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Around SBN: Explaining Jeremy Lin's Early, Surprising Success

I wouldn't say there's any clarity at all right now. I think it's a wide open competition. I don't look at just Omri and Donte' as contenders for that spot. I think that Antoine Wright and Cisco (Garcia) could play that spot, and also I want to see if either Jason and or Carl can play a little at that spot. There's a lot of different ways we can go, and we're going to give them all an opportunity to make their case there.

over 1 year ago Loofie_tiny Tom Ziller 129 comments 0 recs  | 

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Wright? Seriously?

Cousins is good but he's no mana from heaven.

by kingme on Aug 31, 2010 1:18 PM PDT reply actions  

Meh

He just wants to include all his bench players in his conversation to make them feel better.

by CloudyEyes on Aug 31, 2010 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

Right

Ask Desmond Mason. Oh, wait…

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Aug 31, 2010 3:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

Btw, I'm watching Omri's feature video right now

I think I’m switching to Team Omri

Cousins is good but he's no mana from heaven.

by kingme on Aug 31, 2010 1:19 PM PDT reply actions  

Lol, I was re-watching this too today around 1 o'clock

But Doratio Kane is still my fave

" 1 + 1 = 3 " - David Kahn

by Shizzo on Aug 31, 2010 7:28 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

So much for a consistant rotation

F#ck Kobe Bryant.
F#ck Shaquille O’Neal
F#ck Phil Jackson
F#ck Rick Fox (twice)
F#ck Sasha Vujacic
F#ck Robert Horry
F#ck Derek Fisher
F#ck Dick Bavetta, Bob Delaney and Ted Bernhardt – I’m still waiting for them to have their jerseys retired at Staples.
F#ck Every Laker fan who comes to Arco Arena, wears his hat sideways and stands up and cheers with his arms out and his back to the floor whenever Kobe scores a basket.
Oh, and F#ck Jack Nicholson, Dyan Cannon, and that silver haired douchebag wearing the snakeskin boots.

Who’d I miss?

by B-RAD on Aug 31, 2010 1:21 PM PDT via mobile reply actions  

Yeah, my reaction exactly

it seems like another season with rotation experiments. Great.

Dunking Dutchman

by RikSmits on Aug 31, 2010 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

The entire next season is going to be one big experiment

We got so many bigs clogging up minutes at the 4 and 5 that some of those PFs will need to shift into SF/PF.

by CloudyEyes on Aug 31, 2010 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

None of our bigs should be playing any SF

F#ck Kobe Bryant.
F#ck Shaquille O’Neal
F#ck Phil Jackson
F#ck Rick Fox (twice)
F#ck Sasha Vujacic
F#ck Robert Horry
F#ck Derek Fisher
F#ck Dick Bavetta, Bob Delaney and Ted Bernhardt – I’m still waiting for them to have their jerseys retired at Staples.
F#ck Every Laker fan who comes to Arco Arena, wears his hat sideways and stands up and cheers with his arms out and his back to the floor whenever Kobe scores a basket.
Oh, and F#ck Jack Nicholson, Dyan Cannon, and that silver haired douchebag wearing the snakeskin boots.

Who’d I miss?

by B-RAD on Aug 31, 2010 1:47 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

I'm not so sure about this-

Landry has shown that although he is not a great defender, he does have quick enough feet to stay in front of small forwards. Landry also has the ability to score on both bigger and smaller players. Maybe Landry isn’t a true small forward but I think he is close enough to a Corliss Williamson type small/power to steal some minutes in the same way that I think the Kings believe that both Casspi and Greene can steal some minutes at the 2.

The world is not your Trade Machine.

-Ziller

by jjham15 on Aug 31, 2010 5:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

link?

" 1 + 1 = 3 " - David Kahn

by Shizzo on Aug 31, 2010 7:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

Landry said he plans to improve his footwork and study film in hopes of being able to defend smaller players on the perimeter.

While Landry usually bangs his body against fellow power forwards on defense, he sees expanding his defensive skills as the next step in improving his overall play.

“A little bit,” Landry said by phone from Houston of his experience defending on the perimeter. “I’ve defended some of the bigger threes – Lamar Odom (of the Lakers), Shawn Marion (of Dallas). Smaller ones, not necessarily, but when there are bigger threes out there, I think I should be able to do that.”

Any discussion of a King improving on defense is always welcome around Arco Arena. The Kings allowed 104.4 points per game in 2009-10, sixth-most in the NBA.
And if Landry could defend bigger small forwards on a regular basis, it would give the Kings more lineup flexibility.



Read more: http://www.sacbee.com/2010/04/20/2690691/kings-landry-looking-to-upgrade.html#ixzz0yF4ObzN9

by PurpleLoco on Aug 31, 2010 7:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

thanks!

" 1 + 1 = 3 " - David Kahn

by Shizzo on Aug 31, 2010 7:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

Thanks for the assist!

"Live Long and Prosper." - Spock

by hozr on Sep 1, 2010 1:16 PM PDT up reply actions  

I didn't come away with that impression at all

Westphal also said this:

Last year was laying the groundwork for that. I think the groundwork is laid.

So, while I think we will see more rotation experiments I don’t think there will be as many.

"Live Long and Prosper." - Spock

by hozr on Aug 31, 2010 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

PW is a good coach for a young team

I like this quote±

I just know that as a player that the coaches that got the most out of me were the coaches who would live with a mistake every now and then. And as long as the effort and the will to win is there, which I never see as a problem with Tyreke, how are you going to expand your game if you don’t try things? And how are you going to work on what you need to work on?

Dunking Dutchman

by RikSmits on Aug 31, 2010 1:33 PM PDT reply actions  

A real good read through and through.

I like what Paul has to say about his young team and staff and would not read too much into the SF talk. I get the feeling it’s Greene and Casspi and that the rest is lip service.

Sound the trumpets, Raise the drawbridge, and drop the Oldsmobile

by Balky Needs on Aug 31, 2010 2:16 PM PDT reply actions  

Please don't try JT at the 3 again.

Carl is a different story. I think his quickness and athleticism would actually allow him to guard Small Forwards better than he does Power Forwards. And on offense he could go inside or outside, simply bully a lot of the NBA’s Small Forwards. I think its worth a shot to try him there. Now that would really stir things up. He’d actually be a little above average at rebounding for a 3. Imagine a line-up of Reke, Cisco, Carl, JT, Dalembert.

Author of the Pick and Scroll. Follow me on Twitter here.

by Aykis16 on Aug 31, 2010 2:18 PM PDT reply actions  

I agree with you that Carl can play the 3

But I don’t see Cisco filling in the 2. You have to play your best players the most minutes, thus we should see Reke, Casspi, Landry, DMC, Sammy with the most minutes. This lineup offers a nice combo of defense and scoring. Beno and Casspi are interchangeable depending on opposing lineups.

by Sactown's Finest on Aug 31, 2010 2:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yea, but can he hit the corner 3?

That’s always been a big part of being a SF on the Kings, and Landry is 2-7 from 3-pt range for his career.

"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy

by HighTops on Aug 31, 2010 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I think the plan is that he would only be a SF on defense

"Cousins is the Blaster to Evans’ Master, the Hammer to Evans’ Sickle"- HP

by tomroadrunner on Aug 31, 2010 3:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

So, on offense he'd switch with JT, Dalembert or Cousins, much better plan.

"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy

by HighTops on Aug 31, 2010 6:34 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Well I don't like the idea at all.

No way Carl has a better game away from the rim than Casspi or Donte. They’re better outside shooters and better slashers. And, they both can defend the SF better than Carl, although there are a few SF’s in the league that Carl might be able to manhandle. All in all, I think the whole suggestion is typical double speak to imply that the job is wide open. when in truth it isn’t.

The only questions left to be answered are: Will Carl start over JT? Will Donte start over Omri? Will Tyreke play enough minutes at the 2, to allow Jeter to get some decent rotation minutes?

We saw enough of players playing out of their natural position over the last 2 seasons because of injuries and not having enough depth. Well, we finally have enough depth, and it would be stupid to play guys out of position when you don’t have to.

"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy

by HighTops on Sep 1, 2010 5:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

I agree with most of this

There are a few teams, a few SFs where I think it’s actually possible he might even start (doubts) but it’s a specialty move because of the lack of outside game.

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Sep 1, 2010 6:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't see why these comments are in reply to my post.

I wasn’t supporting the idea, I was just saying that the only way that it could work would be to have Carl just defending 3s, but on offense still going into the post. It would mess up the balance, considering that we need to spread the floor more, but it’s the only option I could see if they were ever to trot out Carl at the 3.

I agree, guys should be getting a little bit more concrete in their roles on the team, not shuffling around to cause mismatches at the expense of cohesion.

"Cousins is the Blaster to Evans’ Master, the Hammer to Evans’ Sickle"- HP

by tomroadrunner on Sep 1, 2010 7:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

Don't take it personally, you started out answering my comment Akyis

But you did say

I’m not saying it’s a great plan, I was just sharing my interpretation

And, I responded that

Well I don’t like the idea at all.

I never said it was your plan. All I was doing is giving a reason why I didn’t like it.

"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy

by HighTops on Sep 1, 2010 11:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

Guards

I thought it was interesting that he said he was pretty sure that he saw the backcourt with Reke and Beno as the starters. There has been a lot talk of Cisco at the 2 lately. Maybe, he just feels like Beno earned the starting nod and Cisco will need to take it away in camp and preseason.

by Kusian on Aug 31, 2010 2:22 PM PDT reply actions  

I agree.

But I think Cisco will take it back by the season opener.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Aug 31, 2010 2:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

You need to have a thing before you can take it back.

Udrih is a better shooter, so he’s your shooting guard. I was surprised to find that Beno only averages 1 less rebound per game in his career than Garcia, not that either one of them is exactly a rebounding machine, or necessarily needs to be.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

But

Garcia can guard the 2 and! If u start Beno then Reke can’t take advantage of the smaller PG guarding him, at lease with Garcia we at least have a height advantage if the other teams SG guard Reke

by shadowchicken on Aug 31, 2010 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

By that logic, we should start Dalembert at the 2. Think of how hard it would be to get a 3-pointer away with Sammy in your face.

Or instead, we can play Sam down low, which will allow whomever is playing perimeter defense to play the ball more closely, because it won’t be a layup drill if their guard gets past ours.

Garcia is taller and a better defender than Beno. Beno is a better shooting guard than Garcia.

Save the Garcia man-love thing for Westphal, he’s the head coach, and the one who said all things being equal, the job looks to go back to the starter. In any case, as soon as we have a better option, both of them will be coming off the bench.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Did you not see him Garcia 2 seasons ago?

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Aug 31, 2010 4:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yes, which is why I don't romanticize him.

Good player, solid backup, nothing to build a team around or desire as a starter. The same can be said for Beno, although in his handful of starts at the point, he really had some spectacular games.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

Does every starter need to be an All-Star?

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

Of course not.

They should, one would hope, at least above-average as NBA talent goes.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well yeah.....

….which means Derek Fisher should have never played in a NBA game. Just saying…..

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I suspect his stats would be better had he not spent most of his career with guys like Shaq & Kobe.

You may also find the remaining Cavaliers players stats get a nice bump with what’s-his-face in Florida. If Garcia was going to really be one to watch we’d have seen it by now. He’s had his opportunities.

Again, the guy doesn’t suck. He’s just not a starter in the NBA.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

And?

Your point?

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

The point:

I don’t see why certain people insist that Garcia is a better option at the 2 than Beno, when the head coach doesn’t think that, and the last season proved Beno complements Evans very nicely.

People are entitled to their own beliefs, but not their own facts.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Okay we agree on this point.

But I disagree with the point that Garcia has no value too.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

Please tell me where I said he had no value.

Not overvaluing him isn’t the same as saying he’s worthless.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Not saying you were saying he's worthless.

I don’t think it’s overvalue exactly but simply the wrong kind of assessment with regards to Cisco. Just my opinion here tho…

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

Fair enough, pook

But this team needs more tangibles than intangibles right now.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well.....I think you've overstating that too.

Every team needs role players like Garcia.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

Or overstating that^

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

Role players are great.

Less so as starters. I know people think of Doug Christie as a role player, but he could easily have gone for 20 a night with his athleticism and skill set. I see little comparison between the two players.

Ideally, Beno is a role player, too, he’s just the best option the team has right now.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well this team isn't as old as the 01-03 Kings teams were.

There is time to find that player IMO.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

Know this Andy,

If it had been Beno that had gotten injured last year, and Garcia was the Point-2 all year, you’d be saying how great he is. He is better than Beno.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Aug 31, 2010 5:23 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I'm impressed that in the face of all statistical proof, that you cling to what you believe.

If I was a different kind of person, I could have all of your cash in my pocket in 3 months.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

I bet you can't run faster than Casey.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

I could manage the entire thing via phone and email.

Because there’s one born every minute.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

LOL

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

Top shelf.

You not only try to attack the argument, but the person! A pincer attack! Great stuff.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Aug 31, 2010 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

You made no argument.

“Garcia is better” isn’t an argument. It’s an assertion that you cannot back up with facts.

The larger point still stands, which is that neither of them is likely to be a starter when the Kings next have a playoff game.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

They're both non-starters.

Garcia is the better SG. He’s a better defender, better 3 point shooter, creative passer, feisty leader.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Aug 31, 2010 6:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

Oh and for the personal attack:

you suck.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Aug 31, 2010 6:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

I guess Westphal indicated Beno would likely start because of

spins wheel

Oh, let’s just say racism.

Happy now?

And please, while you’re making up things to assert, could you please remind me how many triple doubles Garcia has had?

Because, you know, he’s better.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 7:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hey sims, while you're ultra-available;

Can you tell me if the new station is available via ipod app? I’d like to check it out.

Sound the trumpets, Raise the drawbridge, and drop the Oldsmobile

by Balky Needs on Aug 31, 2010 7:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

Never mind brah, the answer was obvious.

/falls on sword

Sound the trumpets, Raise the drawbridge, and drop the Oldsmobile

by Balky Needs on Aug 31, 2010 7:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

It's not obvious to me. Nothing is.

I’ve been using Tunemark, and Shoutcast has also improved a great deal.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 7:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

You're right.

Whiteside is better than DMC too. And Beno for that matter.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Aug 31, 2010 10:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

Beno starting (tentatively)

has nothing to do with Garcia being injured almost all last year.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Aug 31, 2010 10:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Beno successfully playing alongside Tyreke had nothing to do with Garcia being injured almost all of last year.

I also get the feeling you are forgetting Kevin Martin’s injury which likely is the biggest reason why Beno got to start. I doubt you can say that you know Westphal would have started Garcia over Beno, especially considering how well Beno did end up playing along side Tyreke.

Because talent? You want to add a guy like boozer because hes talented? I’m sorry i just don’t see that as a valid reason. -- fffindeed

by wallywagon11 on Sep 1, 2010 9:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

Didn't like how this comment came out

Basically Kevin Martin’s injury opened up minutes in the backcourt (plus Desmond Mason’s suckitude). If Garcia was around Beno would still have had opportunities to succeed.

Basically regardless of Garcia Beno would have gotten the minutes to show something given there are 96 minutes in the backcourt. Beno’s minuteslast year had very little to do with Garcia’s injury and his success playing next to Tyreke has nothing to do with Garcia.

Because talent? You want to add a guy like boozer because hes talented? I’m sorry i just don’t see that as a valid reason. -- fffindeed

by wallywagon11 on Sep 1, 2010 9:27 AM PDT up reply actions  

I honestly have no idea what you're talking about anymore.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Sep 1, 2010 6:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

You don’t remember saying how Beno is better than Garcia because he had a triple double?

Whiteside has had 3.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Sep 1, 2010 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

in college

Because talent? You want to add a guy like boozer because hes talented? I’m sorry i just don’t see that as a valid reason. -- fffindeed

by wallywagon11 on Sep 1, 2010 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

and if Whiteside gets 3 triple doubles in the NBA this year

Then sign me up for the “Whiteside is better than DMC too. And Beno for that matter.” camp.

Because talent? You want to add a guy like boozer because hes talented? I’m sorry i just don’t see that as a valid reason. -- fffindeed

by wallywagon11 on Sep 1, 2010 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

Its funny but I can see him getting that before Garcia this year.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Sep 1, 2010 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

better 3 point shooter

Is he really better than Beno in 3 point shooting?

creative passer

Is he? I always thought Garcia was a bit overrated in this regard.

Because talent? You want to add a guy like boozer because hes talented? I’m sorry i just don’t see that as a valid reason. -- fffindeed

by wallywagon11 on Sep 1, 2010 8:54 AM PDT up reply actions  

Only time Cisco got creative with the ball,

it cost him the season.

/ba-dump-bump

Sound the trumpets, Raise the drawbridge, and drop the Oldsmobile

by Balky Needs on Sep 1, 2010 8:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

Perhaps you & Andy could meet at the Roseville Galleria and duke it out for supremacy.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'm not allowed in the Galleria

Last time I was there, I put a guy into a coma who thought Kevin Martin was soft.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:46 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

You're soft Sims.

Only a fraidy cat would fear a 3rd strike.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:47 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I'm too pretty to go to prison.

Again.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions   2 recs

That's probably a good thing. I think.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'd just be happy I could never go to the Galleria

People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~ Rogers Hornsby

by otis29 on Aug 31, 2010 5:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

All malls are created equal. They all suck.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 6:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

this thread cracked me up

Because talent? You want to add a guy like boozer because hes talented? I’m sorry i just don’t see that as a valid reason. -- fffindeed

by wallywagon11 on Aug 31, 2010 7:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Did you forget Fisher played for Golden State & Utah?

He was terrible & wasn’t even good enough to be a starter on Utah postSstockton & pre-Williams. Golden State gave him a big contract thinking he was going to be their starting PG & ended up trading for Baron Davis. If anything Shaq & Kobe makes Fisher look better. Which still only makes him a very mediocre to below average player.

I love beating dead horses.

by allbenji's on Aug 31, 2010 4:51 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

I didn't come here to defend Derek Fisher.

I don’t know why anyone would. I simply don’t understand the reflexive outcry when someone points out that Garcia isn’t the best option as shooting guard.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

What I don't understand is the outcry over the need to have a star to pair with Tyreke Evans.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 4:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

A star isn't necessary. An above-average talent as your starter is sufficient.

Or lacking that, someone who has a ton of potential to get better.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:02 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'd be happy with a Lamar Odom type personally.

Which is harder to get than people realize.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

I see Garcia and Udrih as equals more or less

I like Beno, and was glad to see him rebound last season – but he’s not a worldbeater IMO. And he’s only 6 months younger than Cisco.

So we kind of have an idea of what we get with Beno and Tyreke – I’d love to see what a healthy Garcia (again, I think a healthy Garcia is every bit as good as Beno) brings to the backcourt when paired with Tyreke.

Regardless, both of these guys are going to get substantial minutes. But the team’s trying to find the right backcourt compliment to Tyreke, and Garcia is quite possibly the right fit.

People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~ Rogers Hornsby

by otis29 on Aug 31, 2010 5:22 PM PDT up reply actions   2 recs

Your first paragraph is something I really agree with.

I agree about the 2nd paragraph. (It’s also why I don’t think it matters greatly if Kevin Martin was around either. But this is a side point.)

The 3rd paragraph is where you’re on the money with regards to Garcia.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

Talent and skill

are two different things. Fisher has five rings. I’d say he’s a pretty capable point guard.

"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal

by NewEraKings on Aug 31, 2010 7:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

Mark Madsen has two rings

Which makes him better than Dwight Howard.

SACTOWN ROYALTY - Try our thick creamy shakes!

by section214 on Aug 31, 2010 9:04 PM PDT up reply actions   2 recs

Fisher earned his

Madsen waved a towel. Logic fail.

I said Fisher was a capable point guard, not a first ballot Hall of Famer. If he doesn’t hit that big three late agianst Boston, maybe he and Kobe only have four rings.

"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal

by NewEraKings on Aug 31, 2010 10:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

I dunno

On a team with a bunch of weapons I think Garcia isn’t a bad option. He can shoot, play D, decent ball handler and passer. Kinda like Doug Christie

Can't wait for October

by KingsFanInPortland on Aug 31, 2010 6:05 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

Better shooter? Too close to call,

Garcia/Udrih 443/458 370/358 803/824

There are some guys smarter than me, some guys better looking, I take comfort in the fact that there is no guy that is both.

by ElRonToro on Aug 31, 2010 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

Okay, so only on field goals and free throws.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well ya got a damn convincing point there.

I’m just thinking if Cisco has been so bashed up the last 2 years the gap would be less if he’s healthy. You get kinda snarky when you state something that is really only marginally tenable, and in reality an opinion and not a fact..
I quality I like when I’m not the target.

There are some guys smarter than me, some guys better looking, I take comfort in the fact that there is no guy that is both.

by ElRonToro on Aug 31, 2010 5:00 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

It would be tough to deny the snark, admittedly.

I’d still say the facts are what they are, though. And the larger fact is that barring something like the Carmelo trade, this team isn’t playoff-bound with Beno or Garcia starting at the 2.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

This team isn't playoff bound because of the youth and the tough games out West.

It has nothing to do with Cisco/Beno starting at the 2.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

Lack of talent will keep you out of the playoffs.

And in all likelihood, several games below .500.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

No

The Kings are not above average at several position including the 2,3,4 & 5. Let’s not forget that.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think they are above average at the 4

Above average at the 1 and average at the 2 and 5. And they have potential and decent production already at the 3. They could be an average NBA team this year.

"I know we certainly gave up a lot to get him, but we do have other players on the perimeter who we can plug in. We haven’t had anybody who we feel is a go-to guy in the post. So we gave up a lot to get a lot, and we’re real excited about adding Carl." - Paul Westphal

by NewEraKings on Aug 31, 2010 10:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

But that's the thing

I don’t consider either Cisco or Beno as lacking in talent – if they are the best players on your roster, well yes you are probably not a very good team. But their talents can be easily translatable on a very good team – it just depends on what “better” talent is around them.

People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring. ~ Rogers Hornsby

by otis29 on Aug 31, 2010 5:30 PM PDT up reply actions   3 recs

This.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

I agree that if Beno or Cisco is starting

you are probably not ready for prime time unless you have Howard and Paul on your team. I think they are players who belong in the 8 man rotation of 80/90% of the teams in the league.

There are some guys smarter than me, some guys better looking, I take comfort in the fact that there is no guy that is both.

by ElRonToro on Aug 31, 2010 5:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

That.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 5:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

Looking at the stats comparison, one isn’t standing out over the other. So I instead go by how they play on the floor offensively and defensively and I think Garcia wins that one. ESPECIALLY after Tyreke’s continued improvements in 3point shooting and assists.

"We're not talking about me and Darko in the same sentence." - Chris Webber vs KAHN!

by caseycheesecake on Sep 1, 2010 9:51 AM PDT up reply actions  

What year in the future are you in, and how is the weather there?
ESPECIALLY after Tyreke’s continued improvements in 3point shooting and assists.

My problem, apparently, is that I can’t see the future where Tyreke has already shot 34% from 3-point range, thus relegating Beno’s higher FG% less valuable than Garcia’s lower FG%.

So I instead go by how they play on the floor offensively and defensively and I think Garcia wins that one.

I guess given the statistics available to us non-H.G. Wells-types, and Beno’s excellent complementary chemistry with Evans, why do you think that? And why should any stock be placed in your feelings? I understand you like Garcia better, I just don’t see why you’d think that was a basis for making a decision like this, especially since the head coach (what does he know?) disagrees with you.

My point is that Westphal’s stance at this early juncture is sensible and justified. You simply haven’t backed up your position with anything other than gut feelings, and if we’re allowed to do that, along with fortune-telling, I guess I’ll throw out there that Beno’s defense improved dramatically in 2010-2011 with Dalembert and Cousins behind him instead of Hawes.

That’s some bright future! Now, where did I leave my sunglasses?

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Sep 1, 2010 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'm confused

Did Tyreke’s 3 point shooting and assist percentage improve a lot in the second half of the season and I just wasn’t aware?

Because talent? You want to add a guy like boozer because hes talented? I’m sorry i just don’t see that as a valid reason. -- fffindeed

by wallywagon11 on Sep 1, 2010 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

Actually, Evans 3pt shot was still below 30% in Feb & Mar

but his assist per game did jump to 7.0 and 7.5 repectively

"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy

by HighTops on Sep 1, 2010 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'm sorry

But i don’t want Carl at the 3. I like is inside game and is ability to take his game away from the basket giving room for DMC to take the defender 1v1. Can’t leave Carl open at the elbow, can’t leave Greene or Reke open at the 3pt line….

by shadowchicken on Aug 31, 2010 3:41 PM PDT reply actions  

Big Nasty Top Hat?

I certainly don’t want to see JT at the 3 anymore, or Wright of course. But I wouldn’t mind trying Landry there in the pre-season and early season to see if he could play a Corliss style of 3. I think he could put up similar #‘s with his post game, and if you question if he can provide the same toughness I would suggest you ask Dirk’s elbow.

Kings fan in OKC

by rockrichmond2 on Aug 31, 2010 4:08 PM PDT reply actions  

Corliss could be a great comparison

Landry is actually even a better rebounder than Corliss was, and much more efficient as a scorer.

Author of the Pick and Scroll. Follow me on Twitter here.

by Aykis16 on Aug 31, 2010 4:14 PM PDT up reply actions  

Sure, there's no rule that says your SF has to be a 3-point threat.

I know that’s the way the game has evolved, but having Landry spend minutes there in some combination of Dalembert, Cousins, JT and Whiteside at the 4 & 5 would be rough for a lot of teams to defend.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Aug 31, 2010 4:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

SF hitting 3s is important in todays game

So imitate the action of the tiger!.
Lend the eye a terrible aspect
- and teach them how to war!
Henry V iii

by lietothegirls on Sep 1, 2010 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

We're merely saying it isn't critical for 48 minutes a game to have a sharpshooter at the 3.

And in certain matchups, having three bigs in could pay dividends.

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Sep 1, 2010 7:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

Absolutely true, but

how many times have we heard the comment that we need to spread the floor for Tyreke to open up the lane. So, for the 36-38 mpg that Tyreke is on the floor it’s probably necessary. Unless Evans starts shooting 40% from the arc himself. Other wise we have no one on the frontcourt who can shoot 3’s and our PG can’t hit them. Which means the lanes going to be packed and we only have a SG hitting from outside.

Maybe there’s an advantage on defense, but there’s two ends to the court. And, sometime have someone who plays both ends reasonably well is better, than have a guy that is very good at one end and marginally good at the other. Your not going to have an advantage a every position at both ends of the court. Accept your weaknesses and take advantage of your strengths.

"If you don't have anything good to say, LIE" - Mom
The greatest impact player in NBA History - Tim Donaghy

by HighTops on Sep 2, 2010 12:11 AM PDT up reply actions  

No argument

But when Evans is out of the game for the 10-12 minutes he’s bound to get, if even for 5 or 6 minutes, you just throw that look at the other team, it might present a curveball to the opposition. Hell, you can run Evans at SF with Garcia/Beno/Jeter/_______ in the back court, which might leave things quite wide open for Tyreke to do his thing.

I suppose the overall concept for me is to have five ballplayers with complementary skills, and not be concerned so much about position, at least on the offensive end. In small bursts, if you have Dalembert & Cousins as your bigs, Evans, Beno & Garcia in, I really don’t think we’re going to get killed on the boards, or defensively.

Obviously none of us knows anything until we know anything, but I feel like the new guys are going to allow Westphal a lot more flexibility in what he does. A myriad of lineups doesn’t bother me as much as it seems to bother others. This isn’t Adelman’s “Obvious Eight” that used to wreck opposing squads. There’s still so much unknown, and if the Maloofs see fit to pay guys like Whiteside and Jeter, I’d like to see them on the floor. I assume Westphal wants to see what assets he has, and I’m pleased the Maloofs extended his deal, so he can operate with more breathing room.

In any case, I don’t envision a backslide in wins, and I don’t expect .500 or playoffs. I do expect to have a much clearer picture of what the next several years will look like by next summer, and I expect to feel pretty good about it.

You know, in time for the lockout. Dammit…

Rocks are free, and slingshots easily stolen. And for a limited time, every third person who follows me on Twitter (andy_sims) gets a free ice cream cone.

Which I will eat.

by andy sims on Sep 2, 2010 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Good points here
I suppose the overall concept for me is to have five ballplayers with complementary skills, and not be concerned so much about position, at least on the offensive end.

But then you have to see how you cope at the defensive end. Mismatches at one end often creates mismatches at the other end. So then it becomes the question of which mismatch will lead to more points.

In any case, I don’t envision a backslide in wins, and I don’t expect .500 or playoffs. I do expect to have a much clearer picture of what the next several years will look like by next summer, and I expect to feel pretty good about it.

Well said. I agree a 100%.

Dunking Dutchman

by RikSmits on Sep 2, 2010 1:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

L-Train too

for those of us old enough to remember…L-Train had a nice, back-to-the-basket game.

by longtimelistenerfirsttimecaller on Aug 31, 2010 5:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

As long as Landry doesn't shoot 3's....

…I don’t really have a problem with him guarding the “3” position.

EvilCowtownInc: Screwin Suckaz over since 1985...... On Twitter

No mistakes in the tango, Donna. Not like life. Simple. That's what makes the tango so great. If you make a mistake, and get all tangled up, you just tango on.....

by pookeyguru on Aug 31, 2010 5:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

My lineup:

PG – Reke PG/SG – Beno
SG – Casspi
SF – Greene SF/SG – Garcia
PF – DMC PF – Landry
C – Dally C – JT

I’ve always thought of Beno as an energy guy, so I’d put him on the bench. While I like Garcia’s ball handling and vision, I’d give the slight edge to Greene for his defense and rounded game. I also think of Landry as an energy guy off the bench (heck, that’s how he became popular), so I’d keep him behind DMC. Even though DMC doesn’t have much experience, he can rebound, score, and give Dally a lot of good looks at the rim, due to his passing. Don’t think I need to say much about Dally.

by CloudyEyes on Aug 31, 2010 7:15 PM PDT reply actions  

Casspi won't be able to guard most 2's

He may shoot over them, overpower them on the way to the rim or post them up, only to see them blow past him on the other side. I think you can only play him at the 2 when he’s opposite SG’s who have trouble taking the ball to the rim.

Dunking Dutchman

by RikSmits on Aug 31, 2010 10:03 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I think people are reading Westphals comments too much

I think what hes saying is DMC is gonna get minutes, or at least there are gonna be more minutes up for grabs at 4-5!

by Slikk_J on Sep 1, 2010 5:05 AM PDT reply actions  

All this rotation talk has me thinking

why doesn’t PW do it the way we did on my rec teams, when your subbed out you went to the end of the bench, waited 5 minutes before you came in for whoever was on the floor the longest. Should work for the Kings.

There are some guys smarter than me, some guys better looking, I take comfort in the fact that there is no guy that is both.

by ElRonToro on Sep 1, 2010 9:06 PM PDT reply actions  

I like it

let’s give them all trophies at the end of the season too.

by betweentheeyes on Sep 2, 2010 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

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