in “Half Baked”
“90% of the time, it works every time” is from Anchorman.
Honestly, I’ve got no problem with you. I may find your theory on weed affecting a players ability the exact same season he leaves a coach and team whom’s system made him overachieve laughable (hence the jokes), but I’m cool with you AND your opinion/thoughts.
Chill out brah. Cheers! :-)
Wait....Why is everybody clapping? Everyone around me is clapping.... I guess I should be clapping too... GO LAKERS!!! I hate living in So Cal
by 27freethrows on Jun 28, 2010 10:05 PM PDT up reply actions
Dammit!
60% of the time, it works every time.
Ironic.
Wait....Why is everybody clapping? Everyone around me is clapping.... I guess I should be clapping too... GO LAKERS!!! I hate living in So Cal
by 27freethrows on Jun 28, 2010 10:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Everyone is just havin fun
When you bring up funny Marijuana and weed references and talk about being a Laker/Shawn Marion fan you set yourself up a bit. But I don’t think anyone is being mean spirited
LaMarcus Aldridge is the most over rated and over paid player in NBA. Tyreke Evans will be better than Brandon Roy this year.
by KingsFanInPortland on Jun 28, 2010 11:35 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Sorry, when you bust out this kind of tripe
lol, I’m about 93% certain that Marion did marijuana; you see I’ve known marion for a long time and his season in dallas was not like him.
His attitude has changed, his speech has become more slurred, his eyes look like they are always red, he doesn’t look like the shawn marion that I know; judging by the differences in him the only plausible explanation is drugs; more or less I’m certain that b/c marijuana is so easy to ellicit in toronto
You deserve to get criticized.
"Matt Cain's better at this than I've ever been at anything in my life. He's better at this than you'll ever be, at anything. Matt Cain has a gift. He has a gift, and when you acknowledge that, then maybe we will have something to talk about."
I wasn't expecting more than half the posts in this thread
to be about Shawn Marion and Marijuana, I can tell you that.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
I thought half the threads were about Marion and Weed
huh i’ll have to go back and re-read it…..on weeeeed!
by Gilo424 on Jun 29, 2010 6:56 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Blunts!
Don't say stupid shit. You won’t be perceived as stupid. - pookeyguru
by Kfan in Korea on Jul 2, 2010 4:31 AM PDT up reply actions
Wow, the weed is responsible for Marion's decline?
And all this time I thought it was an athletic player that relied solely on athleticism getting old. That and a lack of Steve Nash.
Who knew that the weed and the marijuana would do such a thing.
I wonder if Steve Nash knows that weed does this. I wonder if him and Marion ever did the weed together. Hmmm, I think I want some chips now.
Actually, it all makes sense now. Hedo has been eating a lot of potato chips and is like 20-30 pounds heavier. It’s that Canadian weed. Hmmm, chips are good.
Fantasy sports author for Rototimes and Fanball. Northern California sports fanatic.
NBA stars that lost their careers to weed in Canada
Shawn Marion: As previously documented in this thread, Marion went from from All-Star in Phoenix to slurring, glassy-eyed bum in a mere 27 games in the Toronto/Sodom/Gomorrah Tri-city area. After Marion had successfully avoided marijuana for years at UNLV and Phoenix, the pressure to conform in Canada proved too great.
Chris Bosh: Went from short hair in college, to the dreadlocks in Canada, now short haired again to coincide with his free agency departure. I’m 93% sure that Lil Wayne INVENTED the dreadlocks to mean “I’m high on pot.”
Hakeem Olajuwon: from “The Dream Shake” in Houston to smoking shake in Toronto and out of the NBA in one year.
Vince Carter: For the Raptors he was unfocused and lacked aggression, obviously from marijuana use. But upon being traded to the Nets, Carter transformed into…er, well, I guess they got some pretty good dope in Jersey, too. You really have to fast forward to last year with the Magic to see…um…damn, I guess if you’re Vince Carter, you can even get weed in Florida!
by basketball galactica on Jun 29, 2010 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
this thread is epic
I think we should have a permanent marijuana and also weed thread. Involving Toronto of course
LaMarcus Aldridge is the most over rated and over paid player in NBA. Tyreke Evans will be better than Brandon Roy this year.
by KingsFanInPortland on Jun 29, 2010 12:27 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Don't forget about the Vancouver Grizzlies
That west coast Canadian kush was so damn strong that the entire franchise and their fans couldn’t stay afloat.
Let us usher in the era of Reke DMC!
Can't link in the subject line Kingme.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
Where do you get your statistics from?
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
...
Didn’t you read the Intro?
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
Ah, I missed it because it was minimized, but how are these statistics generated; like the percentages and per 100 possessions its interesting but it is also confusing
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Which ones are you confused by and I'll tell you how they're formulated.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
Nerdiest pickup line ever.
"If you're going to lead the orchestra, you have to turn your back on the audience." -Geoff Petrie
by AnotherStupidSN on Jun 28, 2010 4:32 PM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
my head hurts
F#ck Kobe Bryant.
F#ck Shaquille O’Neal
F#ck Phil Jackson
F#ck Rick Fox (twice)
F#ck Sasha Vujacic
F#ck Robert Horry
F#ck Derek Fisher
F#ck Dick Bavetta, Bob Delaney and Ted Bernhardt – I’m still waiting for them to have their jerseys retired at Staples.
F#ck Every Laker fan who comes to Arco Arena, wears his hat sideways and stands up and cheers with his arms out and his back to the floor whenever Kobe scores a basket.
Oh, and F#ck Jack Nicholson, Dyan Cannon, and that silver haired douchebag wearing the snakeskin boots.
Who’d I miss?
by B-RAD on Jun 28, 2010 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
lol at your sig, waiting see bavetta, delaney, and bernhardt's jerseys retired at staples center, lol
reced bcuz of tht awesome sig
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
okay, how do you factor per 100 possessions and assit rate; does assit rate mean what percent of the time he got an assit when he had the ball
(thanks for offering to help me out, I’m just not the brightest person)
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Points Per 100 Possessions is Points Scored * 100 / possessions
Assist Rate is how many assists the players produced when they had the ball.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
wow, how incredibly simple, thanks aykis
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
I should clarify assist rate
See how DMC’s is 9.2%? That meant that he created an assist about 9.2% of the time he had the ball.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
lol
LaMarcus Aldridge is the most over rated and over paid player in NBA. Tyreke Evans will be better than Brandon Roy this year.
by KingsFanInPortland on Jun 28, 2010 4:34 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Excellent analysis. Rec'd
But DeMarcus’s biggest problem on defense is fouls. He gets called for a high amount, (5.5 p/40), which is the real reason he was only able to average around 23 minutes.
Aha! So now we know the real reason he only played 23 minutes per game. It wasn’t his conditioning after all. It is going to be fun watching him get all those offensive rebounds.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
Perhaps his foul issues explain his conditioning
He couldn’t stay on court long enough to lose the love handles. :)
"Matt Cain's better at this than I've ever been at anything in my life. He's better at this than you'll ever be, at anything. Matt Cain has a gift. He has a gift, and when you acknowledge that, then maybe we will have something to talk about."
by otis29 on Jun 28, 2010 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Or the reverse.
Perhaps his bad conditioning led to him being fatigued and giving up stupid fouls.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
The possibilities are limitless!
"Matt Cain's better at this than I've ever been at anything in my life. He's better at this than you'll ever be, at anything. Matt Cain has a gift. He has a gift, and when you acknowledge that, then maybe we will have something to talk about."
His fouls led to his bad conditioning which led to more fouls which led to worse conditioning.
Don’t worry, I am gonna figure this out.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
by Ice_9ine on Jun 28, 2010 5:01 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I would also factor in the John Wall dance to this equation
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 5:33 PM PDT up reply actions
If not for the dance DMC would be 400lbs, but have better footwork.
On the plus side, for a head case, at least DMC doesn’t foul out because of Technicals. He earns his foul outs.
This.
Something tells me Cousins is gonna have to learn to a bit to get significant playing time for Westphal.
Namely, cut down on the fouls, and look for the open man.
The first might take some time, and fortunately he will be playing behind some pretty good guys in Landry and Dalembert and learning how not to foul in practices. The sooner he can limit his fouls, the more time he will get and the quicker he can develop into the beast we know he can be.
The second, finding the open man, should be easier in the NBA, actually, as spacing is better, although with the youth and lack of deep shooting on the Kings, I am not sure how much better. Hopefully Casspi, Beno, Cisco, and Donté can all help space the floor. Who knows? Maybe Tyreke will shoot over 30% from 3 as well?
Unless DMC is a remarkably quick learner (which he actually has proved to be over the college season) I would be surprised to see him start any games on a regular basis for the first half of the season. I am fully expecting Dalembert to be traded to a contending team in need of a big man by the deadline, especially if we are looking at the lottery record-wise. If that is the case, I am sure Cousins will be ready to step up by then. And by then, he will probably be in better shape than he ever has been.
This is going to be an interesting season. DeMarcus Cousins is no savior, and I think he has a lot to learn, but he will be a helluva fun rookie to watch, maybe more than even Tyreke last season.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
One thing that Westphal and Petrie made a point of
Is that DMC is a very underrated passer, especially out of the double team. If you look at some of his high school footage, he’s running breaks like a guard.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
Right on.
Dudes just need to make shots, then.
Hopefully Westphal can set his rotation so that Cousins can get used to the guys he is playing with. I am sure passing to Dalembert is a different sort of challenge than passing to Landry or Beno.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
DMC wanted to play the point when he got to kentucky, partly because he was dishing out ten assits per game in HS
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
I can't find his High School stat
But here’s what Rival.com had to say about DeMarcus in 2007:
An impressively physical presence, Cousins has the ability to dominate the interior. He can score in traffic and rebound in a crowd. Defensively, he is extremely difficult to score over. Not limited to being effective around the basket, Cousins can also operate on the perimeter. Perhaps his most underrated skill is his passing ability. Maturing emotionally is his biggest challenge in the development of his game.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
he had 27 ppg 18 rpg and 10 apg (somewhere in that ballpark)
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Would like to believe you
But would need to see proof.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
okay, I'll fish for the stats and report my findings back
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
These are amazing stats, if verified.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
I found a site on him but it says that the statistics are not available right now, so I'll check there to see if the statistics are put up, but I remember them talking about
Cousins being an extraordinary passer in HS and that the only verifiable stat i can say is the 10 assits; that was what the bulk of the draft preview was surrounding him
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
I found this:
During high school, DeMarcus Cousins averaged 24.1 points, 13.2 rebounds, 4.6 assists, 3.2 blocks and 5.1 steals per game his senior season. He earned the Parade and McDonald’s All-American honors in 2009 and was member of the 2009 USA Junior National Select Team.
Here is the link
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
I could have sworn it was ten assits, I'd do some more snooping around but I wouldnt know; there was a piece on DMC wanting to play pg when he got to kentucky
I dont know where I heard ten assits from, but I’m sure that they said that during the draft preview
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
I found this:
Cousins is a big PF who averaged 26 pts, 15 rebounds, 10 assists, 70% FG and 80% FT per game as a freshman in high school last year.
Don’t know if this was written in error.
Here is the link
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
Bless you for finding that
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
The stats are close to what you reported.
I am assuming this is where you got them.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
That is probably where I got them from, but I am nearly certain that the people doing the draft preview had access to those stats as well; as they reported the same info.
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
It is hard to judge a dude by high school stats
at the least, he was a willing passer on teams where he was by far the most talented person on the court.
At Kentucky, with that loaded team, he only averaged 1.6 assists per 40 minutes pace-adjusted.
Comparing that team with the Kings, I would say there are more options to pass to on the Kings out of the post. Wall and Bledsoe were not great outside shooters. I think Cousins can actually increase his assist % by playing pick and roll with Beno and passing out to Landry, Casspi, Greene, Cisco, and Beno.
I do think that his turnovers will be a problem, as there are certainly quicker, stronger players at his position in the NBA, as well as smarter, speedier guards than he has ever faced before.
Cousins dominated in high school, but he has a bit to go yet before he dominates the League. I could be wonderfully wrong, however.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
I think it will be awesome and extremely beneficial for him to go against players like Dalembert, JT, and even Whiteside, Brockman, and Landry in practice.
Patrick Patterson is good, but not as good as those guys.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
I would like to counter your quote with one from DraftExpress, albeit from early in the college season
Somewhat of a black hole once he receives the ball inside the paint, Cousins is not what you would call a willing passer, even if he is capable of finding the open man. He’s at his best right now acting as a finisher off cuts to the rim, offensive rebounds and transition opportunities, where he’s nearly automatic around the basket.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
This could be serious, adding Cousins the Blackhole to Landry the Blackhole
this may swallow up the entire universe.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
Or maybe we could enter a wormhole into a new dimension?
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
by Ice_9ine on Jun 28, 2010 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
You're on a roll today. Reke'd
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
if it means destroying the REDACTED
Then the destruction of our universe might not be all bad.
by Kevin Conroy on Jun 28, 2010 7:34 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
We might have to bring in Coach Norman Dale
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 29, 2010 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions
Is that DMC is a very underrated passer, especially out of the double team. If you look at some of his high school footage, he’s running breaks like a guard.
I must have seen the same highlights because I saw the ones where he was running the breaks like a guard. He is also a good a passer from the 3 point line. The only thing is I don’t recall seeing though was his ability to out of the double team from down in the post.
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 5:37 PM PDT up reply actions
er “pass out of the double team from down in the post.”
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions
That would be a pretty lame highlight reel
"If you're going to lead the orchestra, you have to turn your back on the audience." -Geoff Petrie
by AnotherStupidSN on Jun 28, 2010 7:24 PM PDT up reply actions
Assuming for the moment that Westphal wants to start Cousins -
Something tells me Cousins is gonna have to learn to a bit to get significant playing time for Westphal.
Cousins foul trouble, that may turn out to be the biggest factor limiting his time on the court.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
We have 5 guys who can play PF (Landry, JT, Brock, Whiteside and Cuz)
We have 2 real centers and JT who can play but is better at PF. So, it seems to me that Sam is the player we need to resign. Not at his current salary but maybe at the $5-7M per year range. And, there’s no guarantee that we can sign Landry any cheaper. He’s going to test the FA market and going to go to the highest bidder. The only bigs we’re guaranteed to have after this season are Cuz, JT, Whiteside. Of the current crop of bigs, the biggest need to add to that seems to be Sam and not Carl. Especially, if Carl loses his starters job to JT or Whiteside.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
Someone told me Jt was better playing the five rather than the four?
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
He fouls less often when he plays center.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
I thought JT
Played better at 5, but I don’t know if is because he is quicker and better shooter than most C or because he did seem to foul less. Or maybe that’s why he fouled less
LaMarcus Aldridge is the most over rated and over paid player in NBA. Tyreke Evans will be better than Brandon Roy this year.
by KingsFanInPortland on Jun 28, 2010 7:25 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
JT had an ORR of 10.8% and a DRR of 20.4%
Against centers who had played at least 30 games and averaged at least 25 mpg, JT was tied for 7th with Duncan and right behind Howard in the ORR category. In the DRR category he was tied with Bynum at 17th
Dalembert had a ORR of 13.0 which ranked him 3rd, and his 30.7 DRR ranked him 2nd among Centers.
82games.com has his PERS at center as 17.1 and at PF as 15.2. His opponents PERS while he was at center is 17.6 and at PF 21.2 With JT playing 21% of the PF minutes and 37% of the center minutes. By comparison, Dalembert played 53% of the center minutes and had a PERS of 19.0 while his opponent had 17.0.
Also, JT only averaged 6.6 ppg inside 10 ft which is slightly better then SD’s 6.0. So he doesn’t score well in the post, he’s a below average defensive rebounder. Defensively he seems to be better at Center, mostly because he seems very bad at PF. The reason he fouled more at PF is because he used to hands instead of his feet. I think he’s quick enough to move and stay infront of PFs but he just needs more work. With Centers he got backed down, and the only thing he could do is keep his hand up and make them shot over him, so therefore fewer fouls.
Other than ORR he doesn’t have standout stats as a center, but he’s still young and what his ceiling is at Center or PF is still to be determined. I fear that he’s not going to get that many minutes at Center this season, playing behind Sam and Cuz. So, I look to see him developing more PF skills this year.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
by HighTops on Jun 28, 2010 8:13 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
JR has said that JT could be better at the 5 than the 4.
Could, but does he have the moves of a 5 or a 4?
He scores below average for a center at the rim, and has only one back to the basket move in the paint. That move to his go to the left and hook with the right hand. He has almost no moves with his left hand. And, his best defensive move is to let the player back him down with his body and then JT move away and causes the player to travel.
As a 4 he can rebound, and shoot away from the basket. He was showing the ability to put the ball on the floor and get to the rim but didn’t finish well at all. JT isn’t going to beat out either Sam or Cuz at the center or Landry at PF, at least not right away. He’s all hustle and athleticism and just starting to develop NBA skills. The fact that so many people on this site felt that Hawes was better, should indicate where he’s at now.
Personally, I always felt that he doesn’t have the length or leaping ability to be a dominating rebounder as a center. At PF he can hold his own. So, while he could play some center, IMO his max ceiling is at the PF position.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
Nice assessment.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
Well, it doesn't sound so different than Sammy D, really.
He scores below average for a center at the rim, and has only one back to the basket move in the paint. That move to his go to the left and hook with the right hand. He has almost no moves with his left hand. And, his best defensive move is to let the player back him down with his body and then JT move away and causes the player to travel.
I am not disagreeing with you that he is better suited, at least physically, at power forward. But Jason is an interesting, and confusing player. I do recall an article from Ziller asking whether he was better suited for center, and I think it is an interesting discussion, at least. He is, in reality, a guard trapped in a big man’s body, and he may very well be getting used to his size once again, after it became such a huge advantage for him at a small college like Rider. I would not be surprised to see some very nice improvement this season, his 3rd in the league, especially with competition from both veterans and rookies alike on the team.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
Rider is the Key for JT, and experience is the Key for Sam
as a center in that conference he basicly was the biggest guy around and so didn’t have the need to develop NBA center skills. and, as you said he’s just entering his 3rd year so it’s very difficult to imagine to what level his skills will develop.
Sam because of his experience, doesn’t get into foul trouble but blocks more shots, and plays better defense and rebounds better in fewer mins. Now the question become, With Sam and DMC on the Kings will JT get the minutes he needs to become the defensive presence that Sam already is? IF JT can’t then can we really let Sam leave and hope that DMC and JT can fill the center needs.
Personally, I’d rather see Sam backup DMC.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
I think it's unlikely
that JT will beat out Landry. Landry is just too strong a scorer and should be a good fit with Dalembert.
I do think JT has a lot of value to the team in his ability to play both PF and C, but I think this draft and the crowd it has created up front is going to stymie his development to a degree. Without the drafting of Cousins and to a much lesser degree Whiteside, JT would have been the primary backup at both PF and C and would have played at least 30 minutes a game. That’s going to drop to the low 20s.
So basically you are going to trade some of a third-year emerging big man’s minutes to develop two rookies. Because of that, I doubt whether we will see JJ’s prognostications about JT becoming an 18 and 10 man come true this season.
I really don’t see Whiteside getting much PT, especially in the first half. He’s fifth or sixth on the big man depth chart at best. I don’t see him as any threat to Landry’s PT.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
by NewEraKings on Jun 28, 2010 10:08 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm loving the stats of our big guys...
..but let’s scratch the talk of condor, inspector gadget, etc….
I think it should be:
Hassan “Don’t call me Yinka Dare” Whiteside with that 2.2% assist rate ;-)
Ya, he will definitely need to change that.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
A bit off the topic
How reliable are college statistics? I know I’ve read blogs where people break down accuracy (or sometimes lack thereof) of NBA statistics. I’m curious to hear if there are any mayor gripes in the reporting of college statistics. For instance, does the K-State coach order his scorers table to try to inflate Beasley’s rebounding statistics because it helps his marquee’s player’s draft stock and thus helps the program. Chances are a number of his games aren’t televised so who’s going to know the scorekeeper gave him a few extra tip rebounds to pad his stat line.
Even if with this concern I don’t think this illegitimizes any of the stats above. If Cousins ranks #1 or #5 in a category you still get the point, he does it very well.
Rebounding is one of the most translatable things from college to the NBA
Most great rebounders in the NBA were great rebounders in college.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
Can rebounding statistics be inflated?
Wouldn’t that be an outtright lie?
I mean, an assist can be a little subjective, but rebound?
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
I would agree rebounds are harder to inflate than assists. I’ve often heard qualms about assists because they are subjective. However I do remember when Rodman was setting records along with gripes that he was getting the benefit of doubt on every tipped ball that was close to the hoop. In short, I have heard of this stuff going on.
As to my post above, I was just wondering if there is any statistic horse play known to go on in the college ranks.
Ah, I just wanted to know how. The tips would explain it.
I am sure certain team rebounds can sometimes be counted illegitimately to players as well.
The question is, in a slow paced, 35 second shot clock, college game, how many rebounds do you really think are being inflated?
There are actually more rebounds to get in the pro game. The pace is much faster, and you have 11 seconds less to get a shot off.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
That's why they used Rebound Rate rather than total Rebounds
Every missed shot by your opponents creates a defensive rebounding opportunity. Cuz got 25% of those opportunities ranking him 28th. Offensively he got 19.6% ranking him 2nd in the NCAA. This takes into account pace and shot clock length.
So, as long as his % is the same in the Pros, pace and shot clock won’t matter. Teams play at different paces in the NBA and the average team shot around 50% from the field. So, Cuz would get a defensive rebound 25% of half of the other teams possessions. 100 possessions, 50 misses, 25% or 50 equal 12.5 defensive rebounds per game. 90 possessions, 45 misses, 25% of 45 equal 11.25 defensive rebounds per game.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
That's assuming he rebounds at the same rate he did in college
and he remains on the floor for all 48 mins of course.
If he plays only half (24mins) then the numbers are halved (simple math), but add in the Orebs (assumption that he plays 24 mins of 100 possession game shooting 50% = 50miss/2 (half of full game) x0.188 (OReb rate) = 4.7 Orebs.
so in a 100 possession game DMC could get… 6.25 Dreb + 4.7 Oreb = 11 rpg.
That’s actually pretty damn good. I wonder what his shooting % was on putbacks. If he shot 60% off nearly 5 Orebs, he’d have 6 easy pts.
This.
Yes, I did say at the start of the 2nd paragraph that if the % is the same.
But, your point about the minutes is more accurate since he wasn’t going to be on the court for every missed shot.
But, my example wasn’t supposed to be a projection of what his future rebound totals would be. Only of how using Rebounding Rate compensates for Pace.
And your projections would be amazing. I think 18pts and 11rpg would certainly put him in the upper level of the ROY race.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
I understand rebound rate,
I was just really trying to understand how someone could claim Beasley or anyone’s rebounding #s were inflated.
I was pointing out that there are actually much less opportunities for rebounds in college, and thus fewer opportunities to ‘inflate’ rebounding per game statistics. Even if someone like Beasley got the benefit of the doubt on say, 2 rebounds a game, if he got the same amount of minutes in the League, he would probably get the same amount of rebounds credited to him without any undue inflation, since the pace is quicker and there are more opportunities per game.
So, even if some players are credited a rebound or 2 a game extra, as long as we are talking serious, big time rebounders, I don’t think it matters, they could actually still be expected to grab a comparable amount of boards. No?
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
by Ice_9ine on Jun 28, 2010 10:59 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
They say that when you play a faster style that inflates your rebounding I.E David Lee, but there is no way you can inflate rebounding numbers because you either know how, are athletic and can jump for it, hustle for a board and that is all of your option
of getting a board. I.E Blair and brock hustle, Amar’e’s athleticism can account for dozens of boards when he feels like he wants to get a double-double, or perhaps the better example would be a 6-7 marion, and shaq, who is huge and therefore knows how to rebound
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Offensive rebounding can be inflated
On a team that misses a lot of shots it is inflated. Especially for the guy that shoots at the rim but can’t quite put it in…
I didn't major in Common F-cking Sense, but ...
LOL
shaq, who is huge and therefore knows how to rebound
Shawn Bradley was really tall, and Oliver Miller was really big, but that didn’t help them become elite rebounders on the same, or even remotely close, to Shaq.
Give the Big [Redacted] some credit, he is a unique talent, and we will never see another player like him again.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
Sorry, that was meant to be a reply to Bkj.
"Seriously guys, why are they pissed off? Because of the rape... are you sure? That doesn't add up." - Daniel Tosh on Kobe Bryant
I meant to say is tall and knows how to rebound, but also yao is tall and the rebounds basically come to him; you have to be at least somewhat motivated and not a whimpy bitch like bradley; lets not forget that Eltob brand was 6'8 and rebounded very well
The players that have the drive know how to rebound, which is something that I forgot to add. Like Pau Gasol became driven after coming close to winning a championship; he was at amar’e’s level in terms of rebounding until this season where he averaged an incredible 11 rpg, so there isn’t much that can be done to inflate a rebound b/c when the ball clangs off the rim you either grab it in your hand or you let it slip simple as that, but assits can be inflated b/c it is more about what the person who istracking the assits thinks what an assit is. For example, Darren collison had a 20 assit game this season, but when you watch that game you would actually see that the fundamental ideal of what an assit is, is not present; the person tracking the assits was way more genrous in that collison passed the ball and the person who got it took more than “Just a few dribbles” and therefore should not have been assits but b/c the tracker had a different idea of what an assit is.was collison had about 7 or 8 more assits than he should have been credited.
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
I don't think Gasol "being driven after coming close to winning a championship" has anything to do with it.
Gasol has played nine years in the league and this past season was his best in terms of rebounding. However his second best was his last full year at Memphis.
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 28, 2010 8:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Gasol hit the gym after losing to the celtics in '08. Here in LA people were demanding him to buff and gasol shed the soft title in '09 by successfully guarding dwight howard in the finals.
His first 27 games in a laker uni were pretty underwhelming at 7.8 rpg and in two separate seasons in Memphis he averaged 7.3 rpg and 7.7 rpg; IMO, being blamed for the loss in ’08 has really affected Pau Gasol and is pretty much why he has mastered thae art of rebounding; that, being 7 ft tall, and playing with another 7 footer also helps
Draft Day 2009: I was in a Detroit theater about to watch the Hangover when my cousin texted me telling me who the Suns had drafted. I texted him back asking him who the F*ck that was. I shed a tear and told myself: The Suns are going to suck next year and Amar'e is going to be traded and my life ruined. 12 Months later to the day I am looking back at the Suns incredible playoff run to the Western Conference Finals.
Still, he rebounded better in 2006-2007 than he did in 2008-2009
Plus his 2008-2009 rebound rate was still in Amare territory.
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 29, 2010 9:07 AM PDT up reply actions
I saw 2 Shaq movies.
I don’t have to give him credit for nuthin’.
This.
by elfboy_ on Jun 28, 2010 7:31 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
you guys know how we couldnt wait for the draft....
well now i cant wait for the summer league and then training camp
"I have missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I have lost almost 300 games. On 26 occasions I have been entrusted to take the game winning shot...and missed. And I have failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why... I succeed." Michael Jordan.
DMC’s offensive rebounding stats excites me.
"Even the Swedes are getting mad."-Randy Hahn
"It's very cozy in the sin bin."-Randy Hahn
playing with john wall definitely helped
wall consistently was able to break his man down and get into the paint, scrambling the defense, and leaving opponents unable to really get a body on cousins.
because tyreke evans can replicate that kind of penetration, i expect demarcus to grab a lot of offensive rebounds.
"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
There are no offensive rebounds after Tyreke drives.
by caseycheesecake on Jun 29, 2010 12:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Certainly, not as many as when he shots 3's.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
Evans can get into the paint but very seldom dishes inside 10 ft.
Evans averaged about 2.2 assists per game inside 10 ft. He’s more likely to pick up his dribble, tuck the ball into his side and jab step to the rim than he is to pass. Now, maybe that’s because of who we had around the rim last year, but I think it is more about his skill set.
Evan only finishes at just under 60% at the rim or 5 for 8.4 attempts. Around the same rate as JT and Spencer while Landry finishes at around 70%. So, the safest way was not to try and pass but just score himself. Same rate as 2/3rds of the frontline and less likely to turnover the ball. But, I don’t see the one skill set that makes for a great playmaking PG. PG with a lot of assists at the rim, are able to dribble thru the paint looking for a pass to an open man. If it isn’t there they keep their dribble and come back around and try again. Evans isn’t that good of a ballhandler that he can dribble thru all those players.
I think Evans is going to have to learn to pull up and hit the 10-14ft jumper on a consistent basis. Once he gets by his man, he faces a wall of defenders at the rim. If he pulls up and takes a 12ft jumper, he’ll force them to come to him and leave their man. Then Evans will be able to create easy dunks for his big men.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
by HighTops on Jun 29, 2010 2:53 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
very thoughful evaluation
Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?
by wallywagon11 on Jun 29, 2010 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions
seconded and we all hope he learns to be a better pg over this offseason
the action oughta slow down in his mind and make it easier for him to pick apart passing lanes
Let us usher in the era of Reke DMC!
What makes DMC's rate all the more impressive...
…was that he did it with the tallest team in college basketball last year.
UK had tremendous athleticism last year, with much being made of their wingspans. In Leonardo’s Vitruvian Man, the wingspan is the same as the height, so the already tall and athletic Wildcats had arms befitting people several inches taller. John Calipari was aware of this, which helps explain why why many UK games were won with defensive prowess and fast break points rather than a perimeter game (note that West Virginia knocked UK out of the tourney with a 3-point contest for the ages.)
So on a less talented team, Cousins’ rate likely would have been even higher. Also, it’s extremely interesting to note that his point and rebound per-minute stats OUTPACE Tim Duncan’s numbers as a senior at Wake Forest.
If he gets his head on straight, Sacramento will have one of the best big men in the game in five years.
Excellent post Aykis, well done sir!
"he looks like he is going to take a bite out of a huge invisible sandwich..." - wallywagon11
about Cuz's fouls
just wanted to add two things.
1st. He had foul troubles much more frequently early in the season, but as he learned the college game his fouls declined significantly. During the first half of the season, Cuz was often on the bench ten minutes into the game and played his most important minutes in the second half. But by mid-season fouls weren’t usually keeping him off the floor. I can’t remember him fouling out of a game either.
2nd. Despite the high rate of fouls Cuz created, he was mugged far more often than the refs blew the whistle. He reminded me of Shaq early in his career that way. Cuz was just so much more physical than his opponents that the refs ended up swallowing their whistles. On the defensive end of the floor he would do much less to his opponent than was being done to him but would get the whistle. My feeling is that in the NBA early in his career Cuz won’t get the calls, but that with time and as his reputation develops things will even out.
Conditioning more than fouls kept Cuz off the floor. But the good side of that is that while on the floor Cuz works extremely hard. If he keeps his conditioning in line with his motor the sky’s the limit.
chronic
I feel like Draftexpress just did an article on this stuff
with much more concise tables of figures.
Sorry to waste your time then.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
A-16
take a chill pill.
"And Solskjaer has won it!"
by 'tough as nails' spence on Jun 29, 2010 5:55 AM PDT up reply actions
pretty reasonable response
to a basically gratuitous insult imo
THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!
by lchristmas on Jun 29, 2010 5:59 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
interesting article aykis
I don’t read draft express, and i’d be willing to bet that draft express did not feature the tale of the hideous eyes of shawn marion, a “possible hall of famer” waylaid by marajuana and weed due to the lax drug laws in the evil nation of canada (wow, toronto would be more popular if the players knew they could get weed there), and the devastating effects on one young man with a laptop and a dream, an ex-laker fan with tears in his eyes and pau gasol’s rebound stats in his heart…
keep on truckin, bkj….
by lchristmas on Jun 29, 2010 5:56 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
yep,
I thought your reply was a pretty reasonable response to what was posted, as well. I never can figure out why people go out of their way and post something that is rude? Why not just, not comment? {sigh}
Speaking of the feature post, I thought it was a good one and probably very informative and judging from most of the posters here who have said so, appreciated by most Kings fans. Also, I don’t read DraftExpress faithfully, either, so I too, thought this was a good piece and full of good information. So, job well done, I say.
Being primarily a college basketball fan I am familiar with Ken Pomeroy’s site a bit as he is the premier go-to site/guy for all things college basketball numbers, from what I understand. Notice I said “familiar” with his site, I didn’t say I understood it all. : ) I’m not a huge stats person, mostly because numbers are not really my area of expertise (they confound me. I was more of an English and Science girl in school, myself) but I did notice someone above mentioned something about team stats and how teams stats such as overall shooting percentage can affect a players offensive rebounding and I thought maybe Pomeroy’s UK page might be helpful for some to see and you can find that here.
Again, good read, and to be honest I’m actually pretty proud of myself, I actually remembered some of Cousins’ numbers. Yay, me. : )
Seems grateful.
"So your a Yank? Thats ok, were all just people. People are all the same. But we like Canadians better." - Guy at the grocery store. "wow"
Not to slag Aykis
but the DE article is good: http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Just-by-the-Numbers-The-2010-Center-Crop-3519
One thing DX doesn't do that I try to do
Is show players from past drafts who have played in the NBA to use as a comparison. But yes, DX had a very good piece as well.
Grandmaster of the "Never let AnotherStupidSN forget what a Sham-Wow is" Order and Originator of the "Brock Ness Monster".
Yessir
And that was very cool to get some historical context of just how special (and different) Big Cuz and Whiteside are.
Reke’d.
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