Where do you want the Kings to be next May?
by Schneezel on Jul 26, 2010 9:07 PM PDT
Email
PrintMe and my friend have a longstanding argument, he believes we should make as many moves as possible to contend now (which in his mind include adding Hedo Turkoglu and Michael Pietrus. *Sigh*.), whilst I think that mortgaging our future for a playoff appearance is foolish in the face of building over time like most small market teams must do a la. San Antonio Spurs/Oklahoma City Thunder/etc.
But this conversation got me thinking, where would you, the fan, want the Kings to be next May? After a short period of perusing this subject, I noticed that there were two schools of thought, primarily. One side, believes that we will squeak into the playoffs as an 8th seed to inevitably play the [redacted]. The other thinks that we will place within the bottom 10 teams of the league.
Here's an article that places each Western Conference team in a rank:
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=16913
This has us ranked as the 10th seed in the Western Conference. That figures us to be in the 10-15 segment of the draft once again, which is improvement, definitely. We'd need to win about 40 games to get to the 10th seed this upcoming year and that is a good deal of improvement from this year.
In my opinion, this is an accurate depiction for us as a team and we will continue to grow through the draft by picking in the 10-14 spot.
Lastly, how do you think the roster will look after this season? Will we look significantly different in our core or will we stay with this current squad the entire year?
(This is a FanPost from a member of the Sactown Royalty community. The views expressed come from the member, and not Sactown Royalty staff.)
194 comments
|
1 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Competing for a championship.
But if you’re talking reality, competing for a playoff spot.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
True, a team always should aspire to go for a championship.
But yes in reality we have to travel the road to it and this year is an important part of it I think. We will make one of our largest leaps in improvement this year, IMO.
"Rarely is the questioned asked: Is our children learning?"
I agree.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
In the real world?
In great position to improve on a solid season with one last lottery pick, and possibly a legit free agent.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
At the end of this season
We should be a 35-40 win team with at least two to three of our young guys having stepped up their game and thus cemented their place with the team (out of donte, casspi, tyreke, JT, cousins, whiteside).
Beyond that, we should have a clear weakness/ need which will most likely be at shooting guard but possibly small forward/ point guard if current players don’t pan out or regress.
Finally, we should have the cap space to address those needs through trades or free agency.
All of this should set us up to be at least a 50-55 win team starting 2 seasons from now and lasting for 5-6 years.
by Travis Mays Hayes on Jul 26, 2010 9:20 PM PDT reply actions
My worry about us making the playoffs this year or next is
That we are focusing on just our teams improvement and all the pieces we are adding. Well it’s not like the West is getting worse people. I don’t mean to be the party pooper, I want to see the Kings succeed, but lets face it, the lower teams in the West are getting a lot better as well.
The only teams in the West I see getting “worse” are Phoenix, arguably Golden State, and lets just say Minnesota isn’t getting any better.
The Grizzlies, Clippers, Rockets, and Warriors all view their team the same way we do. As a team on the rise that could surprise people.
All this nonsense I just said basically means, Lets not discount that the West is getting better just as we are.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
Okay who are your playoff teams next year?
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Only Utah and Phoenix look to be weaker, out of the 8 teams that made it last season
Houston should be stronger, so I see them unseating someone. And, that team is probably the Suns.
Without knowing what type of offense the Kings will use and how well they can learn to play better team defense, I see them as 10th in the West because I’m a homer. With the players they’ve added, I see them winning a few more close game but they’ll still have problems on the road and in the East where teams play better defense. I still see them as the 9th or 10th pick in the lottery next year with less than 40 wins..
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
by HighTops on Jul 26, 2010 9:58 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah it's hard to see the Kings making the playoffs next year.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
How are Utah weaker?
I think Al Jefferson will own it in Utah when healthy… Sloan will force him to play D and he’ll be a solid Big with a supporting cast.
Will outplay Boozer’s 2009 season.
(Korver and WeMath are supporting cast, that would make them marginally worse on the shooting side)
I dont see Utah as weaker.
I think Al Jefferson will be better in Utah than Carlos Boozer or at the least, as good as Boozer was.
Sure they lost Wes Matthews and Kyle Korver, but they gained respectable replacements for those in Raja Bell and Gordon Hayward.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 27, 2010 11:58 AM PDT up reply actions
I said weaker but I didn't take them out of the playoffs
yes, I believe that they will be weaker especially with Okur coming off an ruptured Achilles injury. Jefferson will be starting at center replacing Okur and Millsap will start at PF Boozer knew the system and Jefferson will take time to work things out. But, most of all with Okur injured and Koufos trade, Fresenko is the only real size in the frontcourt and he hasn’t resigned.
Hayward is a nice rookie, but he’s a rookie. And, no one they picked up will be able to match Korver’s shooting. Wes Matthews is better than Bell. Utah will not win 53 games this season, and will probably be closer to 45.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
I think LA
Texas, OK, Port and Utah are locks barring injuries. Thats 7.
Everybody else except Minnesota is going for 8th (GS is also out to as soon as they have their next inevitable injury).
There are some guys smarter than me, some guys better looking, I take comfort in the fact that there is no guy that is both.
reply fail to Pookey
even though I wasn’t the one asked…but that never stops me.
There are some guys smarter than me, some guys better looking, I take comfort in the fact that there is no guy that is both.
Who are the other 2 in the top 7?
OKC & Port I assume?
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
That would mean you have 8 teams.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Crap
OK to keep a smile on my face, lets assume one of the 8 has enough misfortune to fall out of the playoffs, so we at least still have a chance for 8th , 3 1/2 months before the season begins.
There are some guys smarter than me, some guys better looking, I take comfort in the fact that there is no guy that is both.
Okey Doke ElRon LOL
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
that's actually only 5
Sharlon Schoop - de favoriete Nederlandse honkbalspeler van McCovey Chronicles.
You always have to be one step ahead of your drunk friends
--Daisy Owl
Its 7.
LA, Texas (Spurs, Rockets, Mavs), OKC, Portland, Utah.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 27, 2010 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions
aha
You have more confidence in the Rockets than I
Sharlon Schoop - de favoriete Nederlandse honkbalspeler van McCovey Chronicles.
You always have to be one step ahead of your drunk friends
--Daisy Owl
The Rockets will have a better season than the Spurs, as long as Yao can contribute
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
as long as Yao can contribute
Sharlon Schoop - de favoriete Nederlandse honkbalspeler van McCovey Chronicles.
You always have to be one step ahead of your drunk friends
--Daisy Owl
I really think Landry wont be on the roster during trade deadline.
maybe for rubios rights and take on a big contract.
I know i don't know it all... its just what my parents call me
by Mr. Know it all on Jul 26, 2010 9:35 PM PDT reply actions
kahn is dumb
But he wont give Rubicon for another PF.
by oakland9 on Jul 26, 2010 9:43 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
He just traded for Delonte West when he already had Beasley...
He just might.
All in all, I wouldn’t be surprised to see Kahn trade Rubio away for a few thousand frozen TV dinners so the team could have all three meals together.
"Rarely is the questioned asked: Is our children learning?"
by Schneezel on Jul 26, 2010 9:47 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
West only has $500K of his contract guaranteed, expect him waived by Aug. 3rd
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
they already have 8 Guards, three of which are stuck in the middle
I know i don't know it all... its just what my parents call me
by Mr. Know it all on Jul 27, 2010 6:05 PM PDT up reply actions
No but he would for Jeter
There are some guys smarter than me, some guys better looking, I take comfort in the fact that there is no guy that is both.
In order
Lakers
Mavs
Nuggets
Blazers
Jazz
Thunder
Rockets
Suns/Hornets. (Steve Nash is still Steve Nash regardless of Amare being there or not. I do not see the Suns going from a 54 win team with Amare to missing the playoffs without him)
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
ElRonToro, you have taught me well.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 26, 2010 9:37 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh crap
Forgot the Spurs. Throw them in there at 6 behind the Jazz.
Rockets/Suns/Hornets competing for 8th.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 26, 2010 9:45 PM PDT up reply actions
how is denver so high up I don't understand it
Kenyon Martin is out for at least half the season and Chris Anderson has just undergone surgery on his finger and knee. You have to believe that will affect him. They have AL Harrington to replace Kenyon Martin. Al is not Martin.He is a bad defender and below average defender. I just don’t think rge Nuggets can be the same team. They lack depth and with Kenyon Martin gone they are a lot worse defensively and rebounding wise. They also lose toughness.
I see it being
Lakers
Mavs
Blazers
Thunder
Rockets
Spurs
Jazz
Suns
Just because of an injury or two
Doesn’t mean you throw the Nuggets out of the playoffs. They still have Chauncey Billups, Carmelo, and most importantly George Karl. Even with Martin out last year, when they had Karl they were still a good team.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 27, 2010 9:11 AM PDT up reply actions
I don't think the Suns will make it
No Amare, Nash=OLD
Yep, keep mentioning how old he is
Feed the fire.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
Seriously.
He had his best season last season.
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 28, 2010 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions
Bottom line
Nash rocks.
I wish the Kings had him so we could be talking about the present instead of the future.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
Also, I believe the Rockets are the wild card, here
Yao just said he’d retire if his foot doesn’t heal, which leads me to believe that it’s going to be a nagging problem for him all year. They have good players in Martin and Brooks, but that’s about it. …Miller doesn’t help much, either.
Scola is damn near a double-double guy.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
Yeah
He is, as their primary rebounder. Other than that, he’s about average in my eyes. Sub par on defense.
…But that’s just the thing. Without Yao, the Rockets are stacked with good players…not great or anything. Without Yao, the Rockets remind me of the Kings from 2 years ago.
I don't think Denver is a lock
Not with the injury history of Kenyon Martin, Nene, & now Birdman.
Also Houston. I’m not sure Yao will ever be fully healthy. He is so heavy yet so frail & that won’t get better with age.
Houston & Denver will compete no doubt but I just don’t see them as locks. The are a ton of mildly talented teams in the west & 1 elite team imo. I wouldn’t count out or count in any team not named the Lakers.
I love beating dead horses.
Y'all are sleeping on the Rockets.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
With Sims here
they have some scary potential if Yao can stay healthy
"Children want what they want when they want it." ... Andy Sims
I know they will be good
I just don’t think there is a ton of seperation between maybe 10 teams not named the Lakers.
I love beating dead horses.
Last year they were't far from making the playoffs
and they have only gotten better. Even if Yao wasn’t back to his old self till the all star break. I think the Rockets will play Yao 20-25 minutes until then waiting until he is ready to play. They will be much improved. Even if Yao is out till mid season they will be competing for the playoffs. They haven’t lost any significant pieces they have only added so even without Yao the Rockets are a damn good team. With Yao they are as good as anybody in the league
Again
I know they will be good I just don’t think there is a ton of seperation between maybe 10 teams not named the Lakers
I love beating dead horses.
I'm not sleeping on them, they have a pretty good team now.
PG- Brooks
SG- Martin
SF- Ariza
PF- Scola
C- Yao
BN- Hayes
BN- Battier
BN- Lowry
BN- Patterson
BN- Budinger
BN- Hill
BN- Andersen
Their team is stacked all across the board at every position.
But it’s still tough for me to see them finishing in the top 4. I think they are a lock for the playoffs health-permitting, but a 5 seed at best.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 27, 2010 9:15 AM PDT up reply actions
And add Brad Miller there.
They’ll need him, especially with the recent story that Yao is contemplating retirement.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 27, 2010 9:19 AM PDT up reply actions
They're relying on Yao for the playoffs
Without Yao, the Rockets’ front line looks absolutely horrible.
Not really
Scola, Brad Miller, Chuck Hayes, Jordan Hill, Patrick Patterson, and David Andersen is far from a horrible front line
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 27, 2010 5:09 PM PDT up reply actions
After Scola,
there’s a considerable drop-off in talent.
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 28, 2010 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions
I think that dropoff comes after Patterson.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 28, 2010 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions
Scola is like an 8.
Miller 6
Hayes 5
Hill 5
Patterson 4
Andersen WHO?
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 28, 2010 1:30 PM PDT up reply actions
You are underrating Patterson.
Scola
Miller
Patterson
Hayes
Hill
David Andersen
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 28, 2010 2:06 PM PDT up reply actions
A little hard to say considering he hasn't played a game.
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 28, 2010 4:17 PM PDT up reply actions
okc will be in that 4th seed
They keep improving w/ time
by jadams12 on Jul 27, 2010 5:44 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Sacramento
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
by section214 on Jul 26, 2010 9:37 PM PDT reply actions 14 recs
I definitely second that.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 26, 2010 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions
With ya on this 214.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Amen
"Cousins is the Blaster to Evans’ Master, the Hammer to Evans’ Sickle"- HP
by tomroadrunner on Jul 26, 2010 9:40 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd like to see them in the Playoffs
Or at least have a better record.
Chris Andersen could be in a porno with his 'stache. Too bad he still wouldn't know how to box out.
Honesty may be the best policy, but it's important to remember that apparently, by elimination, dishonesty is the second-best policy.
Quitter's Proud United Member #11
Well, there are about 20 wins between those two places, so I like your odds of getting something you like.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
Well, if the Kings can win 35-40 games next season, I'd consider it a success.
Anything less (depending on what happens) will look like a disappointment.
Chris Andersen could be in a porno with his 'stache. Too bad he still wouldn't know how to box out.
Honesty may be the best policy, but it's important to remember that apparently, by elimination, dishonesty is the second-best policy.
Quitter's Proud United Member #11
Anything north of 35 is gravy.
At that point, consistent improvement has you in the tournament for the next several years. The 2011 free agent fest is going to really have impact on the team, in a good way, I’m hoping.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
Agreed
Things sure are looking up.
The free agents of 2011 sure is looking interesting.
Chris Andersen could be in a porno with his 'stache. Too bad he still wouldn't know how to box out.
Honesty may be the best policy, but it's important to remember that apparently, by elimination, dishonesty is the second-best policy.
Quitter's Proud United Member #11
Especially when they talk to each other
colluding to create the Justice League of Orlando.
While we take on the world as Petrie’s School for the Extremely Gifted.
This.
Next May we'll be anguishly awaiting the lottery
hoping we can move up from the 9th or 10th spot and get that final piece to take us into the playoffs.
2 undraft players, 2 rookies and 4 second and third year players making up 1/2 our roster, we’re really still going to be developing half of our rotation. The only thing that will be undecided next May, is if Dalembert & Landry produced enough to warrant the Kings going after them in free agency. But, other than that nothing will change unless the unlikely happens at the trade deadline.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
If this team shows promise
I could definitely see GP & the Maloofs adding another significant piece at the deadline. Especially if the fans are excited & start to show up at arco in bunches.
I love beating dead horses.
The Kings are going to have to do this.
At the deadline or as soon as the season ends, the weaknesses have to be identified and rectified. If not, Sacramento is scratched off the “blue print”. Evans wants his name up there with the stars of the league. To achieve this, the Kings need him to do more than put up gaudy numbers, they need to win. Personally, I think a lot of this season depends on how well Evans shoots and integrates the new fleet of bigs into his game.
The Kings walk into the season with a possible need in back court depth, which is usually an easy fix and another easy fix in wing players. As long as the Kings stick around 8-11, they should still be able to add that dynamic piece to get them over the top because SG’s and SF’s are usually the 4th and 5th most in demand position.
I think the Kings will be a force to reckon with for long stretches of the season but eventually, their inexperience will cost them down the stretch and they will finish 3 or 4 games out of the playoffs. It is a long season, and the Western Conference teams aren’t as deep as they once were (outside of the Lakers, Dallas and Portland) so anything is possible.
The world is not your Trade Machine.
-Ziller
by jjham15 on Jul 26, 2010 10:58 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm not getting how the back court depth is an easy fix
Because it sure hasn’t been an easy fix for the Kings for the last couple of years. Not to pick on you jj because that claim has been made many others but it sure ain’t working out for the Kings so far. Douby was a bust, Garcia wasn’t great, Singletary and Brown were both busts, and Sergio was the most recent bust (am I forgetting anyone here?).
The Kings have been trying to fix the back court for several years now and best they’ve been able to do is Beno (which ain’t all that bad as of late). I’m not counting Reke a success yet because in order to be a success he needs up the pace, distribute the ball better, run plays other than the 1-4 flat, and develop a reliable jump shot.
So, all in all, fixing the back court doesn’t seem to be as easy a fix as y’all are making it out to be.
"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." - Cardinal Richelieu
Jesus what do you want from Tyreke? Maybe he can rest on the 9th day. But he'll probably have to get Jesus and Satan their shots that day too. I suppose their is no rest for the weary.
And Singletary a bust? As a 2nd round pick? You gotta be shitting hozr. Seriously.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I guess I should clarify that I'm really looking at the Kings fixing the PG position.
Reke clearly is an excellent backcourt player. He’s just not an excellent PG as of the end of last season. The search at this point is for Reke’s backcourt playmate (that would be an upgrade to Beno). I didn’t mean to write off Reke so much as to say that his PG skills need to improve, which I have no doubt they will (at least somewhat). I’m really looking forward to see what new skills Reke brings to the table next season.
As for Singletary, I simply listed as many guys as I could remember that the Kings have tried plugging the PG hole with because they tried several times now and the best they’ve been able to do so far is Beno.
"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." - Cardinal Richelieu
The Kings aren't that different from other teams in that regard.
Every team has that problem. Hell, the Lakers won a championship and overhauled their bench.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
So would you agree that solving backcourt depth is not as easy many make it out to be?
"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." - Cardinal Richelieu
Of course.
I’ve been saying that all along hozr.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Is Tyreke an excellent bust then?
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 28, 2010 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions
I never said or implied that Reke is a bust
"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." - Cardinal Richelieu
Your first post says he's not a "success",
and your second one says he’s been “excellent”…
So….
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 28, 2010 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Neither of which says anything about him being a bust
You’re attempting to put words in my mouth that I never said. And I said that he’s not a success “yet” (at the PG role) which is a different thing than saying he is not a success at all.
"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." - Cardinal Richelieu
Is facilitation that important?
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
For Reke specifically or for the PG role?
Either way the anwer is yes.
It has been pointed out over and over again that no star player can do it on their own. They have to get everybody else involved and make them better. For Reke to become a true star then he’s going to need to facilitate.
For a PG, one of their major responsibilities is running the team and a major portion of that is facilitation.
"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." - Cardinal Richelieu
Yeah
That really kept the Lakers from winning a title.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Here's the bottom line here hozr
The Kings are not going to be built like the 01-04 teams. They don’t have the players or the styles. The best player, most likely, will be Tyreke Evans who is a 1 on 1 ball dominant player. Demanding that better ball movement be the key to winning a championship, which is bullshit in of itself, is pointless. Having a guy who can score on anybody is far more important to winning a title. Where ball movement comes important in keeping the other players satisfied so that they have roles offensively and do their jobs defensively. It’s more about satisfying the other guys than it is anything else.
If the Kings win a title, and i’m not saying they will, it’s not likely with a classic “facilitator” anyway. Title teams have freakish talents who defy “typical position” settings. Putting them in a box says more about your expectation of how the Kings should play than anything else.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Kobe's [Redacted] didn't win a championship until Kobe became more of a facilitator
He could not do it on his own. When he tried, they failed. Tyreke doesn’t have to be a “classic” point guard and I never said that he did. He does need to keep everybody else involved and that means facilitation. He needs to get better at it, he doesn’t need to be the end all, be all facilitator.
"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." - Cardinal Richelieu
Right
There was a ton of facilitation going on in the Finals.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
It's an "easy fix" if the Maloofs wants it to be
All the guys you mentioned were cheap band-aids not fixes. We have a ton of cap space. If a back court guy is the missing piece to championship contention they will need to fix it after the new cba or Kings fans would(and should) be extremely disappointed.
Hopefully they are waiting to see what they have before they decide who not if they want to spend on.
I love beating dead horses.
Sacramento will be twice as good this year
the Kings are going to be a much better and well rounded team. They are 1 year away from being in the playoffs. 1 more year in the lottery for Petrie to draft a great player and for the team to acquire a good player through free agency or trade. The Kings will be really really good next year
I think we are a year away
We’ll continue to gift some minutes and develop players this season. I’d like to see us get into the 30s in wins and have a clear idea what areas need to be improved on.
I think we are solid upfront, although we don’t have any superstars up there. I also think we will be able to improve at the 2 and 3.
I think we need two more stars to become a contender. Ideally one would come from within the roster and one via trade or free agency.
I’d like to see us try to package multiple pieces for single players similar to the Dalembert trade. I don’t mind trading some of our spare parts to improve. I don’t see any of our players as untouchable if the right deals come along.
Here’s my shot at the rankings:
Lakers
Thunder
Blazers
Suns
Mavs
Nuggets
Jazz/Rockets/Hornets/Spurs fighting for the last two spots.
Kings in 11th or 12th. Minnesota in 15th.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
The Thunder at #2?
They don’t really have a starting PF or C and in the West, that is a bad thing.
Suns @ #4? Amaré gets replaced by Hedo and Hakeem Warrick. No center. Old talent. How is Nash going to run through lanes that are no longer there because his all-NBA post player is gone.
Dallas @ #5? Look at their depth…at every position.
The world is not your Trade Machine.
-Ziller
You're right
I should have picked the Thunder to finish first and the Blazers or Suns to finish second.
I guess what I am trying to say is there is a new sheriff in town in the West. There are going to be some surprises this season.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
by NewEraKings on Jul 27, 2010 12:08 AM PDT up reply actions
We're looking like GS
We’re going to outscore everybody! Lol!
On a serious note, I’m pretty worried. We’re known for having a shi**y defense, and not having Martin or Andersen out there isn’t going to help the cause.
I’m surprised the Jazz aren’t higher then us. They beat us in the Playoffs this year.
Chris Andersen could be in a porno with his 'stache. Too bad he still wouldn't know how to box out.
Honesty may be the best policy, but it's important to remember that apparently, by elimination, dishonesty is the second-best policy.
Quitter's Proud United Member #11
Where do I want them to be?
Ideally, and unrealistically IMO, fighting for the 8th spot. I think the 10th – 12th range in the West is more likely, though I’d love to be close to that last playoff spot. In all honesty, I don’t really want them to make it to the postseason as much as Iwant them to smell it and get hungry about it. One last lottery pick and we should be ready to make a push in ‘11-’12
This is the last year, IMO, that the team won’t be necessaril judged by results. Progress and individual development are REALLY important (not only from players, but also from the coachin staff). The record must improve, no doubt (would love something close to 40 Ws) but I’m more interested in solidifying the foundation for the following season.
"Children want what they want when they want it." ... Andy Sims
I think I'd still rather be 9th and take my chances in the lottery this season, than swept out in 4 games.
Being my realistic, unpleasant self.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
Wouldn't want it any other way, Sims
and I agree with you. I think hunger will also help this team mature and come together.
"Children want what they want when they want it." ... Andy Sims
I'd rather make the playoffs
I’ll take the 17th pick over 16. Give the Kids a little taste of pride to make them hunger for more. I don’t see the Lakers sweeping us. If for no other reason than Laker boredom.
I love beating dead horses.
I am with you allbenji.
I am getting tired of being one of the worst teams in the league, lining up for our lottery spot. It is beginning to feel like lining up for the food bank. It starts to feel like we are a team on welfare. I know, there are many of you who say otherwise and preach patience. I love this team, but my patience is wearing thin.
I want GP to bring in an exciting piece this season. We have picked up a couple of great lottery picks with Tyreke and Cousins. While I was hoping that GP would get someone exciting for the back court through free agency, I realize that FA has been a very expensive endeavor and I can understand where GP would pass on paying an exorbitant salary for a guy who is not going to offer that much to the team. I get that and I am on board with all of the decisions that have made thus far. The franchise worked hard to clear some cap space. Now that they have, I am hoping that a strategic move will be made for someone exciting this season and the team makes a run for a playoff spot.
Promises are not going to bring fans back to Arco Arena. Fans have been hearing promises for too long. Winning is going to bring fans back to Arco Arena. The Maloofs are business men. They should realize that sometimes it takes spending money to make money. That time has come. They cannot continue to pinch pennies and expect to fill Arco Arena.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
It's easy to say
But until you see what you have in Cousins/Whiteside, AND how the frontcourt is going to function with those two plus Sam Dalembert, AND whether either Donté or Omri are capable of being a starting three in the league – well, how do you know what position to really address?
Not to say we couldn’t use another decent body in the guard rotation, but even at that I wouldn’t want the team to go get a stud backcourt player when it might not be necessary or the biggest need down the road.
You’re preaching spending money just to spend the money. I’d say the team needs to at least wait until the deadline to see what their cap space/extra frontcourt pieces can bring in a trade – and if the team is lurking around a playoff spot, THEN you pull the trigger on something.
Otherwise, you’re basically blowing a good sized hole in the rebuilding plan for no good reason.
by otis29 on Jul 28, 2010 10:37 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
The trade deadline, or sometime at mid-season even, is the earliest time the Kings should make a big money trade.
Otherwise it’s too early.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Totally agree with Otis,
Unless some team comes knocking on the door to offer a great player for cap space, the trade deadline or next summer is the time to strike. Until we know for sure how the new players will work out, we’d simply be shooting in the dark. We don’t even know whether or not we’ll try to resign Dalembert or Landry.
No one player will improve this team, more than the players we already have learning how to play together will. I’d rather watch the young players growing for one more year, than locking ourselves into a long term major contract that will stiffle our growth down the road.
If the Maloofs don’t spend the remaining cap space this season, they are going to make money. I’ll let them worry about ways to fill Arco. And, I’ll just enjoy watching to youth learning to play and win together.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
I can wait one season to watch to see how the guys work together.
I do have concerns. I feel like the team is trying to operate with one bad spark plug at the guard rotation and trying to replace that spark plug with one that isn’t any good. I would hate to see the team get to the point it loses Landry and Dalembert and returns to two bad spark plugs. At some point, the franchise needs to get the team working on all cylinders, if it ever expects to be a winning team, again. There is always going to be some reason to wait for something. Wait to see how the new players work together…Wait to see if Landry and Dalembert are going to remain…Wait, wait, wait. At some point, there has to be an assertive stance of striking. Perhaps, now is not that time, but we do not want to get into a repetitive cycle of waiting. It has been eight years since 2002.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
You may be right that I am getting ahead of myself.
I am anticipating a strong front court, this season, as well as either Casspi or Greene starting at the three. We do know that we need another decent player at the guard rotation. I am not preaching money to spend money. But, I see your point about waiting until the deadline to see what their cap space/extraneous pieces will bring in a trade, then make the trade.
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
I'll take the playoffs and the sweep.
There isn’t much difference between a 13th and a 17th pick IMO.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Strange things can happen in the lottery.
I mean, the math is what it is, but I’ve watched 3 teams jump ahead of us two years in a row. The Bulls hit paydirt just 2 years ago.
You’ve always been with me in my derision of the 8th Seed Mafia…
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
I deride a team like the Suns for the idea.
But for the Kings? it’s a start.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
yea i'd have to agree
I think we’re a year removed from the playoffs and a Harrison Barnes away from being a contender 2years after draft night.
I hate to look at the 2011 draft this soon, but don’t say I’m crazy. Portland had broy and aldridge and somehow won the lottery. That could be sactown in a heart beat. I’d be pleased with any addition of a lottery pick in the 2011 draft to give the Kings another piece.
by jadams12 on Jul 27, 2010 6:01 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah I guess I worded that wrong.
I guess what I meant was, would you want the Kings to make a few big trades in order to get into contention now? Or just keep building and stay within the late-lottery selections.
"Rarely is the questioned asked: Is our children learning?"
I might be alone in feeling it's pretty pathetic to be excited or looking forward to another lottery
Don’t get me wrong I am was and am extremely excited about our lottery picks (Tyreke & Cousins) & I know it was necessary to our rebuild. I don’t want to be like one of these mediocre teams being to good for a high pick but not good enough for the playoffs. Or a team full of roll players who makes the playoffs but gets bounced over & over.
That said I am happy with Reke & Cousins as our cornerstones but I can do without another JT or Spencer (10th & 12th pick) If we want or need more role players we could just buy them. Lets make a run to the playoffs & hope our young stars turn into superstars.
I love beating dead horses.
I'm not exactly thrilled we're going to the lottery again.
I just think that I’d be happier with staying with the plan to contend for 5-7 years instead of pulling a Boston and contending for 3. Maybe its because I’d like to be at drinking age before we get really good too…
"Rarely is the questioned asked: Is our children learning?"
Or
they can be a 10th – 12th spot team and get the first 1 – 3 picks like the Portland and the Thunder. hmmmmm
by Mr.Noisewater on Jul 29, 2010 11:51 AM PDT up reply actions
That's what we'll do.
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 29, 2010 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions
I can't envision any big trades that don't involve gutting the careful drafting Petrie has done.
I mean, we could probably trade Evans and Cousins to get Carmelo, but I’d rather watch everyone blossom, and see what can be added in free agency.
Of course, if Carmelo likes the cut of Sacramento’s jib in 12 months, I will certainly welcome him to town.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
The only guys I see being traded are JT or Donte.
I don’t see Omri being traded if only because he can shoot and board well. Plus he can play reasonably good D at the 3 spot.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Of course, the scouting report being what it is...
What of value can one reasonably expect in return for Greene, assuming he doesn’t just set the world on fire this year?
Makes me more content to exercise patience.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
How does being patient make Donte Greene a better player if he isn't improving?
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
We can dump him now, and roll the dice with Casspi, as far as I'm concerned.
But we won’t get squat for him, so why bother? We’re looking at a team option for 11-12, so what’s another year to let him develop when we’re likely outside the tournament anyway?
Realistically, we can keep him if he blossoms, and if Casspi owns the role, we can re-sign Greene for very little as insurance, or just let him try the market. Either way, the organization will have all of the juice in any negotiations after this season.
Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.
Which I will eat.
It won't work that way.
In a year either Donte or Omri is gone. Bet ya money. But then again I thought LeBron James was staying in Cleveland. So what do I know?
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I think it depends
on what they do this season and what interest there is in them in the league. Too early to tell. In any case, we’re going to pick up Donte’s option for next season because it’s so cheap unless he totally stinks up the joint.
I think it gets interesting if neither one of them performs well enough to solidify the position. They could both be gone if that’s the case.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
The Kings have to pick up the option for Donte's 4th year before the Nov 1st.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
$1.7 million for 2011-12
Fairly safe bet that they’ll pick it up?
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
Yeah.
I have a hard time seeing they won’t pick it up at the moment.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
But the caveat to that is that they may not feel he's worth keeping beyond next year anyway.
Interesting decision. Whatever happens, you can expect all the options for all the kids (minus DMC & HW) to be picked up at the same time. Donte, JT, Reke and Omri all have options the Kings have to pick up. They’ll announce it at all the same time me thinks in part because that’s what they did a year ago.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
Sounds like a hustler too me
Oh, I don’t play pool very often, but how about a game for $100.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
I agree
I think JT and Donte are the sort of middling pieces that are likely to be moved, and which I would like to see moved (obviously for decent value). I think it’s also likely that we see Landry moved before the trade deadline, perhaps to a contender.
I don’t know what we would be looking for in return for these guys…draft picks…expiring contracts…?
I think at this point it’s important to consolidate our talent…turning JT, Donte, and/or Top Hat into another top 5 pick (and likely some odds and ends) would be my ideal scenario—largely completing the ‘rebuild-through-draft’ phase, and ushering in the ‘fill-in-with-vets-and-role-players’ phase.
Way too early, to start making major moves.
First off, with Martin, Hawes and Noc removed from the roster, Omri was our 5th best scorer and Donte was our 6th & combined for 18.8 ppg. That is very close to the 5th & 6th men on Bos 19.1 & LA 18.9 ppg. And, our starting lineup last season outscored Boston’s starters and where 8.3 ppg less than LA.
If Tyreke can develop a solid jumper and DeMarcus develops into a 18/10 players, the Kings should have more than enough scoring to go deep into the playoffs. What they need is to develop Defense.
I think David Aldridge said ’ You can’t win with youth in the NBA ’. We have 1 rookie, 2 First year players and 2 Second year players, who are a major part of our rotation. We need to see what they can do First, before we start shipping off our solid role players trying to catch a genie in a bottle.
Simply changing spark plugs to fix a sputtering engine, won’t fix it if the problem is the distributor. Troubleshooting the problem before you start changing parts is always the best procedure.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
The concepts in my comment
spanned two seasons. Is that really too soon to start making major moves, as you call them? And haven’t we made such major moves already?
Also, youth has a way of aging as time goes by, you know…
I can’t really tell what you are advocating in your post. Seeing what we have before we make moves? Don’t we kinda already know what we have in Landry and JT? What is the ‘genie in the bottle’ part mean?…a draft pick?
And nice car analogy…geez.
yeah thats my feeling as well
I think the team will replace either Dalembert or Landry through the draft
My west
Lakers
Mavs
Blazers/OKC/Nugs/Rockets/Jazz/Hornets/Spurs/Grizz/Suns/Kings all battle for the 3-12 spot with the Grizz & Suns ending up 11 & 12, the Kings & ? ending up 9 & 10.
I love beating dead horses.
I voted for 10th to 12th seed, same team with some minor tweaks
It might not take 50 wins to get to the playoffs in the west this season, but I can’t imagine it will drop off too far (yet). I think you let these guys grow, evaluate Whiteside during the first half so you can figure out what to do with Landry/Dalembert at the trade deadline. Maybe Petrie moves one of the frontcourt group along with the cap space to get a big piece for the future.
Realistically on the record, I can see the Kings getting to 3 or 4 games over .500 on the home court (they were 18-23 at Arco last season). Question is, will they win on the road (only 7 wins last season)? My guess is they win 25 at home, and 10 to 12 on the road (barring any impact trades). They creep up to 35-40 wins and position themselves well for the new CBA era.
At first, I thought you were asking who was going to be the Kings' next Sean May
m*****f***ing c***s***ing peanut butter and jelly!! f*** f*** f***!!!
Me too...
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 27, 2010 11:32 AM PDT up reply actions
These are my current standings/predictions
The Suns won’t make the playoffs and OKL barring some deepening of thier frontcourt will win fewer games.
These will end up Not being suprises as OKl won too many close games last year and have no frontline players and as reason takes hold and the realization sets in that whether you liked hm or not, Amare can’t be quickly replaced by a bench player.
Denver struggles much of the 1st half of the season due to its injuries.
1. LA
2. Mavs
3. Houston
4. Utah
5. Port
6. Okl
7. SA
8. Up for grabs
The Kings finish with 37 wins, losing many a game in the closing minutes
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
Oh, but this year
many of the final wins come in right at the end of the season. No more finishing 3 and 10 down the stretch.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Jul 27, 2010 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions
I'm pretty much with you on everything, but injuries are going to have a major impact
Yao in Houston
Okur in Utah
Pryzbilla & Oden in Portland
And, I don’t believe Denver falls out of the playoffs after a 53 game season.
LA wins the Pacific
Dal wins the SW
Por & Den battle out for the NW with the loser fighting Hou for the 4th place finish.
With Utah, OKC, and Spus dropping back to mid to upper 40 win season and battling it out for the last 3 spots.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
The Denver out was a mental error on my part
I think they get stronger as the season goes on. Though if either Billups or Melo get hurt for any length of time they’re done. For now, put in the #5 spot. Though a lot of records will be very close I think, 4-8.
So . . . . I guess no spots up for grabs
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Jul 27, 2010 11:30 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't think we do deals just to do deals
But if the opportunity comes to swap two OK players for one guy who is better than either of the guys being moved, I say we do it. I think the Dalembert deal fit that mode, and hopefully more opportunities of that sort will be on the table going forward.
I see far too many comments on here like, “We should keep him, he’ll be a solid role player for many years to come.”
We’re not going to win with a team full of role players, and we can add those guys at any time. We need some stars, no matter how they come, and we need fewer pieces that are of similar but mediocre talent.
Put together a solid starting lineup anchored by two or three stars and fill in the gaps with the complimentary pieces. Easier said than done.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
Am I the only one
who thinks it is more likely than not that Dalembert gets traded before the deadline. I realize that this assumes Boogie is our center of the future but isn’t that why we picked him at 5…to be our future center assuming he gets his butt in shape? It seems that to pursue Sammy in FA next year means paying big bucks because he could be the starting center on a number of teams. Big guys who rebound and play D are very valuable and exptremely costly so if Boogie is our center of the future, there seems to be no way we would pay starter bucks to our reserve C. Plus I think it is likely we will be paying to keep Carl in FA so unless Boogie is a complete flop, or Sammy is willing to spend the rest of his career as a reserve and earning reserve dollars, we would almost be forced to trade him to get value back.
Yes, as a matter of fact you are.
Philly tried to trade Sammy for 12 -18 months prior to making the deal with the Kings. Dalembert will be 30 at the end of next season. My guess is that he will be looking to sign a contract around MLE territory and the issue won’t be the amount he wants as much as the years he will be looking to get. Thirty year old bigs are almost by definition reserves or will be heading towards reserve territory fairly soon in their career.
If Dalembert is a good fit here I could see him wanting to stay in Sac for MLE money. Teams will have an incomplete but better idea of what the next CBA will look like by the trade deadline. I’m guessing we won’t see teams spending the same kind of funny money they have this off season. It’s possible Sammy gets traded by the deadline and for any number of reasons but I think the one reason he won’t be traded is that there is such a demand for his talents that the market will price him out of the King’s reach.
"I make love to pressure" - Stephen Jackson
Dal will have no problem getting the MLE or slightly more
And as a 25 minute a game guy, that’s what an effective 7 footer is worth. I also think big men tend to play into thier mid 30’s with reasonable effectiveness, some even hit thier peaks at 31, 32, 33.
Although BJ’s point is factual, now that he’s an expiring I think a lot of teams will come calling.
Will we answer? Hmmmmm, that depends of course. He might be just as valuable here for a few years or as a sign and trade next summer. You’ve got to be careful, what if both he and Landry are either traded or gone as Free agents?
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Jul 27, 2010 11:40 PM PDT up reply actions
You are right of course.
If Sammy is willing to sign for the MLE, it is probably a no brainer that we keep him assuming he is half decent in our system. However, as has been said he is a large expiring this year and 2 years at 25+ million is much different than trading 1 year at 12. I’m not saying I want to trade him as much as we have much more luck in trading than in the FA market and there are always teams who have stunk and are looking to dump players for FA money.
Half a year at $5mil actually
for team heading to the playoffs . . . .
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Jul 28, 2010 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions
I could see Portland calling
if Oden continues his story – and OKl calling period. I haven’t thought through the whole league but Denver if thier guys don’t get healthy, Detroit if they’re in it, Atlanta, maybe Charlotte.
Not much to risk as log as they don’t give a ton up.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Jul 28, 2010 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions
valuable deadline chip
I totally agree LTG… if OKC thinks Dally gets them close to the western conf. finals, i could see them moving Harden for him. Wouldn’t we do that?
by longtimelistenerfirsttimecaller on Jul 28, 2010 10:03 AM PDT up reply actions
Uh I dont know about Harden
But if that was on the table we would do it in a heartbeat.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 28, 2010 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions
If we lose Dalembert
Our defense will go from potentially decent to crap overnight. We’ll be lucky to hold teams to 110 points a night, and we won’t be able to outscore them.
Dalembert makes it possible to hide strong offensive guys who ar enot defensive stalwarts like Landry and Beno. Without him out there we’re going to see the same layup drill we’ve been witnessing for the past several years. So I hope we resign him.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
I understand that but a guy like Harden would be a perfect fit next to Tyreke.
Can’t pass that oppurtunity up. Whiteside will eventually replace Dalembert anyway if he develops.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 28, 2010 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions
To steal the lines I've been responding to lately
Dalembert is a known commodity, and probably the third best player on the Kings behind Tyreke and Landry. We’ve been building our defense, toughness and rebounding, and this is not the time to reverse course.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
Sorry i put Dalembert as 2nd ahead of Landry, maybe in a few more season Landry will have that spot, but Completed lack of rebounding, almost no showing of real defense kills him for me..
Founder of team Omté Caspeen
Dalembert and Landry
make a good pairing. Their strengths and weaknesses cover for each other. I’m interested to see how it works out.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
If we arent planning to re-sign Dalembert
Then trading him is a great idea.
If we do plan to re-sign him to a considerably smaller contract, then yes I agree with you.
The truth is neither us nor really Geoff Petrie knows which of those paths we will take as of now.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 28, 2010 5:22 PM PDT up reply actions
There's no rush
Probably the key will be the play of Cousins. I think he is ideally suited to beat up on second-stringers and not be tested as much on defense. I think he will struggle if he’s forced into starting too soon, and he may struggle on defense in any case.
I think both players are suited to play about half the game, so it’s a great pairing. I don’t think Dalembert will resign at MLE rates, though. I see him getting close to Haywood money, maybe a little less.
"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal
As has already been pointed out, there are a lot of teams that could use a good center.
But, without knowing how the new CBA will change the way contracts are doled out, I’m going to suspect that SD will get a lot of offers. And, maybe too many for too much for the Kings to match.
But, I do hope the Kings resign or extend him. Whether or not Cousins is ready to take over the starting Center spot next season is uncertain. And, even if he can, we’ll still need a backup. Portland sure did.
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
Agreed
I’d love to have Sammy for a year or three as long as DMC gets plenty of minutes.
You’ve gotta have depth up front
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Jul 29, 2010 10:17 AM PDT up reply actions
We'll get more than that. :)
"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!
by caseycheesecake on Jul 28, 2010 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions
I'll be shooting for 35, and then I'll be able to celebrate every win we get past that.
Happiness is guaranteed.
I'm with you.
Last year was a major step in the right direction, and it was an 8 win improvement over the previous year. If we can improve by 10 wins this year, I’ll gladly take it. It’s easy to be optimistic at this time of year and imagine a .500 team, but the team is still very young, and that would be a historic leap.
Jasonrp found that less than a quarter of teams that are two seasons removed from having the league’s worst record see a one-season improvement of ten games or more. I’ll be glad if we find ourselves among that company.
I have a bad feeling about most of the old horses in the West
Phoenix lost their big man cornerstone, Denver’s fading, Utah has question marks, and Dallas and San Antonio are getting old; I have a feeling that this is going to be the weakest Western Conference in years.
1. LA Lakers, 56-26 – Kobe’s finally getting old, but the supporting cast is LA’s best in years. Bynum is the X factor for this team. If he’s healthy and productive, this could easily be a 60-win team; if not, though, the Lakers have a pretty high floor.
2. Portland, 54-28 – I don’t see them having the same injury problems with Batum and Roy, though Oden is always a question mark. Anyway, these guys are tough and seasoned.
3. Oklahoma City, 53-29 – Extra experience ought to be enough for this surprise team to nab home court advantage.
4. Utah, 53-29 – Talented at every position, but Okur’s injury issues are key; can Jefferson return to peak form?
5. Denver, 52-30 – The Al Harrington pickup doesn’t impress me; meanwhile, Kenyon Martin and Chauncey Billups aren’t getting any younger. Carmelo Anthony can do a lot, but he can’t win home court on his own.
6. Houston, 50-32 – At full strength or not, having Yao Ming back for at least 60 games (along with Kevin Martin for a full season) ought to push this team back into lower-tier playoff contention.
7. Dallas, 48-34 – Dirk’s keeping steady, but after that the Mavs have Jason Kidd, Shawn Marion, Jason Terry, and Caron Butler; they’re all going to be at least 30 by season’s end, and they’ve all already been in declines for at least a couple years now. Tyson Chandler at center is going to be a problem. Overall, I just don’t see this team recovering from its 6-game, first-round loss.
8. San Antonio, 47-35 – Tim Duncan’s only a shell of the player he was 3-5 years ago, and Manu’s also getting old while Richard Jefferson is already over the hill at 29. I think this is the year that San Antonio officially becomes Tony Parker’s team – no competition with Duncan or Ginobili anymore. Phoenix will challenge for #8, but the Spurs’ Big 3 will be enough for at least one more ride into the postseason.
9. Phoenix, 45-37 – Never count a Nash-led team out, but you can’t deny that the loss of Stoudemire hurts – big time. The question here, IMO, is whether Nash continues defying Father Time. If he replicates ‘09-’10, or produces at least 90% as much, then the Suns are going to give San Antonio a spirited fight for that 8 spot.
10. Sacramento, 37-45 – Tyreke’s going to get better, and somewhere in that frontcourt is our much-needed defensive stopper. Youth and inexperience will continue to plague us, but between DMC, Evans, Greene, Casspi, and Whiteside, we have just enough young players with just enough upside to become relevant again.
11. New Orleans, 36-46 – Their PG situation is not tenable. Chris Paul’s mind is going to be elsewhere the whole season, unless NO trades him in exchange for inferior parts; meanwhile, Collison’s numbers are going to take a hit, as he won’t have the benefit of 37 starts as long as Paul’s healthy. Marcus Thornton ought to be able to step up his game as a sophomore, but other than that, this is a team that is already 2 years past its short-lived prime.
12. LA Clippers, 33-49 – With Kaman as the team’s high scorer last year, I’m not quite sure how Blake Griffin is going to fit in this picture, but you find space for a #1 draft pick. Expect Blake to be rusty in November and December, but he should be putting up rather Kamanesque 18-8, maybe even 20-10, numbers by year’s end. Good thing, too, because Aminu’s either going to be a bust or a long-term project, and he’s certainly not going to produce big numbers this year.
13. Memphis, 30-52 – They over-achieved in 2010. Zach Randolph’s a considerable injury risk, and Rudy Gay isn’t going to have free agency to motivate him any longer.
14. Golden State, 25-57 – Roster overhaul means that this team is going to have weak chemistry for the first few months; on top of that, David Lee’s only going to exacerbate the defensive woes. With Ellis and Curry, though, and David Lee’s offensive game, this team should be able to gel by season’s end. Expect them to be horrible at the start, and then approach respectability by year’s end.
15. Minnesota, 12-70 – This was a 15-win team with Al Jeffereson, and they just gave him away for nothing. The only reasons I have them reaching double-digit wins are the Wesley Johnson pick and Johnny Flynn’s increased experience.
With these largely arbitrary standings, BTW, the WC as a whole would have a .513 record; interconference parity would be at its closest in a decade.
"Where hope goes to die"
by napg on Jul 29, 2010 1:12 AM PDT reply actions 6 recs
Rec'ed for the thought you put into this.
I still feel like this is pretty optimistic, though. You’re calling for a one-game regression for New Orleans as they transition from an injured Chris Paul to a disgruntled Chris Paul (or what he brings in trade, which seems unlikely). You’re calling for a 10-game regression for Memphis because Rudy Gay isn’t gunning for a contract— I’m with you if Zach Randolph has a severe injury, but short of that (especially considering they’re likely adding Henry), it seems like a stretch. You’re calling for only a four-game improvement from the Clips (who add a highly touted rookie big man) while predicting a 12-game improvement from Sacramento (who added a highly touted but younger rookie big man). Twelve game improvements aren’t common; I’d see it as most likely to happen if Dalembert plays heavy minutes and is very productive, which seems to go against the spirit of our youth movement.
I’d be stoked if that happened, but at this point, I feel like 13th place in the west is more likely than 10th place in the west. Odds are, someone from the mediocre group (10th to 14th in the west—Sacramento to Golden State, on your list) will lose a major player to injury. If it’s us, we’ll drop. Hoping that it’s not us, I’d call 12th in the West. That would be a significant improvement over last year (which is a good thing) and it would help us continue to rebuild (also a good thing). One more top-10 pick is going to be good for us in the long-run. Spencer Hawes was a #10 drafted center, and DeMarcus Cousins was a #5. A few extra draft spots can matter a lot in that range.
Reasonable objections, and I weighed those in my head as well.
Basically, I see Memphis’ 40-win season as being equivalent to our 38-win season in 2008 – I look at the pieces Memphis had, and think to myself, “Ok, how the heck did they get there?”
I could certainly be wrong here, but I’ve always had the impression that Memphis was lucky to go 40-42 last year. Look at their average differential of -1.38 ppg; the opposite margin, +1.38, was good for a 46-36 record for the Bucks, and +1.3 netted Charlotte a 44-38 record. Throw in Memphis’ 12-8 record last year in games decided by 5 or fewer, and I think Memphis was lucky to win more more than 36 games.
And that’s not even factoring in how lucky Memphis was to have Randolph play in 81 games.
As for the Clips, I was going to give them a much larger improvement, but I’m worried about Blake Griffin’s performance early in the year after missing an entire season and having to have major surgery. Combine that with competing with Kaman for inside shots and rebounds, and I see Griffin disappointing a lot of people early in the year.
Another point against the Clippers, that factored very heavily in my thinking but that I didn’t bother to write, is that they’re not going to have Marcus Camby anymore. Offense aside, his rebounding and defense are going to be very hard to replace; a healthy Griffin will pick up most (though probably not all) of that rebounding slack, but even in college he wasn’t a standout defender.
"Where hope goes to die"
And regarding New Orleans...
I might be overstating this issue, but I really do not like that 2 of the Hornets’ best three players are both point guards. Most of what the Hornets gain from Chris Paul is going to be offset by a decline in Collison’s production – and I’d be shocked if Paul put up another 20-10 season this year.
Meanwhile, Stojakovic remains in decline, and David West’s best years are probably behind him.
"Where hope goes to die"
And NO was 23-22 last year with Chris Paul.
"Where hope goes to die"
A solid response as far as the Clips go. I wasn’t factoring in the loss of Camby.
I’m still not convinced that NO slides and I’m not convinced that Memphis slides by 10 games without a major injury, but my hat is still off to you. It is incredibly easy to try to poke holes in positions that other people take (what I did it my comment above). It is much harder to take a stand and justify it well (what you did above). And if my only real quibble with your whole stance was that you were being too optimistic, then you need to work a little harder to justify your signature line.
I like a decent build-up before the major letdown.
I don’t see this core every making the playoffs, honestly.
"Where hope goes to die"
You should do this as a "Rank 'em" FanPost
You could literally cut and paste your text, and then the community could provide their rankings in the thread. This is usually a good thing to do as we creep closer to the season, but most of the free agent movement is complete, so now would be a pretty good time. Whether or not you move forward with this, rec’d.
SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!
I lack the confidence and self-esteem to pull THAT off.
Just look at my signature.
"Where hope goes to die"
Find the strength.
EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter
No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....
I agree with Section. This would be a excellent FanPost.
Have the confidence to do it. This would be a great one for the community to respond to.
Just do it. – Nike
If you want to be your best, you have to do your best, otherwise you are only second rate.
You have more wasta than any of us.
If you initiate something like this, it will get a much better response.
Make this into a draft-style free T-shirt contest. At some point before the season, have people rank the Western conference in order of finish. Make the Kings’ place in the conference worth 5 points and every other team worth one point. Let the Kings’ record be the first tie breaker and DMC’s ppg be the second tie breaker. Tabulate responses from the comments and let the winner have mad bragging rights once the season’s over.
I can’t make this happen. npag lacks the confidence and self-esteem to make this happen. You can make this happen.
I think Dallas is a little low.
"Morrison beats Casspi 1 on 1". - MarcusC
by Surprise Team on Jul 29, 2010 10:22 AM PDT up reply actions
They don't have a single player whom I would trust not to continue going downhill next season.
"Where hope goes to die"
Good point.
But Beaubois on the one hand, against Dirk, Kidd, Terry, etc. on the other?
"Where hope goes to die"
I agree about the interconference parity, that's why I believe your wins spread is too wide.
In the Northwest, only the division winner is likely to win 50+ games again. And, the division winner will be the team that finishes the season with the fewest injuries in the frontcourt.
Portland is set to challenge for the division championship. They added depth at SG with Matthews & Williams. And, depth at SF with Babbitt. But, everything depends on the health of Oden & Przybilla. If one of them can make it through the season injury free, this is your division winner 52-30
Denver wasn’t able to add any size to their frontcourt, & they’ll need Nene, Martin & Anderson to stay healthy. But, they didn’t lose anyone and added Harrington. 50-32
OKC did add Aldrich and 3 guards. And, I expect Harden to step up his game. I expect that reality will set in for OKC and parity will bring them back too earth, plus they will have to experience another season free of injuries. 48-34
Utah lost Boozer, Matthews & Korver and Okur will miss the start of the season due to injury. So, Jefferson will be starting at Center and Millsap at PF. Jefferson wasn’t able to help Minny playing center, and Utah’s lack of Height on the frontcourt will definitely lose them 6 more games. 46-36
The Southwest is definitely the strongest division, with all 5 teams more than likely close to or better than .500.
Dallas replaced Dampier with Chandler and resigned Haywood. And, they added Jones to one of the best backcourts in the West. Here is your Division winner and challenger for the best record in the West 56-26
Houston added Miller & Patterson & resigned Scola and Lowry. With Yao returning and possibly making this his final year before retirement, I expect that they limit his minutes and save him for the playoffs. If so, here is your #4 team in the playoffs. 51-31
The Spurs lost no one, but added very little with the exception of Splitter. But, it’s still Duncan, Parker and Ginobili and a coach named Pops. 49-33
In the Pacific last season, three teams were the whipping boys for the entire conference, this year it will be four teams.
LA made just enough tweaks to stay on top of the Conference, but the rest of the conference got better with the exception of Minny, NOH, GS & Phx. Dallas will challenge them for the conference title. 56-26
Suns lost Amare and it’s unlikely that Hedo & Lopez can make up the difference. Plus how much longer can Nash play with that back problem? The Suns still finish 2nd in the Pacific, but not well enough to win a playoff berth. 45-37
The Kings won’t make it to .500 but neither will GS or the Clippers. My gut tells be Cousins will have a impressive rookie season, but that Dalembert will have a greater impact on the team because of what he adds to the interior defense. The defense will keep us in more games and hold on to more leads in the 4th quarter. The biggest question marks are concerning the backcourt. Which Beno will we see, the 2009/10 Beno or the 2008/09 Beno? And, will Tyreke’s outside game improve enough to make the pick & roll a real threat. I think all areas of the Kings game improves. 38-44
"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy
Just being able to throw it inside when we need to
even if we don’t always succeed will make the offense less suseptible to prolonged slumps, especially in end of game situations.
Dal will improve our interior D without question, which will limit the layup drills that continue to be run on us, though that area was marginally better last season.
A true defensive presence should give all the other bigs Dal plays with good opportunities to be more effective. We should be a top 5-10 rebounding team.
Tyreke’s shot will be better – but still a work in progress. The pick and roll will be a 50-50 threat.
We’ll win lot more of those close (5 pt) games.
Cousins will look very good, but will also turn the ball over a lot for now. His ‘give and goes’ from the post to Tyreke and others will bring many a smile to our faces once Tyreke realizes he can get to the basket without the ball.
Casspi will look like the Dec. Casspi more often than not but will still get outmuscled and out veteraned fairly often.
Jeter will be good off the bench.
Yes, much depends on which Beno shows up this year and if a healthy Cisco can be ‘good’ Cisco more often than not.
My summer prediction is 37-45
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Jul 29, 2010 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions
All I care about is the Kings record, and you've validated that somewhat.
EGO BOOST!!!! >:-O
"Where hope goes to die"
That was directed @ HT, but same goes for you, LTTG.
"Where hope goes to die"
We'll be a lottery team again
maybe from picks 8-14 this time. I just dont see Boogie and Sammy making that big of difference. But 2011-12 is a different story.
"And Solskjaer has won it!"
by 'tough as nails' spence on Jul 29, 2010 10:22 PM PDT reply actions
And the A's in Sac
We’d draw just as well.
So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii
by lietothegirls on Aug 3, 2010 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
In Association With
Ball Don't Lie - NBA - Yahoo! Sport
- Days of NBA Lives: Wherein Shane Battier knocks Greg Ostertag
- A preview of Tom Thibodeau’s All-Star coaching style
- The Three-Point Shootout participants have been named
- Jeremy Lin finally gets a new apartment, and a place in NBA history
- Wizards owner Ted Leonsis takes a needless swipe at his team’s fan bloggers
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
